The cheek of Labour !

callan said:

My missus has got a Jane Fonda fitness video...does that make her an IRA fund raiser?

Click to expand...

Suggest you re-read my post.:winking:

Tangled up in Blue said:

Probably not.

In my time I've contributed funds to Bernadette Delvin in Birmingham and Jane Fonda (at an anti-Vietnam war rally in the US).

It's entirely possible that some of this loose change might have made it's way to the IRA, in the former case and the Black Panthers in the latter, (since they were providing security).

In both cases I was contributing to the speaker's expenses, not directly to the IRA nor the Black Panthers.

Same sort of thing really.

Click to expand...

Just so I'm clear on this. Were Bernadette and Jane campaigning and raising monies on a private basis in their own names and specifically as advertised for their expenses or was it a bucket collection at a rally or conference somewhere?

If the latter then you were either extremely naive and silly to believe it was going towards what you thought it was or you were quite happy to contribute to a cause knowing full well some of your cash could possibly go to a terrorist/illegal organization.

Not intentionally playing the poster but that's a quite remarkable statement to make and requires clarification.

Another Surrey Shrimper said:

For the UK - Hamas is a legal political party but the military wing that is associated are classified as a banned group.


Hamas were the largest party in Palestine in 2006. If there is ever any chance of peace in the region discussions need to be had with Hamas.


Corbyn is a talker, a pacifist, he talks to people that on some levels he would not benefit from being associated with and when he talks to these people using phrases like 'my friends' in order to have constructive discussion and if a bucket comes round and everyone is throwing a few coins in and he does the same I don't think that should be seen as out and out support. If he is asked 'do you support Hamas' that would be a good way to judge if he supports Hamas.


Compare that to Cameron who cussed Junker so much when he was running for President of the EU, and then wonders why his attempts at EU reform gets such little support. If he had used phrases such as 'my friends' when addressing people he wants to come to agreement with he might find they are more receptive to his requests.


When our current government were offering to run prisons for the murdering Saudi regime in the Middle East that sounds a much bigger deal than a backbench MP as he was having discussions with the main (legal in the UK) political party in Palestine.


And Google are still only paying 3% tax. Despite their deliveries being handled by customs, and transported on our roads, and delivered by staff whose health and education are all paid for through our tax system.

Click to expand...

Your talking bollox - sorry, My friend, your talking bollox.

Bielzibubz said:

Just so I'm clear on this. Were Bernadette and Jane campaigning and raising monies on a private basis in their own names and specifically as advertised for their expenses or was it a bucket collection at a rally or conference somewhere?

If the latter then you were either extremely naive and silly to believe it was going towards what you thought it was or you were quite happy to contribute to a cause knowing full well some of your cash could possibly go to a terrorist/illegal organization.

Not intentionally playing the poster but that's a quite remarkable statement to make and requires clarification.

Click to expand...

It was a long time ago -back in the early 70's.

Bernadette Delvin was speaking at Digbeth Town Hall in Brum,not long after she'd been elected as an MP and Jane Fonda at Glide Church in San Francisco.Both were bucket collections.

So they were raising money for their respective causes, yes? Good, glad we've cleared that up.

With regard to Bernadette Devlin. Your saying you were quite happily supporting financially the IRSP? (1974) A radical breakaway group of Sinn Fein and a woman who openly supported the hunger strikers of 80/81 and was officially barred from entering the US on the grounds that she posed a serious threat to their security.

That now throws a little more light on where you stand with regard to a lot of political and social issues that effect us here in the UK nowadays.

Shrimpers are Magic said:

Your talking bollox - sorry, My friend, your talking bollox.

Click to expand...

I've just checked and no, no I'm not. So that's all cleared up now.

And you spelt bollocks incorrectly. Twice.
Oh and you spelt you're incorrectly. Twice.

I accept your apology though so thanks for that.

Bielzibubz said:

So they were raising money for their respective causes, yes? Good, glad we've cleared that up.

