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Southend United manager Phil Brown defends decision to take off Jack Payne against Ox

I'm tired of our recent few years inability to turn our quality into promotion. So for the moment, cannot be bothered to think about it....here's my best, personally viewed, Southend XI......Royce, Poole, Powell, Clarke, Clark, Byrne, Jones, McCormack, Otto, Collymore, Eastwood.
 
I'm tired of our recent few years inability to turn our quality into promotion. So for the moment, cannot be bothered to think about it....here's my best, personally viewed, Southend XI......Royce, Poole, Powell, Clarke, Clark, Byrne, Jones, McCormack, Otto, Collymore, Eastwood.

Dream team or what! Think I would have had Cawston and Moody would have found a spot. Fat bot Byrne would have to go for Colin Morris.
 
I see your point but for me and it is only an opinion, we are unlikely to concede as few this term to last term. That means we have to score even more. If Coulthirst suddenly scored in the next game do you see him getting enough this season to be the answer? For me its a no. What about Corr? Even if he reproduces goals and assists of last season, is that enough? For me it is again no.

So that leaves us scratching. Who do we play and what do we do to turn it around? Whatever the answer is I do not believe it is PB's usual response of more of the same.

I believe we have a fair squad. I think the attack is considerably below what is required and the area I think needs the attention. The defence is so-so. We need, as all aspiring teams need, to score a lot more than we concede but that is not in our locker currently.


I couldnt see Tomlin scoring, he was absolutely terrible when he joined and only scored once in his first 15 games. Yet he came good. People said Corr couldnt do anything yet went on to score 7 in 15. Whether he will get back into scoring form again, or if Coulthirst will deliver who knows, but no one can say they definitely wont.

As for promotion, at the moment in current form then no I cant see it, then again in February this year I couldnt see us making the playoffs yet with pretty much the same team we had we went from rock bottom of the table to top in half a dozen games.

Only time will tell if we can improve, but we dont need to be making wholesale changes.

Interestingly the team at the top of the table's top scorer has only scored 2 and Wimbledon have one who has scored 6 and are doing no better than us, so its not just about who has the best striker but what you do as a team.

As for who we play and how we turn it around it is a head scratcher, and thats where Brown has to earn his pay :smile:
 
Wrong sub? In my opinion no. Payne looked tired, was playing out on the right in the second half anyway and was pretty much a like for like change in the sense that we didn't have to change formation to suit the player coming on. Did it work? No. This is where people need to understand the different between a sub that is wrong and a sub that didn't work.
 
Layne or Williams could not score any less than our strikers are currently scoring at the moment, these are options. Who knows? Could be winners. No harm in taking the risk, we really are not getting anywhere with what we have tried and the cupboard is nearly bare for options besides these. If neither are played in times like this,...then what is the point of them?
 
Layne or Williams could not score any less than our strikers are currently scoring at the moment, these are options. Who knows? Could be winners. No harm in taking the risk, we really are not getting anywhere with what we have tried and the cupboard is nearly bare for options besides these. If neither are played in times like this,...then what is the point of them?

The point about we won't know unless we try them is a valid one in some senses , but I guess this is where we need to trust the judgement of Brown and his team.
We are desperately short of goals right now , so if Brown saw in training that these two youngsters were the answer , then surely he would use one or both as it is ultimately to Browns advantage to make a success of this job.
Therefore , IMO we have to conclude that they are not showing him they're ready.

Some will like Brown , some won't , but he has been a professional Manager for long enough to suggest he is a bit more qualified than any if us to make these judgements.

I am not meaning to be critical at all of your point and I am as frustrated as anyone else on here with current form , but if Brown doesn't think they're ready yet , them sadly , he's probably right,
 
The point about we won't know unless we try them is a valid one in some senses , but I guess this is where we need to trust the judgement of Brown and his team.
We are desperately short of goals right now , so if Brown saw in training that these two youngsters were the answer , then surely he would use one or both as it is ultimately to Browns advantage to make a success of this job.
Therefore , IMO we have to conclude that they are not showing him they're ready.

Some will like Brown , some won't , but he has been a professional Manager for long enough to suggest he is a bit more qualified than any if us to make these judgements.

I am not meaning to be critical at all of your point and I am as frustrated as anyone else on here with current form , but if Brown doesn't think they're ready yet , them sadly , he's probably right,

I'd prefer he 'Defends the decision to play the same old poor strike force' (I use the word force very loosely)

Well, he is seeing in training that the current strikers are the answer...they are not, so he is getting that wrong. I think that if he is focussed on the defence, (which we know is his forte), and leaving the attack to themselves,(as he has said) Then why not let the youngsters have a go, after all they were signed for this job. I don't think anyone can judge them, based on pre-season...as they were hardly played.
 
