Post-Match Thread and Ratings Southend United 1-1 Bury

Great post by fbm this morning - spot on.
I think Brown deserves a lot of flak for selections , tactics over the past few weeks , but all this talk of 'losing the dressing room' is nonsense IMO.
These players are professionals and need to look at themselves also.
I can't say that the effort isn't there , but nobody wants the ball and nobody is looking to drive the team on.
This is just based on yesterday and not their overall contribution to the season , but :

Williams was dreadful and we really need Coker back.
White is captain and we need someone now to rally the team. If he can't do that then change him.
Also not sure what his selection says about Bolger and Thompson ( who I thought was building a good partnership with Prosser ).
Prosser was poor , but the poor lad was covering Williams and White most of the time , so bearing that in mind mYbe he wasn't that bad.
When Deegan made us debut I came on here and said that he was the difference we lacked.
What has happened since ?
He doesn't seem to be making the same tackles , he is slow and his passing is poor and ineffective ( sideways mostly or out of touch ).
Thought the selection of Corr and Barnard was positive and correct given our recent run , but will they work together in the long run ?
Is there enough pace between them.
Corr took his goal well and Barney worked hard but is it enough.
I think only Worrall came out of yesterday with real credit.
Timlin and Arkinson were ok but really didn't influence that much.
Bentley made a great stop in first half but really had little else to do.
On the 'taking the ball in the corner' incident , I get people's frustration and agree it was embarrassing , , but think Timlin knew the first half was nearly up and thought he was doing the right thing in protecting our lead.
He got that wrong but understand his thinking too.
On we go.

fbm said:

On paper, we have as strong a squad for this division as I can remember. Also, when we do click, there isn't a team that can live with us. On those two points I would also guess most would agree.

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Not for one minute I'm afraid.

I can still remember the squad which included:

Prior, Barrett, Jupp, Maher, Bentley, Pettefer, Gower, Gray, Eastwood Mk I, Guttridge, Edwards

Even the weak links in the team (Flahavan, Wilson, Nicolou) couldn't render that squad weaker than the current one.

Your second point about teams not being able to live with us; when was the last time we beat a team by more than two goals?

Mick said:

Not for one minute I'm afraid.

I can still remember the squad which included:

Prior, Barrett, Jupp, Maher, Bentley, Pettefer, Gower, Gray, Eastwood Mk I, Guttridge, Edwards

Even the weak links in the team (Flahavan, Wilson, Nicolou) couldn't render that squad weaker than the current one.

Your second point about teams not being able to live with us; when was the last time we beat a team by more than two goals?

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Did I say I had short term memory recall?
:winking:


Seriously though, I was kind of referring to the current spell in L2 but didn't really make that clear. However, back then we had a really good team with some better players than we currently have, but I think this squad has more strength in depth.

Of that squad, which players could improve what we have here? Certainly any of the centre halves would, Gower, Gray, Eastwood and an in form Guttridge. But I think the full backs we have here are better and the midfield has generally better players (although the old squad had a better blend).

I'd say there wasn't a great deal in it actually.

And with living with us, I meant actually playing the game and keeping the ball. Which doesn't win you games of course; you have to score goals.

Anyone else not really rate Clifford of just me? Yeh he's got a long shot in his pocket but that's about it. Positionally erratic and it often feels like we're playing with 10 when he's on the pitch.

It's a shame because he started off the season very well IMO.

FarmdogSUFC said:

Anyone else not really rate Clifford of just me? Yeh he's got a long shot in his pocket but that's about it. Positionally erratic and it often feels like we're playing with 10 when he's on the pitch.

It's a shame because he started off the season very well IMO.

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I find Clifford a bit casual at times. He's got ability but am not sure he's a game changer. He can't be doing much right at the moment in training.

it was always going to be long ball from the back yesterday as the back four had nothing short to pass to. both centre mids had a starting position of about 5 yards in front of the back line, and while both do a lot of running about, neither has the vision of clifford, or even leonard. stick those two in centre mid and you still have tenacity, but you also get ability on the ball and the creativity that comes with it.

I agreed with dagenham kev. worst team in essex

Mick said:

Not for one minute I'm afraid.

I can still remember the squad which included:

Prior, Barrett, Jupp, Maher, Bentley, Pettefer, Gower, Gray, Eastwood Mk I, Guttridge, Edwards

Even the weak links in the team (Flahavan, Wilson, Nicolou) couldn't render that squad weaker than the current one.

Your second point about teams not being able to live with us; when was the last time we beat a team by more than two goals?

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You are right, the team that got us promoted from this division including Eastwood, Barrett, Prior etc were a million miles better than the squad Brown has assembled. And despite this, we then only got promotion via the play-offs. This shows the sort of quality and blend you need to get promoted.

Was in London yesterday checking the score with about 20 minutes to go we were still and I'm thinking Bury will score in a minute, literally a minute later went on FB and they had! Very frustrating at the moment that's 4 points we've lost in the last 2 home games from a winning position.

Just shows the confidence I have in the team at the moment. Straight after half time with us leading 1-0, I had a bet on 1-1. At least the day wasn't a total disaster.

