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It's been proven time & time again, that a new manager coming into a club can invigorate a team during that initial honeymoon period, and gain the right results, which could turn out to be crucial.

IMO, based on the remaining fixtures we've got, especially between now & February, we're on a hiding to nothing. Injuries galore, a team devoid of confidence & a manager who's more focused on the oppositions tactics, rather than playing to his own teams strengths, doesn't add up to a whole lot of success.

The one single trick we've got left, the one ace up the sleeve that might save us, is to bring in a new face, get us up the table & then reassess the situation once we're safe.

Under Brown, we will be back in the basement next season. And I've been a supporter of Brown up until the last few weeks.

you cant invigorate dads army
 
It's been proven time & time again, that a new manager coming into a club can invigorate a team during that initial honeymoon period, and gain the right results, which could turn out to be crucial.

IMO, based on the remaining fixtures we've got, especially between now & February, we're on a hiding to nothing. Injuries galore, a team devoid of confidence & a manager who's more focused on the oppositions tactics, rather than playing to his own teams strengths, doesn't add up to a whole lot of success.

The one single trick we've got left, the one ace up the sleeve that might save us, is to bring in a new face, get us up the table & then reassess the situation once we're safe.

Under Brown, we will be back in the basement next season. And I've been a supporter of Brown up until the last few weeks.

I remember Thompson coming in as a manager, wow we’re like a different team.. win win, we need fresh ideas.
 
You talk about the anti-Brown brigade as though it’s still the small minority of people that have had it against him since he came here. I’ve been a supporter of Brown until a few weeks ago but he’s not up to the job anymore. You’re the one in the minority now. The Brown-in brigade who think Phil Brown can never do anything wrong, we could lose the next 10 games and you’d probably still be on here defending him. It’s unbelievable.

That is some change of heart in a few weeks. A Few weeks ago he was up to the job - now he certainly isn't. What has changed apart from losing a few games? Did he run over your cat? If he lost the next 10 games than maybe I would agree with you. But he hasn't and his record suggests he won't. He has made mistakes and I've recognised that in previous posts. But haven't you in your job? I'm sure you would expect your employer to look at your performance over an extended period. If you look at PB's over the period he has been with us he us up there with the best we have had - especially when you consider some of the players he inherited (Mohsni, Straker, Barker etc) This is tough at the moment but a change of manager will guarantee you nothing - so why are you so keen to see it? It feels like people are willing to take a huge leap of faith, gamble it all on the spin of a wheel instead of thinking about it logically.
 
Re-read what you have written above. Can you not see one of the glaring flaws in your argument? Are you really suggesting that it is imperative we keep our good AND not-so-good players happy, avoid confrontation with management and worry about the fact that the latter might want to leave? Sounds like a recipe for a race to the bottom if you ask me.

Errr, yeah? You don't think it's imperative to keep the playing staff happy?

Is it really that foreign of a concept? Suggesting that the manager, should try and keep his playing staff happy? It's why he's got the title - manager. To manage his playing staff correctly. Especially considering they are his players, what he's brought in.

Obviously it's a difficult task to keep everyone happy, all of the time, but not an impossible one, especially to a good man-manager. Take Harry Redknapp or Eddie Howe for example, not the best managers, but their players are always willing to run through brick walls for them, as they're good man-managers. Their teams are normally worth more than the sum of their parts. Can we same the same? **** no. The squad we've got on paper, is easily good enough to challenge for a play-off spot, yet we languish in a relegation battle. Could we achieve better, with a better manager? Who knows, but we can't really get much worse.

And we're not talking about trying to keep crap fringe players happy, or players chasing new contracts, or players coming to the end of their career. We're talking our current crop. We're talking about youngsters whose confidence has been shot to pieces. We're talking about seasoned-pro's who have been lambasted, belittled & dropped. We're talking about a squad who have been shamed publicly on numerous occasions.

It clearly adds up to bad management. The kind of bad management that has seen us free-fall towards the drop zone, with no sight of it letting up.
 
There's not a lot of match reports on here - really opinions on Brown - have been done to death - it's all down to the man with the Bentley.