Can we please get over the 'attack will look after itself comment' . Browns point was that what the forwards were lacking was a bit of confidence. His point was that they were doing everything right UN training and just were not getting the bit of luck during the match. His comment was to give the forwards confidence that he believed in them. It was all about giving them confidence that the manager backed them (as they lacked confidence) and it has been taken totally out of context. What do people want him to say 'our forwards are crap and coup not hit a barn door?
 
Can we please get over the 'attack will look after itself comment' . Browns point was that what the forwards were lacking was a bit of confidence. His point was that they were doing everything right UN training and just were not getting the bit of luck during the match. His comment was to give the forwards confidence that he believed in them. It was all about giving them confidence that the manager backed them (as they lacked confidence) and it has been taken totally out of context. What do people want him to say 'our forwards are crap and coup not hit a barn door?

Whatever he said or meant, confidence boosting or not...going forwards it is still not looking hopeful. He doesn't need to say anything about the forwards, the basic stats speak for themselves.....no amount of 'pep talks' can skew the facts. I'm obviously not a manager..and I don't think it is an easy job...but if the same old same old isn't working...then maybe something new needs to be done.
 
The point about we won't know unless we try them is a valid one in some senses , but I guess this is where we need to trust the judgement of Brown and his team.
We are desperately short of goals right now , so if Brown saw in training that these two youngsters were the answer , then surely he would use one or both as it is ultimately to Browns advantage to make a success of this job.
Therefore , IMO we have to conclude that they are not showing him they're ready.

Some will like Brown , some won't , but he has been a professional Manager for long enough to suggest he is a bit more qualified than any if us to make these judgements.

I am not meaning to be critical at all of your point and I am as frustrated as anyone else on here with current form , but if Brown doesn't think they're ready yet , them sadly , he's probably right,

So he is wasting wages on 2 strikers that aren't good enough to play in the first team, but may be good enough to play for the development team.

Sorry, I'd rather money was spent on a bona fide striker who can play in the first team and get us goals
 
Of course we can't see how these young forwards are developing and are worth a place in the 1st team as either a starter or on the bench as we are not allowed to watch the "behind closed doors" development games in which I assume they play.:unsure:
 
So he is wasting wages on 2 strikers that aren't good enough to play in the first team, but may be good enough to play for the development team.

Sorry, I'd rather money was spent on a bona fide striker who can play in the first team and get us goals

I actually said that Brown concludes they are not ready.
Nothing at all about not good enough.
 
I'd prefer he 'Defends the decision to play the same old poor strike force' (I use the word force very loosely)

Well, he is seeing in training that the current strikers are the answer...they are not, so he is getting that wrong. I think that if he is focussed on the defence, (which we know is his forte), and leaving the attack to themselves,(as he has said) Then why not let the youngsters have a go, after all they were signed for this job. I don't think anyone can judge them, based on pre-season...as they were hardly played.

Brown wants and needs success for our team , if only for his own cv and future career path.
The forwards are misfiring , everyone can see that.
If he thinks Layne and Williams would bring us ( and him ) success , don't you think they would be in the team.
My whole point was not that Corr , Barnard etc aren't struggling , but that we have to trust Browns judgement that the alternatives aren't yet ready.
It's far too simplistic to say that they are the answer.
I hope that they will be at some time in the future , but in Browns view , they clearly aren't yet.
 
I actually said that Brown concludes they are not ready.
Nothing at all about not good enough.

Exactly. When we signed Brown it was made clear that he would be in the development squad. Layne has come from Billericay, so is clearly going to take time to develop.
 
I actually said that Brown concludes they are not ready.
Nothing at all about not good enough.

Exactly. When we signed Brown it was made clear that he would be in the development squad. Layne has come from Billericay, so is clearly going to take time to develop.


So what REAL options do we have up front? Barney, Corr and Weston. I am sorry but we are not going to get promotion with those 3.
 
Dont forget Coulthirst.

I had hopes for Weston, seemed to do well pre-season and got that goal first game of the season. Since then not been impressed.
 
So what REAL options do we have up front? Barney, Corr and Weston. I am sorry but we are not going to get promotion with those 3.


I agree with you mate , but this misfiring of those 3 plus Coulthirst , doesn't mean the younger ones are ready yet.
 
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