With regard to Bernadette Devlin. Your saying you were quite happily supporting financially the IRSP? (1974) A radical breakaway group of Sinn Fein and a woman who openly supported the hunger strikers of 80/81 and was officially barred from entering the US on the grounds that she posed a serious threat to their security.

That now throws a little more light on where you stand with regard to a lot of political and social issues that effect us here in the UK nowadays.

Click to expand...

Nope.

(As I said) this was in the early 70's -Not long after she was re-elected as an MP.Probably 1971/2.

She spoke about the "Bloody Sunday" Derry shootings by British paras. (which she, of course, had witnessed first hand) and IIRC, the buckets were to support the families of the bereaved.

A worthy cause indeed.

Labour ignore Muslim women fighting for election !!

Appear's Muslim women are being undermined by Muslim males in the race for votes,they even allow segregation between male and female,a Labour choose to turn a blind eye according to one of the leading Muslim women.

Shame on Labour.

'In both cases I was contributing to the speaker's expenses, not directly to the IRA nor the Black Panthers'

'She spoke about the "Bloody Sunday" Derry shootings by British paras. (which she, of course, had witnessed first hand) and IIRC, the buckets were to support the families of the bereaved'

But that's not what you said was it. You need to be a little clearer in what you say if you don't want to get called out in future.

Anyway, sorry to high jack the thread. As you were

Tangled up in Blue said:

I'm sure JC's defense would be that he contributed funds in support of an individual speaker rather than to Hamas itself.

Click to expand...

It doesn't really matter what his defence would be. He gave money to a proscribed terrorist organisation, which is against the law.

He also keeps some very unsavoury friends, but it doesn't count because they're only anti semitic and that doesn't count as real racism.

londonblue said:

It doesn't really matter what his defence would be. He gave money to a proscribed terrorist organisation, which is against the law.

He also keeps some very unsavoury friends, but it doesn't count because they're only anti semitic and that doesn't count as real racism.

Click to expand...

Can someone please find the link to the Hamas just giving page as i love it when londonblue gets all jewish gangsta on bumas ar,se.

Another Surrey Shrimper said:

I've just checked and no, no I'm not. So that's all cleared up now.

And you spelt bollocks incorrectly. Twice.
Oh and you spelt you're incorrectly. Twice.

I accept your apology though so thanks for that.

Click to expand...

If you had used a phrase such as "My Friend" then I might be more receptive to the bollocks.
Hope the spelling correction is to your satisfaction.

Shrimpers are Magic said:

If you had used a phrase such as "My Friend" then I might be more receptive to the bollocks.
Hope the spelling correction is to your satisfaction.

Click to expand...

That was a poor effort at trying to get the last word.....!

londonblue said:

It doesn't really matter what his defence would be. He gave money to a proscribed terrorist organisation, which is against the law.

He also keeps some very unsavoury friends, but it doesn't count because they're only anti semitic and that doesn't count as real racism.

Click to expand...

For the UK - Hamas is a legal political party but the military wing that is associated are classified as a banned group. The group he was in discussions with are legal.




Hamas were the largest party in Palestine in 2006. If there is ever any chance of peace in the region discussions need to be had with Hamas.




Corbyn is a talker, a pacifist, he talks to people that on some levels he would not benefit from being associated with and when he talks to these people using phrases like 'my friends' in order to have constructive discussion and if a bucket comes round and everyone is throwing a few coins in and he does the same I don't think that should be seen as out and out support. If he is asked 'do you support Hamas' that would be a good way to judge if he supports Hamas.

JC has made clear that he is anti-racist and is not anti Semitic. Hamas are anti Isreal and Isreal are anti Palestinian in terms of them fighting for the same land - it's a very different situation to neo Nazis being anti Semitic and that region needs negotiation. Throwing a few coins in a bucket is not significant when that is seen to be the done thing at a meeting that you are attending. Cameron and the Queen laid on a banquet for the President of China - not because they back the excessive use of the death penalty and the policies in Tibet but because you have to show willing if you are meeting to have constructive discussions.

Another Surrey Shrimper said:

For the UK - Hamas is a legal political party but the military wing that is associated are classified as a banned group. The group he was in discussions with are legal.

Click to expand...