Well today's match. All the geeing up on here and optimism left me feeling that we were in for a surprise today. We all had an inkling that Phil was going to go experienced - but my first surprise was that Southeastern rail were screwing 5% more out of me for the privilege of transporting me from Ashford to Southend. My next surprise was when I read the team sheet -Phil had given a little inkling that there my have been a few positional changes to cover the loss of Lenny, Woody and Nile.
So I saw a back 5, three wingers and a lone Cox, oh and Timlin in midfield. Youth had had its chance - experience was having its day. The slip of lad McLaughlin at 27 being our youngest outfield starter with the usual 7 over 30.

So we had lots of square pegs in round holes and lots of round pegs in square holes and a reversion to a formation that had been tried and failed. The omens now weren't good. Still lets give it a go - it certainly seemed to fool Fleetwood who wanted to be as negative as us. The crowd were not over enthused either - bit like waiting for a funeral.

Well after 45 minutes the stats read Southend 0 shots on target 0 corners Fleetwood 0 shots on target 0 corners.
Demi did deflect one onto the bar though. It was Turner's turn this week to pull a muscle and off he limped to be replaced by Hendrie who was slotted in somewhere between Coker and McLaughlin out on the left flank with Coker playing a very left sided centre back. Player of the month in September Kyprianou didn't get the nod as last week he blasted a clearance into a forward that rebounded to O'Toole and into our goal- the frailties of youth. Highlight for us was when Anton managed to keep his bulk between an attacker and our goal for enough time for a few more to get back. Our engine room of Timlin and Kightly didn't have a lot of oomph. 45 minutes of torture and as exciting as watching paint dry.

Fleetwood weren't much cop either but they were saving themselves for their trip to Leicester on Tuesday. So they only really needed to play for one half.

In the 53rd minute a slight cheer was heard when McLaughlin managed a shot which their keeper had to save. 3 minutes later Paddy Madden came on and a minute later we gave them their first goal - a loose pass from Anton when not under a great deal of pressure gave them possession which we managed to hold off for a couple of passes but they walked it in for 1-0. Fleetwood had scored without really breaking sweat. 5 minutes later they walk through again 2-0 game over.

Why have I really come all this way forking out another £50 to watch this lot . All those promises the players keep making- and don't keep.

With 20 minutes to go we had young Norman joining the fray - it's all right brining him said Phil afterwards because if he make a mistake its unlikely to cost us a goal. What revelation someone who had quick feet, a bit of pace about him and not had his confidence yet eager to please. Well he managed to warm the keepers gloves with one rasping shot and looked really lively -young legs and energy just what we need.

With 4 minutes left we scored could this be the comeback of all time. This is what the BBC website says -
Goal! Southend United 1, Fleetwood Town 2. Michael Kightly (Southend United) right footed shot from very close range to the top left corner.
Don't know what game they were at. Shot for the edge of the box which took a wicked deflection a foot away from Kightly - spun viciously in the air and dropped in behind the keeper who had no chance. Had our luck changed?

Nope Norman could have equalised but didn't quite strike it sweetly enough. It would have been an injustice though if we'd got anything out of the game.

His 20 minute cameo earned him my MoM - it was nice to see some one run with a bit of pace and look like a footballer - at least the trip wasn't completely for nothing.

I thought McLaughlin did OK he had a good tussle with their full back. Cox was isolated as would be expected.

As for Brown and the tactics - come come chum muddled thinking again. Over thinking. Negative crap. He was happy with nil - nil and no shots. Two many tired legs we all get slower as we get older.

At least I'll be a few thousand miles away for the Scunthorpe game.
 
That is some change of heart in a few weeks. A Few weeks ago he was up to the job - now he certainly isn't. What has changed apart from losing a few games? Did he run over your cat? If he lost the next 10 games than maybe I would agree with you. But he hasn't and his record suggests he won't. He has made mistakes and I've recognised that in previous posts. But haven't you in your job? I'm sure you would expect your employer to look at your performance over an extended period. If you look at PB's over the period he has been with us he us up there with the best we have had - especially when you consider some of the players he inherited (Mohsni, Straker, Barker etc) This is tough at the moment but a change of manager will guarantee you nothing - so why are you so keen to see it? It feels like people are willing to take a huge leap of faith, gamble it all on the spin of a wheel instead of thinking about it logically.

yep- he didn't inherit any good players- i see your point.
 
No they didn't. They have some real good strengths as a team but passing on our pitch wasn't one of them. Haven't seen any team lately pass well on our pitch. Yes we have lost 3 out of 4 at RH but Oxley hasn't actually had a lot to do in those games.

