2017 General Election thread

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

Don't tell me you read it in the Guardian.

If you work in the building trade for example your wages are lower than they were 12 years ago. If your an emergency worker your wages are lower than they were 10 years ago (1% rise but lose an allowance is actually a pay cut).

If your a Banker, Landlord or human rights lawyer then your wages have increased. If your an MP your wages have increased (11% rise one year).

Maybe you should get out and about a bit more and speak to people you might be surprised to find that even reamainers aren't buying the "we can't survive without all the immigrants" propaganda.

Besides the Labour party want to end freedom of movement and JC is the man we can all trust and we absolutely know he won't let us down.

the choice at the GE was Tory or Labour. To vote for either in order to reduce immigration would be pointless - May promised to reduce net immigration to tens of thousands for 7 years running yet it hit record levels. Literally pointless basing a vote for either party if immigration reduction is your aim. Crashing the economy reduces immigration, that is the only route that has been effective.

 

[rigsby]

the choice at the GE was Tory or Labour. To vote for either in order to reduce immigration would be pointless - May promised to reduce net immigration to tens of thousands for 7 years running yet it hit record levels. Literally pointless basing a vote for either party if immigration reduction is your aim. Crashing the economy reduces immigration, that is the only route that has been effective.

No it wasn't.

Labour have pledged to end the freedom of movement for EU citizens. If they now try weasel out of it then what next.....Sorry we have done the maths and you will still have to pay for your uni education. Or sorry we can't afford Trident because we spent all the money buying back the Rail and water companies.

 

[Firestorm]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-40354331

Summer fruit availability may be affected , unless all the indignant "foreigners stealing our jobs" brigade decide to actually do the jobs they have now got back

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

No it wasn't.

Labour have pledged to end the freedom of movement for EU citizens. If they now try weasel out of it then what next.....Sorry we have done the maths and you will still have to pay for your uni education. Or sorry we can't afford Trident because we spent all the money buying back the Rail and water companies.

I know you were voting for an independent but even if he ran an amazing campaign and won his seat he would not be forming a government. The choice on who would form a government was Labour (who when in power had high levels of immigration) or Conservative (who when in power had even higher levels of immigration but consistently lied that they would bring it down to tens of thousands).
Weird attitude insinuating that Labour would back track on their manifesto, when the Tories actually backtracked on their manifesto only yesterday.

So odd how you love to predict what one party would do, and ignore what the other party are actually doing.

 

[rigsby]

I know you were voting for an independent but even if he ran an amazing campaign and won his seat he would not be forming a government. The choice on who would form a government was Labour (who when in power had high levels of immigration) or Conservative (who when in power had even higher levels of immigration but consistently lied that they would bring it down to tens of thousands).
Weird attitude insinuating that Labour would back track on their manifesto, when the Tories actually backtracked on their manifesto only yesterday.

So odd how you love to predict what one party would do, and ignore what the other party are actually doing.

Lets make this nice and simple...Did Labour said they would end freedom of movement as part of their Brexit deal ?

Can you answer without mentioning the Tories.

 

[maninasuitcase]

Don't tell me you read it in the Guardian.

If you work in the building trade for example your wages are lower than they were 12 years ago. If your an emergency worker your wages are lower than they were 10 years ago (1% rise but lose an allowance is actually a pay cut).

If your a Banker, Landlord or human rights lawyer then your wages have increased. If your an MP your wages have increased (11% rise one year).

Maybe you should get out and about a bit more and speak to people you might be surprised to find that even reamainers aren't buying the "we can't survive without all the immigrants" propaganda.

Besides the Labour party want to end freedom of movement and JC is the man we can all trust and we absolutely know he won't let us down.

Nope, I don't read the Guardian, though I do listen to their Football Weekly podcast if that helps.

I checked on the Migration Observatory website for their research, as I quiet clearly mentioned.

Saying "Proving what us Brexitiers have known all along", etc does not make it a fact. It is just an opinion and proves nothing.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

Lets make this nice and simple...Did Labour said they would end freedom of movement as part of their Brexit deal ?

Can you answer without mentioning the Tories.

No one is saying freedom of movement will not end when we leave the EU - only you are casting doubt on that, and casting doubt on numerous other things with no good reason, and ignoring 7 years of broken promises and then a ditched manifesto - yesterday.
Yes I can choose to not make any reference to the Tories but as this is the GE thread and they trickled out their Queen's Speech yesterday and started their EU negotiations with another u-turn a couple of days before that, I choose not to ignore them at the very time that they demand the most scrutiny.

You may choose not to mention the Tories when they are having a bad day, but unfortunately that seems to be every day, so if you want to avoid criticisms of what the Tories are doing right now right here then maybe avoid the politics threads.

 

[rigsby]

No one is saying freedom of movement will not end when we leave the EU - only you are casting doubt on that, and casting doubt on numerous other things with no good reason, and ignoring 7 years of broken promises and then a ditched manifesto - yesterday.
Yes I can choose to not make any reference to the Tories but as this is the GE thread and they trickled out their Queen's Speech yesterday and started their EU negotiations with another u-turn a couple of days before that, I choose not to ignore them at the very time that they demand the most scrutiny.

