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Ok now I've broken my posting duck and been put in my place by OBL I might as well give my ratings.

I do hope you don't think that's what I did! I was pointing out that some players seem to be crucified for the odd error whereas some get by making loads every match, but, because they are a "fans' favourite" they escape criticism!

Welcome to the board, by the way.
 
I do hope you don't think that's what I did! I was pointing out that some players seem to be crucified for the odd error whereas some get by making loads every match, but, because they are a "fans' favourite" they escape criticism!

Welcome to the board, by the way.

Thanks for the welcome! I didn't really take it personally, I just wish I could share some of your positivity, I tend to focus on the doom and gloom I'm afraid.
Sad%20Smilie%20aug%202010.gif
 
I genuinely don't know where to start with that. I am disgusted. Phil Brown and Phil Brown only cost us 3 points in that match.

Now I will be the first to admit that we were not brilliant in the first half. It was all a bit scrappy and there were a few too many aimless hoofs forward. But we were comfortable and not once did Bury ever look like they were going to threaten. Yet you could see the players immediately start sitting back on the lead. Instead of going for the jugular and opening up a bigger lead against what, up until that point, had been very poor quality opposition, we have a situation where Timlin and Worrall are playing a short corner and trying to hold the ball down there 2 minutes before half-time! I couldn't believe what I was watching.

It got worse after half-time. From the 50th minute, White was watching the ball go out of play by the corner flag for a goal-kick to us and leaving it there for a ball boy to trundle over and return it to Bentley. And then Bentley making a point continually of walking to the opposite side of the goal from where the ball went out to take his goal kick. Timewasting in the 50th minute!

What in the name of sweet Jesus is that idiot saying to them at half-time? Bury are there for the taking, all he had to do was tell them to keep the pressure up and turn the screw after half-time.....but they did the opposite. So now we'll have a situation where some of the more short-sighted fans will start blaming the failure to hold a lead today on the lack of goals or the 4-4-2 system which we began the game with (a system which will come good with Corr and Barnard up top if it is persevered with) when in reality, it is clearly down to something that he is saying to them before the match (“get the first goal and sit on it”) or at half-time (“now you're 1-0 up, take it easy and see the game out”).

It is made all the more infuriating to hear him in his post-match interview saying “we knew Bury would come back into the game second half and we tried to tighten things up a little bit at half-time to counter that”. Sorry, but what sodding aspect of Bury's woeful first half display gave you any sort of impression that they would come back into the game? The only way they were ever going to work their way back into it is if you allowed them to do so with your half-time team talk and tactical tweaks you stupid, inept *******. What football manager worth his salt honestly makes that kind of prediction when 1-0 up and in control after 45 minutes at home against one of the poorest sides we've seen this season? He's made tactical tweaks at half-time to counter something which hasn't happened yet and allowed them to come back into the game. Go for the fecking jugular and try to create a 2-or-3 goal buffer. If Bury still come out, manage to move into the ascendency and put our slender lead under threat despite Southend still throwing men forward and attacking then fair enough, react to it and try to protect it. You can't make changes and base your half-time team talk on something which is showing no signs of happening, but he's done exactly that and plunged his team into a situation where its lead IS under threat.

We may even have been able to hold on despite the tactical tweaks and half-time team talk, but the final nail in the coffin was the decision to haul Barnard off for Weston and switch to a negative 4-5-1 set-up. From the moment that change happened, the ball stopped sticking up front like it had in the first half due to the fact that Corr/Weston (whichever of the 2 chose to be the one player to stay forward at the time) was isolated up top alone and we had lost the energy and the ball-retention skills of Barnard. We put 10 men behind the ball and straight away invited a pressure onto our own goal which was never there before and had shown no signs of appearing. The old man and I turned to each other as soon as that change was made and said “that's it, we'll either cling onto a 1-0 win by the skin of our teeth or it'll finish 1-1,” because as soon as that change is made you know that Phil Brown ain't looking for any more goals. From that point on I pretty much switched off because I knew the equaliser was now going to come. The goal and the free-kick which led to it would never have happened if he had kept things as they were but the Bury pressure, the panic in our defence and the three successive corners that Bury forced, all the result of that substitution and negative change in shape and mentality, told you exactly what was around the corner.

Of course, as anyone could have predicted, the tired excuses came out in the post-match conference and the first words which came out of his mouth were about the referee, the penalty and the fact that they cost us the game. I'm sure many of our less-observant fans will fall for you hiding behind that excuse too but sorry mate, forget the non-penalty because YOU cost us that win and should never have put your players into a position where they needed to be awarded a late penalty to get the 3 points.

As an aside, there have been plenty of stonewall penalties not given and shocking refereeing performances over the years but it's a long long time since I've seen our players react to a decision like that. Is that frustration with their manager boiling over on the pitch? I can't see how the changes he made in the second half, the clear difference they made to the shape and mentality of the team, and the fact that we conceded a goal minutes later will help the players' confidence in El Tango and it already looks like he's lost them a little bit. There certainly seems to be something more deeply and fundamentally wrong than just the “lack of a goalscorer”.

