Alleged Racism at Woking game

[Melton Shrimper]

Two or three Woking players were walking from their supporters post match and got level with their dugout. One of our supporters shouted "get back in your cage". This is verbatim and was heard by stewards, our cameraman and Woking director who was following me down the Directors stairs towards the pitch.

One white, one black Woking player stopped, pointed at our supporter and had to be moved from the scene by several of us as the potential for an inflamed situation ( our supporters were exiting past the dugouts towards two very animated players who felt one was racially abused by those comments ) was growing by the second. Emotions were running high so I wanted the players and staff back in the tunnel as I'd already told them that several people, me included, heard the comments clearly and staying where they were had the potential for the situation to accelerate quickly.

A Woking player asked if something would be done, and I responded that the Police had been informed and everyone who heard the comments had passed this on to the Police. I then asked the Police if they wanted to chat to the player as he felt he was racially abused ( supporter protested that there were no racial motivations) , and the player, his manager and I listened to Essex Police ask "would you like to make a racially aggravated complaint ". He responded "yes".

It is now being dealt with by Police.

Thanks for the information.

 

[wivs]

I asked the Police last night how the process works when deciding on a caution or arrest or no action when words said aren't "open and shut " (the difference between calling someone a black xxxx which has no ambiguity compared to get back in your cage which, as outlined by many above could have racial motivation or none whatsoever).

The answer was straightforward and a lesson for us all.

"If a victim believes there was racial motivation then we as Police will act. The victim decides and we escalate from there".

But then who is actually the victim when there was a number of Woking players walking off ? Surely then someone can almost choose to be a victim even if it wasn't directed at them.

 

[meerkat54]

In 43 years on this planet I've never once heard a single person use the phrase "get back in your cage". In your box, absolutely, but cage has pretty ****ing clear racial connotations.

Maybe the guy didn't mean it that way and that's for the authorities to decide but its a dreadful look for SUFC, especially if someone has got physical with a player too.

With due respect I think you may be living a sheltered life .
The phrase ‘get back in your cage’ has been quite commonly used when I spent most of my life on construction sites.
Perhaps not so much today but certainly popular say 20 or so years ago.

 

[hlane17]

Going off the quotes I received on this, we still have a long way to go in our country with regards to racism. Embarrassing how our fans have raced to back the corner of someone who has allegedly been racist.

Highlighted the keyword here and this is why I'm keeping an open mind until we hear the raw facts.

All I have said in this thread is that the alleged racist statement on its own doesn't appear to have been said with malicious intent.

One of the key principles of criminal law in this country is innocent until proven guilty.

Not instant punishment via mob justice like Woking FC tried to instigate with their tweet, which could turn out to be defamatory if the actual facts contradict their view on the incident.

The guy was interviewed by police so it's in their hands now and we'll hear the full story soon enough. In the meantime cool heads are required.

 

[Grayson]

Going off the quotes I received on this, we still have a long way to go in our country with regards to racism. Embarrassing how our fans have raced to back the corner of someone who has allegedly been racist.

It isn't as binary as that IMO. Understanding and communication are both a two-way street. We've established it's an old person, and we know what was said. We all know someone of his generation has dozens of insults, phrases, words that would come to his mind far more easily if he genuinely is racist.

I can see how the Woking player has interpreted it as a racist comment whilst also see that it's entirely plausible for it to have never been intended that way. It is possible for both of those things to be true.

It doesn't lessen the impact for the victim, and we should be mindful of that, but the culprit may also be mortified at what has happened. As a post says above, cool heads are required.

 

[Texas Eslan]

A lot of white people on here not understanding how this a) could be a racist comment, or b) could be taken as a racist comment.

Weird that

So on the basis that I assume you offer a non-white perspective could you please share that insight on here?

 

[Evening Echo]

SOUTHEND United will take firm action against any supporter found guilty of racism.

Read more on this story


Help with Echo links

 

[Beefy]

With due respect I think you may be living a sheltered life .
The phrase ‘get back in your cage’ has been quite commonly used when I spent most of my life on construction sites.
Perhaps not so much today but certainly popular say 20 or so years ago.

With respect you're talking disingenuous nonsense imo.

But sure by all means.

 

[Shrimper]

Going off the quotes I received on this, we still have a long way to go in our country with regards to racism. Embarrassing how our fans have raced to back the corner of someone who has allegedly been racist.