That doesn't seem to be the case based on the document I provided a link to. However, assuming that it is, IMO that doesn't excuse what he did. You simply don't give money to rabid racists. If Camerscum had given money to someone like that you would be all over it.

Another Surrey Shrimper said:

Hamas were the largest party in Palestine in 2006. If there is ever any chance of peace in the region discussions need to be had with Hamas.

Click to expand...

I don't want to turn this into a Hamas thread, as far as I'm concerned this (part of the) thread is about Corduroy, so please allow me to ignore this. Suffice it to say I completely disagree on all counts.

londonblue said:

That doesn't seem to be the case based on the document I provided a link to. However, assuming that it is, IMO that doesn't excuse what he did. You simply don't give money to rabid racists. If Camerscum had given money to someone like that you would be all over it.




I don't want to turn this into a Hamas thread, as far as I'm concerned this (part of the) thread is about Corduroy, so please allow me to ignore this. Suffice it to say I completely disagree on all counts.

Click to expand...

The first thing it states on your link is 'Corbyn may not have an antisemitic bone in his body, but he does share platforms with people who do'. It goes on to analyse people he has shared platforms with. Tbh that fits with his democratic ideals - he talks and negotiates - that is his way.

We can agree to disagree but I would judge him on his actions not those of the people he has shared negotiating space with.

Another Surrey Shrimper said:

The first thing it states on your link is 'Corbyn may not have an antisemitic bone in his body, but he does share platforms with people who do'. It goes on to analyse people he has shared platforms with. Tbh that fits with his democratic ideals - he talks and negotiates - that is his way.

We can agree to disagree but I would judge him on his actions not those of the people he has shared negotiating space with.

Click to expand...

If he's so democratic, and fair minded, how come he's never once had a meeting, or discussed any issues, with any Israelis? He's only pandered to one side.

How's that for judging him by his actions?

londonblue said:

If he's so democratic, and fair minded, how come he's never once had a meeting, or discussed any issues, with any Israelis? He's only pandered to one side.

How's that for judging him by his actions?

Click to expand...

If he hasn't then I could only guess at the reason. Being that they are backed by USA I would hazard a guess that they wouldn't feel the need to extend an invite to a UK backbencher - he was probably never important enough.

Another Surrey Shrimper said:

If he hasn't then I could only guess at the reason. Being that they are backed by USA I would hazard a guess that they wouldn't feel the need to extend an invite to a UK backbencher - he was probably never important enough.

Click to expand...

Don't give me that. You're telling us he's a talker, and democratic. If he's so interested in peace, and not being seen as one sided then he should be talking to both sides. Or are you telling me he's not proactive enough to do so? However, I also happen to know that he has been invited to speak with Jewish organisations in this country, but he hasn't bothered.

As I said, I'm judging him by his actions. The guy meets and gives money to rabid racists, and doesn't meet with the other side even when invited.

He also supports boycotting Israel, which is the only democratic country in the Middle East, and the only country in the ME that treats members of the LGBT community with respect, i.e. it doesn't murder them for being them.

londonblue said:

Don't give me that. You're telling us he's a talker, and democratic. If he's so interested in peace, and not being seen as one sided then he should be talking to both sides. Or are you telling me he's not proactive enough to do so? However, I also happen to know that he has been invited to speak with Jewish organisations in this country, but he hasn't bothered.

As I said, I'm judging him by his actions. The guy meets and gives money to rabid racists, and doesn't meet with the other side even when invited.

He also supports boycotting Israel, which is the only democratic country in the Middle East, and the only country in the ME that treats members of the LGBT community with respect, i.e. it doesn't murder them for being them.

Click to expand...

If you can give me the details of the Jewish invitations he has turned down I will personally write to him and ask why. That's a lot more magnanimous that your 'don't give me that' stance - you are not a poster that I expect to have that approach as I see you as someone who discusses rather than argues.

Isreal being a democracy doesn't negate the fact that they inhabit disputed teritories and I don't claim to be an expert but the books I have read on the region leads me to the conclusion that I would hold Isreal up as an inspiration for many reasons.