I did say when we went in at 1-0 that Bury will score in the second half. Up until we went 4-5-1 we looked ok, as soon as the formation changed, we invited pressure and we were all just waiting for the inevitable

davewebbsbrain said:

I did say when we went in at 1-0 that Bury will score in the second half. Up until we went 4-5-1 we looked ok, as soon as the formation changed, we invited pressure and we were all just waiting for the inevitable

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When Bury had that string of corners in a row you just new it was coming. Our Defence was all over the place and not confident at all.

Shrimper said:

When Bury had that string of corners in a row you just new it was coming. Our Defence was all over the place and not confident at all.

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As was apparent in watching the goal replayed on TV, what Corr and Prosser were doing, I do not know :sad:

FarmdogSUFC said:

Anyone else not really rate Clifford of just me? Yeh he's got a long shot in his pocket but that's about it. Positionally erratic and it often feels like we're playing with 10 when he's on the pitch.

It's a shame because he started off the season very well IMO.

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Ok, he is nothing special but those long shots can turn into a few goals over a season, this can mean 3pts instead of 1 or a draw instead of a defeat. You need goalscoring midfielders in the team. These things all add up, we also lack a free-kick specialist since Ryan Hall and our centre backs havn't scored a single goal between them from corners or crosses.
These are some of the reasons for our lack of success so far this season. With Brown's recent team selections you cant see where goals are going to come from.

OldBlueLady said:

As was apparent in watching the goal replayed on TV, what Corr and Prosser were doing, I do not know :sad:

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As I pointed out before, they both didn't jump an inch and let a midget get his head on the ball, criminal. I know Corr picks his moments to jump because of the pain he gets in on landing, but come on, surely that was a moment to jump.

OldBlueLady said:

As was apparent in watching the goal replayed on TV, what Corr and Prosser were doing, I do not know :sad:

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Leaving it for each other I guess.

Bentley 7 - great save after White put through Doofus
Leonard 6 - can see why he was put at right-back, to provide more attacking impetus in Coker's impetus. I'd still rather him in the middle though.
Williams 4 - are people still saying he's a Premier$hite player?
White 5 - awful mistake. He strikes me as a squad player, not someone to build around. The decision to make him captain seems increasingly eccentric.
Prosser 5 - defensively decent, organises but not the player for the style Brown is trying to impose where we play from the back
Deegan 6 - less effective in a 4-4-2 than in recent weeks
Timlin 7 - bypassed for most of the game. Our best moments came through him. His play to win the free-kick is what has been missing all season. Timlin played a one touch ball and surged forward to pick up a return ball, like what an actual football team would do.
Worrall 7 - a livewire on the right in comparsion to our non-functioning left-hand side
Atkinson 3 - Not a left-winger in a month of Sundays. Was absolute dog-**** Saturday. Repeatedly ran into the defender and got skinned 3 or 4 times defensively. Constantly played Williams into trouble (and how hard is it to remember that Williams is left-footed?), which led to Williams hurridly shuffling the ball to Prosser to play back to Bentley to boot it 30 yards from Barnard to chase. AAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHH. Why did Brown take 70 minutes to put him out of his misery and move him? He's not a bad player, so this surely has to be down to the way the manager deployed him.
Corr 7 - I thought he could no longer jump? Won an awful lot in the air for someone who can't, linked play and scored. Still that won't be enough for some. #barnabluegetsitwrongagain
Barnard 5 - his best work was on balls 30 yards away when he'd chase 20 yards to close down, rather than those balls played to him which he'd control on his chest and lose.


Subs
Weston n/a - I'd usually give a mark for someone on that long but he didn't make enough of an impact
Payne 5 - livened up proceedings, even if only by instigating a brawl for which he was surprisingly booked

Ref 6 - I've given him 5 marks for my favourite moment of the season so far

[video=youtube;92d1xtjXf8E]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92d1xtjXf8E[/video]

davewebbsbrain said:

I did say when we went in at 1-0 that Bury will score in the second half. Up until we went 4-5-1 we looked ok, as soon as the formation changed, we invited pressure and we were all just waiting for the inevitable

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Phil
I dont usually agree with you, but what did we both say when we saw Barny going off and Weston coming on.
Everyone just looked at each other and said No not again. We are just inviting pressure, and sitting back.
I just dont get what Weston offers and Barny does not.

Again at kick off we all said White at Centre what a smack in the teeth for Bolger and Thompson.
Degnan and Timlin are both too defensive to play together, especially when our best attacking midfielder
playing at wing back. At Least Phil At last you are now getting Worrall By far our best player yesterday.
I dont think Atkinson offered much yesterday, why is Hurst on the bench.?
PB should not go YET, but as i said on coach back from Newport. Big review around Christmas and
dont give him a extended contract.
Phil what did you see yesterday to take of Barny and go change the formation which played again into the
hands of the opposition. That 99% of your fans did not agree with you and who were right again.

davewebbsbrain said:

I did say when we went in at 1-0 that Bury will score in the second half. Up until we went 4-5-1 we looked ok, as soon as the formation changed, we invited pressure and we were all just waiting for the inevitable

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I agree with that statement except the bold bit. At no time yesterday at 4-4-2 did we look ok, I thought it was a game between two dreadful teams. However, we didn't look in danger of conceding.

1 minute till half time, centre halfs in the box and we hold the ball up from our corner. If a team had done that against us there would be a diatribe against them on here. For Timlin to hold up 1 finger to the shout of 'just get it over, shows his mentality. Truly embarrassing.