Post-Match Thread and Ratings Southend United 0-0 Plymouth

OldBlueLady said:

But it's the players that hear it, and that's disheartening and counter productive.

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I do agree with you and in hindsight wish I hadn't done it, but frustration got the better of me. I hope some of the players read this and realise that for me at least, the boos were aimed at Brown not them.

I can't remember who quoted me, but longshots can be a good thing! They can go in, deflect and in, deflect and bobble through or bounce back for a tip in.. or end up in prospects!

If we are playing bad or unable to break teams down then a long shot is needed. Even the keeper making a decent save rallies the crowd and therefor the players.

I think Clifford is unlucky to not be playing more seeing as he was untouchable at the start of the season. Leonard has been disappointing of late and i would swap the two.. give lenny a kick in the arse!

OldBlueLady said:

But it's the players that hear it, and that's disheartening and counter productive.

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I generally agree with you OBL but I am not sure what is being said here. If the fans are unhappy they are not going to applaud. If it were a mass silence would that not still have the same effect and impact on the players as booing?

Things are not right on the pitch at the moment, probably due to instructions, but I think it can be productive if the team, the manager and the chairman are made aware that the paying public are disgruntled. Instead of being shrinking violets they should man up and do something about it. For me its time RM told PB that either things change or the manager does.

Angell Delight said:

Agree with this.

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i been saying this all season. Yesterday I saw him intimate to another player near the end of the game he was staying outside the box due to orders. Not the only player to suffer as a result of Browns cautious approach. I bet Lenny knows if he was to disobey he would soon be doing a Clifford....

LennySUFC said:

I can't remember who quoted me, but longshots can be a good thing! They can go in, deflect and in, deflect and bobble through or bounce back for a tip in.. or end up in prospects!

If we are playing bad or unable to break teams down then a long shot is needed. Even the keeper making a decent save rallies the crowd and therefor the players.

I think Clifford is unlucky to not be playing more seeing as he was untouchable at the start of the season. Leonard has been disappointing of late and i would swap the two.. give lenny a kick in the arse!

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yes. Wayne Gretzky said something profound like, You miss 100% of the shots you don't take... Fear of failure is killing us

Thought we played okay yesterday, best of the nil nils as plymouth made a game of it. Both teams were unlucky not to score.

Magnum PI said:

yes. Wayne Gretzky said something profound like, You miss 100% of the shots you don't take... Fear of failure is killing us

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Elsewhere in the sporting world To win you have to risk loss. -Jean-Claude Killy

When a draw is only worth a third of a win, this is even more the case.

Yet again a game there to be won but a lack of skill, composure, luck whatever has cost us. Don't get what shaq brings to the team apart from pace, is clueless with the ball at his feet. We need a goal so we bring on Weston, really? Williams did well at Northampton, yet doesn't get a look in again. Timlin by far the best player at Northampton, doesnt get a look in, Piggot did ok for his debut, but much of his good work was done outside the area, one decent header. Needs a bit of time but looks ok. Still need a fox in the box. Really don't think PB has an eye for a striker or poacher type player. Defensively we rode our luck, dan saved us a couple of times first half, second half they didn't create much other than hitting the crossbar twice. How we didn't score when we had three shots from what looked inside 6 yards we will never know. What apitimised our current plight was when shaq ran through could and should have passed it and scuffed a back pass to the keeper. Payne as has become common in recent weeks runs into cul de sacs constantly and has no physical presence, gets knocked off the ball so easily.

In the end yet another frustrating afternoon, as others have said our tactics are stifling our play, the likes of Leonard in particular are not being used in the right way. We must, must, must sign a striker who is a in the box type player, who can attack balls in the six yard box.

I look forward to the 2 page thread the next time we win.

Decent game between 2 good sides.

We both have excellent keepers in Bentley & McCormick so that played a part.

Who knows, we might next meet at Wembley.

Good luck for the rest of the season.

rigsby said:

Obviouly not studying football at uni then!!

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No, I'm not. I forgot some of the things that get posted on this forum that made me lose interest.

rigsby said:

S
Slagging off the back four,not understanding Deegan [ MOM Again], Piggott is more off the same, Clean sheets rubbish etc

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In response to your in depth argument, I don't think anyone would say that the defence yesterday was perfect, as I said it was a decent point with a makeshift defence. That's what it was, a makeshift defence who did okay in the end, but up against a decent League 2 striker on a good day, it would have been a different story. It's no criticism of them as players, Coker and Binnom-Williams are not centre backs and White only plays there very rarely.

Deegan did okay, I'm not criticising him or his performance, he played well and did his job excellently. My issue was more with the fact that he was picked, Timlin was outstanding at Northampton and Clifford was our best player for the first 2 months of the season. They both offer a lot more going forward than Deegan and I feel would have brought more to the game yesterday. Perhaps my rating was a tad harsh but I feel our midfield play is limited when he is in there and limits our attacking threat, whereas Timlin or Clifford offer something going forward and are good defensively, although not in the same way as Deegan.

Piggott is a very similar player to Corr was a few years ago, a more mobile and quicker version, the striker that scored 20 odd goals in a season for us, I'm not sure that's a criticism. I think he looked promising and could very well put some goals in the net once he gets to know the team, my only criticism was the dropped deep and went wide too often, something Barry was also guilty of before his mobility became so limited he barely leaves the middle.

I don't quite understand "Clean sheet rubbish etc" so if you want to expand I'll happily explain my comments.

amsemp said:

Have to say, I didn't agree with the Deegan comment. Saying he did what he was there to do but offered nothing else is like saying Bentley made a great couple of saves to keep us in the game but offered nothing else. Deegan was never there to score a hattrick, he was there as a defensive midfielder to protect the defence which he did brilliantly. Giving him a rating of 0.5 more than Payne and Leonard is crazy.