You may choose not to mention the Tories when they are having a bad day, but unfortunately that seems to be every day, so if you want to avoid criticisms of what the Tories are doing right now right here then maybe avoid the politics threads.

You can't help making a fool of yourself can you.

I'm am one of the many ex Labour voters who have stopped JC from being PM you know like the others on here who you like to scream down. May was shocking and deserves to be booted out. Any previous Labour leader would have won the last GE. Shame its the sneering, insipid left who will guarantee the next Tory leader victory at the next GE.

 

[rigsby]

Nope, I don't read the Guardian, though I do listen to their Football Weekly podcast if that helps.

I checked on the Migration Observatory website for their research, as I quiet clearly mentioned.

Saying "Proving what us Brexitiers have known all along", etc does not make it a fact. It is just an opinion and proves nothing.

Shared by 75% of the population of Britain who want to see immigration reduced to manageable levels.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

You can't help making a fool of yourself can you.

I'm am one of the many ex Labour voters who have stopped JC from being PM you know like the others on here who you like to scream down. May was shocking and deserves to be booted out. Any previous Labour leader would have won the last GE. Shame its the sneering, insipid left who will guarantee the next Tory leader victory at the next GE.

making a fool in what way?

you have been an ex Labour voter for a very long time it seems - when was the last time you voted Labour and what was it that inspired you to do so?

 

[maninasuitcase]

Shared by 75% of the population of Britain who want to see immigration reduced to manageable levels.

See, you are doing it again. Where did you get the figure of 75% from? Have conducted a poll? What was the sample size?

I have absolutely no idea exactly how many people want to reduce immigration. And I certainly don't know if all of them believe that immigration forces down wages. And even if they do believe it is true, it still doesn't make it a fact if it isn't true, and the real research that I have read suggests it isn't or minimal at best.

 

[rigsby]

making a fool in what way?

you have been an ex Labour voter for a very long time it seems - when was the last time you voted Labour and what was it that inspired you to do so?

You couldn't manage to finish the first sentence without mentioning the Tories followed by your usual attempt to avoid subjects that are to difficult for you.

 

[rigsby]

See, you are doing it again. Where did you get the figure of 75% from? Have conducted a poll? What was the sample size?

I have absolutely no idea exactly how many people want to reduce immigration. And I certainly don't know if all of them believe that immigration forces down wages. And even if they do believe it is true, it still doesn't make it a fact if it isn't true, and the real research that I have read suggests it isn't or minimal at best.

Yes only your research from your source can be fact. Anyone else should be dismissed or denounced because less face it our liberal left are far more equal than others.

So do you think the 17m that voted out want immigration reduced.

 

[EastStandBlue]

Yes only your research from your source can be fact. Anyone else should be dismissed or denounced because less face it our liberal left are far more equal than others.

At least maninasuitcase's statistic is sourced. Where, pray tell, have you found that 75% of the British population wants immigration reduced?

 

[rigsby]

At least maninasuitcase's statistic is sourced. Where, pray tell, have you found that 75% of the British population wants immigration reduced?

Tommy Robison told me

 

[EastStandBlue]

So you made it up then.

Glad we've got that boxed off.

 

[maninasuitcase]

Yes only your research from your source can be fact. Anyone else should be dismissed or denounced because less face it our liberal left are far more equal than others.

So do you think the 17m that voted out want immigration reduced.

No, I quoted real research, done by real people working for a real organisation that is part of Oxford University.

You stated that 75% of the population wanted to reduce immigration, but did not back it up with a source. In this post you have quoted 17m people voted to leave the EU and therefore want to reduce immigration. This figure is correct. Unfortunately, 17m is only around 26% of the UK population. What happened to the other 49% from your earlier claim?

 

[rigsby]

No, I quoted real research, done by real people working for a real organisation that is part of Oxford University.

You stated that 75% of the population wanted to reduce immigration, but did not back it up with a source. In this post you have quoted 17m people voted to leave the EU and therefore want to reduce immigration. This figure is correct. Unfortunately, 17m is only around 26% of the UK population. What happened to the other 49% from your earlier claim?

You need to check out some other research, if you can lower yourself to that level. The figures are out there.

So only 25% of the population want to remain in the EU and half of them want immigration reduced. So maybe its more than 75% of the population. See how easy it is to hide behind stats when you don't have an argument.

 

[rigsby]

So you made it up then.

Glad we've got that boxed off.

I read it in the Daily Mail.

 

[maninasuitcase]

You need to check out some other research, if you can lower yourself to that level. The figures are out there.

So only 25% of the population want to remain in the EU and half of them want immigration reduced. So maybe its more than 75% of the population. See how easy it is to hide behind stats when you don't have an argument.

Yes very easy when you just pluck figures out of the air.