Either way, he's certainly lost my confidence. The old man reckons he's the worst football manager we've had since Dick Bate. He might not be far wrong. The Alvin Martin and Alan Little days may have been dark ones but those two never had the quality available to them that this clueless idiot has. This group of players has the collective quality to be fighting at the top end but they are continually being blunted by a manager who is tactically inept and has no idea how to get the best out of them. I think the players themselves know this too and IMO this frustration is showing in their body language and even more so in their reaction to the non-penalty today. There is a total lack of confidence among, and maybe that is to blame for ridiculous time wasting in the corner before half time and at our own goal kicks after 50 minutes (although I'd say it's more likely Brown's instructions), but it is our own manager who has drained the players of confidence with his negative tactics and formations, his chopping and changing of the starting line-up, and his ludicrous substitutions. He needs to go.

Cut your losses Ron.

genuinely brilliant post james
 
Bentley – 7 A couple of dodgy throw outs, but made an important block at the beginning of the match
Leonard – 6 Very average.
White - 6.5 Thought he defended well. Distribution was a bit hoofish, though.
Prosser - 6.5 Solid
Williams – 5 Didn't look particularly interested. Poor crossing that rarely beat the first mand
Worrall - 8 My MOTM. Pacy and always a threat. Had a blatant penalty turned down.
Timlin - 7 Usual Timlin performance. Hustled, bustled and passed well in the main
Deegan - 5. Poor. Tried to be too fancy at times. He's there to tidy things up
Atkinson - 6.5 Didn't quite work for him down the left, but always puts a shift in.
Barnard - 7 Worked really hard and was unlucky to be taken off. Looked much better in a 4-4-2
Corr - 7 Wish he would turn defenders, but battled well
Subs:
Weston – 6 Should have shot a couple of times at the end.
Payne - 6.5 Should have come on earlier.
 
They got outsung by the away fans

I cannot believe two people are having a go at John White here! He was one of our better players today, and didn't do a great deal wrong as far as I can see!

It was good to see a change to 4-4-2, which I'd said I felt we ought to try during the week, trouble is, if you're going to play 4-4-2, then let's at least get the ball to Barney's feet and stop humping long balls half heartedly forward. Barney was the better of the two strikers, Corr looked lazy to me whereas at least Barney was giving it plenty. Midfield was strange, with two fairly defensive ones centrally, the two wide players didn't get enough service going forward and we kept trying to play it through the middle. It wasn't till the 2nd half when Lenny and Worrall started pushing forward that we really looked threatening. Deegan had little influence on the game, Timlin, on the other hand, was the puppet master and it's good to see him back.

I just didn't understand the set up, Lenny and Timlin is our best central midfield combination, we had two fit central defenders so why on earth did we have Lenny at RB and John White in the middle of defence? And then, why on earth Weston when we made our first substitution? Wrong, wrong, wrong!

Bentley - 6, didn't have to do much but did make one important save and one important challenge
Leonard - 7, getting back to normal, but not in his best position
White - 7, slotted in comfortably in the middle of defence, got his head on lots
Prosser - 7, solid, typical Luke performance
Williams - 6, looked more comfortable once Weston came on strangely!
Worrall - 7, improved over the game, challenged and battled well, and desperately unlucky not to win a penalty
Timlin - 8, MOTM, one of the best and most consistent passers of the ball we have
Deegan - 6, going off the boil, can't see a place for him in the team
Atkinson - 6, not a winger and certainly not a left winger
Barnard - 7, never stopped battling, unlucky to be subbed
Corr - 6, looked better once Barney went off

Subs:
Weston for Barnard - 4, words fail me
Payne for Atkinson - 6, not on long enough to have an effect

Officials:
Just shocking.

TBV:
A word of praise for them today, the kept going and Scott tried desperately to get more involved. Well done lads.
 
So, all week (in fact most if the past month) Brown has stated our problems are in the final third. So what does he do? Changes the bl**dy defence! He actually decided to put our biggest liability (apart from Binbag Williams) at the heart if the defence! WHY? White almost cost us a goal and therefore the game. He is barely a RB let alone a CB and defo not a captain.

Up front i thought the changes were the correct ones. However when we need goals why drop Clifford from the bench in place if a 2nd CB who has been woeful and should never cross that white line again for us? Baffling.
 
The honeymoon period is over. No more words Phil, we need to see Goals and results... I wonder how many managers have won Manager of the Month then been sacked two months later?
 
So, all week (in fact most if the past month) Brown has stated our problems are in the final third. So what does he do? Changes the bl**dy defence! He actually decided to put our biggest liability (apart from Binbag Williams) at the heart if the defence! WHY? White almost cost us a goal and therefore the game. He is barely a RB let alone a CB and defo not a captain.

Up front i thought the changes were the correct ones. However when we need goals why drop Clifford from the bench in place if a 2nd CB who has been woeful and should never cross that white line again for us? Baffling.