The big difference today has been ignored by everyone so far......Paddy Madden.... Showed great skill and strength for both goals. After that he then played some quality first time passes when they were on top.

As soon as Madden came on I knew he'd do some damage. He's a great player at this level.
 
Believe it was actually demi who headed onto the bar from his normal on the goal line position.

Yep, you're right. Just seen the highlights. My bad.

Good to know there was someone 'intheknow' there! :thumbsup:
 
Want Brown out or not it doesn't matter, what matters now is staying in league one. The way I see it all we can do is vent on here and play our small part and get behind our team on match days. I've vented manager out in the past and normally said manager has gone but only after we've dropped a division and nowone wins in that situation.
 
That is some change of heart in a few weeks. A Few weeks ago he was up to the job - now he certainly isn't. What has changed apart from losing a few games? Did he run over your cat? If he lost the next 10 games than maybe I would agree with you. But he hasn't and his record suggests he won't. He has made mistakes and I've recognised that in previous posts. But haven't you in your job? I'm sure you would expect your employer to look at your performance over an extended period. If you look at PB's over the period he has been with us he us up there with the best we have had - especially when you consider some of the players he inherited (Mohsni, Straker, Barker etc) This is tough at the moment but a change of manager will guarantee you nothing - so why are you so keen to see it? It feels like people are willing to take a huge leap of faith, gamble it all on the spin of a wheel instead of thinking about it logically.

What’s changed apart from losing a few games?

I mean, what really matters eh? Clearly it’s not results.
 
Errr, yeah? You don't think it's imperative to keep the playing staff happy?

Is it really that foreign of a concept? Suggesting that the manager, should try and keep his playing staff happy? It's why he's got the title - manager. To manage his playing staff correctly. Especially considering they are his players, what he's brought in.

Obviously it's a difficult task to keep everyone happy, all of the time, but not an impossible one, especially to a good man-manager. Take Harry Redknapp or Eddie Howe for example, not the best managers, but their players are always willing to run through brick walls for them, as they're good man-managers. Their teams are normally worth more than the sum of their parts. Can we same the same? **** no. The squad we've got on paper, is easily good enough to challenge for a play-off spot, yet we languish in a relegation battle. Could we achieve better, with a better manager? Who knows, but we can't really get much worse.

And we're not talking about trying to keep crap fringe players happy, or players chasing new contracts, or players coming to the end of their career. We're talking our current crop. We're talking about youngsters whose confidence has been shot to pieces. We're talking about seasoned-pro's who have been lambasted, belittled & dropped. We're talking about a squad who have been shamed publicly on numerous occasions.

It clearly adds up to bad management. The kind of bad management that has seen us free-fall towards the drop zone, with no sight of it letting up.

Maybe in the twilight world that you are living in. The same world that those owners of Leeds Utd, Nottingham Forest, Birmingham and Coventry have in recent years. I'm living in the real world and, in terms of hiring and firing of managers so thankfully, is Ron Martin.

do you honestly think that players playing under Eddie Howe, Harry Redknapp or anyone else for that matter are happy when they are out of the team for any length of the time or for instance happy to sign a 1 year contract at the age of 29/30 when another club offers them 2 or 3 years? Get real. They are players not supporters. They are earning a living not parting with their hard earned cash to be at RH like us on a Saturday afternoon. If someone wants to pay them more, play them more, give them longer job security they will go. It is a merry go round. No more no less. Think of the players that have come here because they have become disenfranchised with who they played for - for exactly the same reason. If the captain of Millwall is considering comin here it won't be because he is getting plenty of game time at Millwall at the moment or that he still has four years on a lucrative contract! He will be trying to use our interest to force Millwall's hand one way or the other and at his age (play me more, extend my contract or let me go to a club that will) nobody will blame him. Their fans won't care either because the moment they are doing okay without him.

and by the way if you have been following Southend for any length of time things can get much, much worse.
 
What’s changed apart from losing a few games?

I mean, what really matters eh? Clearly it’s not results.

It is ultimately ALL about results. But ultimately it depends over what period you think it is fair to judge someone. With the highs and lows of football I don't think taking the last 10 results in isolation in the number of games he has managed Blues (got to be 200ish?) leads me to believe a change NOW is the right thing for the club. In fact definitely not.