Makelele made 217 appearances for Chelsea and scored just two goals, but Chelsea fans will still tell you he was one of their greatest defensive midfielders, as he wasn't there to score the goals. He gave the team a licence to get forward and attack knowing that they weren't leaving themselves open.

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As I have said above, my rating may have been harsh and I agree with your point in many ways. The difference is that Leonard was also playing the holding role and I didn't feel we needed 2 players in that role, and we could have done with one more offensive player.

pafc said:

Decent game between 2 good sides.

We both have excellent keepers in Bentley & McCormick so that played a part.

Who knows, we might next meet at Wembley.

Good luck for the rest of the season.

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Our keeper is good, yours is just scum convicted of causing death by driving over the limit

THE END

TrueBlue said:

Our keeper is good, yours is just scum convicted of causing death by driving over the limit

THE END

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So our keeper isn't a good keeper because he was convicted of drunk driving?

Guess Tony Adams was never a good player either then? :thumbsup:

TrueBlue said:

Our keeper is good, yours is just scum convicted of causing death by driving over the limit

THE END

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Really don't know why you had to insult pafc who had made a polite contribution and wished us well.

more by luck than by judgement, but adams never ran anyone over as far as im aware.

mccormick seems to have shown genuine remorse and i can can stomach that hes back in the game after making such a costly mistake. im not sure he should ever be club captain though regardless of his current behaviour.

pafc said:

So our keeper isn't a good keeper because he was convicted of drunk driving?

Guess Tony Adams was never a good player either then? :thumbsup:

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Death by dangerous driving I think you will find. Don't play down the fact he killed two children. He didn't premeditate it and has shown remorse but it was much more than drunk driving

I too thought Deegan did a good destroying job in centre midfield (their no 8 looked like he hated his afternoon) but if you shift the ball and go he is so easy to beat, and leave behind. Leonard I'm afraid is trying to resemble Gareth Bale looks/attire wise, but unfortunately there any similarity ends. Payne and Worrall are my two favourite players yet both had bad days at the office. Pigot meanwhile was quite neat but not fast or aggressive enough for me. Coker was a class apart and I agree with FBM that the visitor's tiny left back was most impressive.
My main criticism was how we rushed every free kick we won, even the ones in dangerous positions. Perhaps this why our defenders are not scoring, we simply do not wait for them to get up there at set-pieces. It was not a boring 0-0, played out in very difficult conditions, and we could have easily snatched it towards the end. That said, as bruv pointed out on the walk back to the pub afterwards, 'if we do go up to League 1, we will get murdered'.

I thought overall the game was an entertaining 0-0 draw considering the weather conditions.

We were on top for the first 10 minutes or so, then Plymouth sussed out our 3-5-2 formation and started to make more of the running, especially down their left flank, where White was outnumbered 2 to 1 on a number of occasions. Fortunately Plymouth's final ball into the box was either delayed too long for us to get back, or was completely wasted. Most of Plymouth's first half chances came from our mistakes at the back which was worrying. At halftime we were fortunate to be level, thanks to a number of good saves from Bentley. Second half though, we changed to 4 at the back and we were much more dangerous as a result.

I was particularly impressed with Binnom-Williams' performance at centre half in the second period - strong, composed and was not bullied around.

Here are my ratings for what it's worth:

Bentley - 7, twice saved us in the first half with one on one saves - second half not a lot to do.

White - 7, Solid and extremely unlucky not to score during a melee in the Plymouth box in the second half.

Thompson 7, improved much as the game went on. Solid with the head, not so clever with his feet. My one gripe with him is that he must accept and learn that sometimes he cannot win every ball coming his way and that there are some times that he must accept the forward will win the ball and not give silly fouls away. Mohsni used to do this a lot too.

Coker - 7, one mistake in the second half but solid enough.

Binnom-Williams - 7.5, much better from him - most complete game i've seen from him for a while. Looked very composed at centre half. Unlike Thompson he knew when to stand off if the ball wasn't there to win.

Worrall - 7, Caused Plymouth all manner of trouble in the first half, but faded in the second half. One question, why oh why do we continue to pump high balls his way on the wing all the time?.

Deegan - 8 MOM, a composed defensive midfield performance and was always in the right place when needed.

Leonard - 6.5, I thought he would be up for this game, but something just seems to be lacking in his game at the moment.

Payne - 6.5, Great first half, second half, the game seemed to pass him by and Brown was right to sub him when he did.

Coulthirst - 7, better finishing and he would've got 7.5. He caused Plymouth lots of trouble throughout the game and i thought Brown's decision to take him off for Atkinson was a really strange one. Plymouth would've been glad to see the back of him when he went off.

Pigott - 7, started brightly. Maybe not fully match fit but he seemed not to have a lot of pace about him. His heading wasn't the greatest either, but i was impressed with him when the ball was at his feet and he had a good footballing brain and an understanding of where his teammates were.

Subs:
Weston, 6.5 - Some great runs down the left flank but no end product.
Atkinson, 6.5 - didn't see why he was brought on, and didn't see him have a real impact on the game when he did.

pafc said:

So our keeper isn't a good keeper because he was convicted of drunk driving?

Guess Tony Adams was never a good player either then? :thumbsup:

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Not sure you can compare what Adams did driving his car into a lamp post to what your keeper did.

shrimperjon said:

Not sure you can compare what Adams did driving his car into a lamp post to what your keeper did.

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Not sure why McCormick is even being discussed. Can we get back on topic. And is there any need to lay into fans of other clubs who come on here in good faith?