Bolger is thd CB i refer to.
 
when PB first came to SUFC i thought it was a good thing ,but reading everything about how we are playing etcthe fact we are unable to score goals and his tactics or lack off,i think its time to go MR BROWN .Last season you was allowing the team to play some decent football ,seems now you forgotten what decent attractive football is,your negativity it seems is now affecting the players ,you ve had 14 or 15 matches this season to realise your best team yet still havent,you are not it seems allowing them to play football,to go for the jugular once leading,what SUFC do not need is a manager who is afraid to win and you are MR Brown. Mr Martin do the right thing now before its too late and the season is over for SUFC ,say good bye to Mr Brown.
 
Watching the Bury goal on the football league show in slo mo, it's a disgraceful bit of defending by Prosser and Corr. A hopeful ball is floated in a foot away from both of them and they don't even jump an inch to head it away, allowing the smallest player on the pitch a free header. Joke.
Prosser, that's your job, jump and head it away. Corr, if you're not going to jump when defending, stay up front.
 
I honestly think he played Leonard at right back today to keep Danny mayor quiet with his pace because he don't trust white...
Then why bloody play white at all!!!!
And why have two centre backs on the bench! How are they going to change the game!
There selection on the bench tells me he wasn't confident with the back four he picked, so why pick it!
Just so baffled!
 
Watching the Bury goal on the football league show in slo mo, it's a disgraceful bit of defending by Prosser and Corr. A hopeful ball is floated in a foot away from both of them and they don't even jump an inch to head it away, allowing the smallest player on the pitch a free header. Joke.
Prosser, that's your job, jump and head it away. Corr, if you're not going to jump when defending, stay up front.

Alternatively the 6 foot plus keeper could have commanded his area and claimed it.............. sits back and awaits the flak
 
I think the players need to take some
responibility. The captain for starters. Phil will get us promoted.
 
Whilst Brown's tactics are questionable, he can't be blamed for the players' inability to cross the ball. Williams, I am talking about you.
 
It's the morning after.

I've read through this thread and just for once everyone seems pretty much united in their views (with the exception of White) which is a refreshing change.

However, the blame has been laid squarely at PB's door when in fact he made a couple of very positive changes to try and arrest this run we are in.

1 - He played 2 strikers in a 4-4-2
2 - He tried to play the people who are in form

When I saw the team I actually said "At last.". The 4-5-1 has it's merits but we have been sussed out and it isn't working now. With two strikers on the pitch surely we would start converting these chances that we make.

However, the first half - for both sides - was one of the worst halves of professional football I have ever witnessed. We were dreadful and only in the game at all because Bury were bloody dreadful. How we got 1-0 up I don't know as it seemed to just happen without any major move, thrust or pressure. The ball somehow found Corr who finished well. Was it me or did there seem to be a slightly muted celebration by the crowd, almost as though it was going to be disallowed? Anyhow, 1-0 up, in no trouble and surely we can't capitulate again in the second half.

It started with more of the same until Barnard went off and we went 4-5-1. Within minutes we were all over the show and Bury started to have all of the ball. We didn't seem to know how to cope with the pressure we were under and the inevitable equaliser arrived.

That was that until Worrall was pulled down in the penalty area and I can't remember a more blatant penalty not given. Still, at least we didn't have the opportunity to miss! However, it sparked us into a bit of life and we did then take the game to Bury, who went back to being bloody dreadful. Unfortunately we failed to register a shot, despite all the huff and puff.

This performance, for me, was screaming "lack of confidence". You can see it in the players when they treat the ball like a hot potato, getting rid of it at every opportunity; always taking an easy option; passing responsibility for the shot to someone else. This was evident all over the pitch and every player looked nervous and edgy. No-one epitomised this more than Binnom-Williams, a young athletic lad who was on the verge of being given a Premiership Squad number at Crystal Palace before Pulis went. Jesus, this is almost a proper Premiership player who should be able to walk into any league 2 side and improve it. Yesterday he looked as though he had come up from the youth team and it was a really nervous debut.

There is only so much Brown can be responsible for as once the players cross the line he is powerless. I really don't think he says to the players at half time "Let's keep it at 1-0". However, I think he realises that there are few goals in this side and therefore to get points we mustn't concede.

On paper, we have as strong a squad for this division as I can remember. Also, when we do click, there isn't a team that can live with us. On those two points I would also guess most would agree.

But it really isn't working. At all. And is another manager change the answer? I'm not sure that it is. Hard work will get us through and sooner or later we will start playing again. Mansfield next week and at the moment I'll be happy with a point from that, then the distraction of the Cup and 3 very winnable games in November.

We have had a winless October on the back of an unbeaten September. We have the same players. A good team doesn't become bad overnight.
 
Very sensible post. But form players like Clifford are being overlooked. I personally think Leonard and Clifford should be our central midfield pairing with Timlin and Worrall either side of them. Both Leonard and Clifford are players who can score from midfield.

But I agree it is encouraging that Corr and Barnard started up front together.
 
Very sensible post. But form players like Clifford are being overlooked. I personally think Leonard and Clifford should be our central midfield pairing with Timlin and Worrall either side of them. Both Leonard and Clifford are players who can score from midfield.

But I agree it is encouraging that Corr and Barnard started up front together.

100% agree with this, that midfield would get goals.
 
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