You think however it's enough to warrant him losing his job with immediate effect and that a change is the only way we can rescue our season That is where we fundamentally differ on Brown and our current predicament. Let us leave it at that because I suspect people are getting bored with this now. We are just going around in circles.
 
It is ultimately ALL about results. But ultimately it depends over what period you think it is fair to judge someone. With the highs and lows of football I don't think taking the last 10 results in isolation in the number of games he has managed Blues (got to be 200ish?) leads me to believe a change NOW is the right thing for the club. In fact definitely not.

You think however it's enough to warrant him losing his job with immediate effect and that a change is the only way we can rescue our season That is where we fundamentally differ on Brown and our current predicament. Let us leave it at that because I suspect people are getting bored with this now. We are just going around in circles.

The writing has been on the wall all season. The last 10 games are just highlighting how bad the season has been in general and this is the culmination. Wrong players signed, lack of passion in games, dressing room differences between Cox and Brown, constant injuries to players. You back Brown all you like but don't come crying when we end up in L2
 
It is ultimately ALL about results. But ultimately it depends over what period you think it is fair to judge someone. With the highs and lows of football I don't think taking the last 10 results in isolation in the number of games he has managed Blues (got to be 200ish?) leads me to believe a change NOW is the right thing for the club. In fact definitely not.

You think however it's enough to warrant him losing his job with immediate effect and that a change is the only way we can rescue our season That is where we fundamentally differ on Brown and our current predicament. Let us leave it at that because I suspect people are getting bored with this now. We are just going around in circles.

Duplicate post for some reason
 
Maybe in the twilight world that you are living in. The same world that those owners of Leeds Utd, Nottingham Forest, Birmingham and Coventry have in recent years. I'm living in the real world and, in terms of hiring and firing of managers so thankfully, is Ron Martin.

do you honestly think that players playing under Eddie Howe, Harry Redknapp or anyone else for that matter are happy when they are out of the team for any length of the time or for instance happy to sign a 1 year contract at the age of 29/30 when another club offers them 2 or 3 years? Get real. They are players not supporters. They are earning a living not parting with their hard earned cash to be at RH like us on a Saturday afternoon. If someone wants to pay them more, play them more, give them longer job security they will go. It is a merry go round. No more no less. Think of the players that have come here because they have become disenfranchised with who they played for - for exactly the same reason. If the captain of Millwall is considering comin here it won't be because he is getting plenty of game time at Millwall at the moment or that he still has four years on a lucrative contract! He will be trying to use our interest to force Millwall's hand one way or the other and at his age (play me more, extend my contract or let me go to a club that will) nobody will blame him. Their fans won't care either because the moment they are doing okay without him.

and by the way if you have been following Southend for any length of time things can get much, much worse.

What is it with this inferiority complex that so many Sourhend fans are happy to bear?
Juat because it has been (and can get) “much much worse”, why should people expect or have to accept that outcome? We have come a long way in the last 15 years, and I would consider us one of the usual suspects when it comes to considering which upwardly mobile clubs will be challenging each season.
Just because we have been floating between levels 3 and 4 on the pyramid for most of our history, why should people accept the fraudulent performances and ramblings of a manager that has lost his marbles, week in week out?
We are going down with this clown in charge, and based on the recent performance levels, I’d go as far as saying the players are playing to get him sacked - so this is a very serious situation which is close to being irreversible unless Rob Martin bites the financial bullet and does the right thing by the club.
Do you really think we would bounce straight back if we got relegated, because that is exactly where we are headed.
We are a League One club with Championship desires and most fans want to look upwards not wallow in how small a club we are and how things can always get worse...have some ambition man.
 
Please put you r reports here.

Do not spoil this thread with comments regarding our dynamic manager, thanks.


Our game plan was to pass it around, no target man etc and try and have some mobility against their big defenders. Sometimes some of the players did this. much of the time the simple plan was ignored and players reverted to the same old rubbish.

AND this thread quickly went the same way. 11 pages and about 20 (tops) actual match reports.:facepalm:
 
Yep, you're right. Just seen the highlights. My bad.

Good to know there was someone 'intheknow' there! :thumbsup:

Good goal line save really though he did head it up rather than out. It did come at him very fast and he could easily have missed it. He was in the right place at the right time so credit where it's due
 
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