Innocent until proven guilty, no?

 

[CanveyCastle]

I spoke to the person concerned who was referring to the players as "animals".

Quite relevant to being in cages,

Perhaps he felt, after just seeing the actions of the fighting Woking players they should be caged as being wild.

 

[blueblueblue]

How do you know the posters are all white?

Well said, I was going to say the same thing.

 

[Chris Powell's mate]

It's interesting the polarised comments here.
Those using expressions like 'snowflake' and 'woke' are mostly sceptical of any racist incident.
The mods won't allow political comment and rightly so, but you would expect that in right wing commentary.
I agree with an earlier poster that I've never heard the expression 'get back in your cage.' Who rattled your cage, yes, but that's clearly different, no?
One thing's clear.
Enough folk heard the comment, so if deemed to be racist, a life ban is appropriate.

 

[hlane17]

But then who is actually the victim when there was a number of Woking players walking off ? Surely then someone can almost choose to be a victim even if it wasn't directed at them.

Not only this, but the alleged in this case gets very little opportunity to defend themselves.

As long as there is perceived offence, he's likely going to be charged and subsequently banned from SUFC regardless of what he meant.

I think it could end up being quite unfair if he was using an old phrase as an older man with no intention of malice, it may be easily misinterpreted by younger football players.

As I've said before we don't have the full story so we'll see if this turns out to be the case.

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

Going off the quotes I received on this, we still have a long way to go in our country with regards to racism. Embarrassing how our fans have raced to back the corner of someone who has allegedly been racist.

We have a long way to go. The way we get there is to learn.

I think this is similar to the Danny Baker royal baby twitterstorm. I happen to think that Danny Baker didn’t mean it in the way it was perceived by many. It was an error of judgement on his behalf (something he’s admitted) but I believe it was an innocent mistake. We are all human. We all make mistakes. I’d suggest the focus here should be on learning from them.

 

[Chris Powell's mate]

I think one of the players (Their 8 Daly??) who took offence to the comments was the one that was the cause of the bust up just before the final whistle. I think he was the one that took the throw in that was clearly given to us.

To me he looked like he had too much adrenaline pumping around him to fully understand the full context of what may have been said.

As has been said before the English language can be used in so many different ways. After witnessing a throw in given as Southends but taken to purely waste time by the Woking player which then created a coming together between both sets of players and the Woking players also getting involved with the crowd, describing the resulting woking players as behaving like animals and telling them to get back in their cages is clearly being used a as metaphor for what had gone on not 10 minutes before.

Shouting out "You behaved in an appalling manner for footballers who some may see as idols or role models, now please make you way back to the changing rooms and embark you coach forthwith" doesn't quite have the same punch to it.

...but is more reasoned, if highly unlikely to be said.
This 'metaphor' you speak of? That's got to be interpretive?

 

[bazzashrimper]

'Get back in your box' has about a million Google hits giving me all sorts of pages telling me usages of it in popular culture and its etymology as a phrase.

'Get back in your cage' does not.

The guy may not have meant it in a racist way, and maybe in the moment it just completely came out wrong and he said the wrong word but let's not gaslight each other by pretending that's a regular everyday thing that white people say, or ever have said, to each other.

I agree. I haven’t heard that phrase before. Others may have. I expect that there is a reasonable legal process to best treat these situations. I suggest to trust that verdict will be better than many of us on here will work out. We are all football experts after all and probably not all experts in social sciences too.

 

[Chris Powell's mate]

Highlighted the keyword here and this is why I'm keeping an open mind until we hear the raw facts.

All I have said in this thread is that the alleged racist statement on its own doesn't appear to have been said with malicious intent.

One of the key principles of criminal law in this country is innocent until proven guilty.

Not instant punishment via mob justice like Woking FC tried to instigate with their tweet, which could turn out to be defamatory if the actual facts contradict their view on the incident.

The guy was interviewed by police so it's in their hands now and we'll hear the full story soon enough. In the meantime cool heads are required.

I agree, but with one caveat.
A racist statement IS malicious by definition.

 

[Tommy2holes]

I'm always saying to my other half.

Whos rattled your cage, or get back in your cage.

It's just a saying that people say. I think that this has been taken well out of context.

 

[Chris Powell's mate]

Not only this, but the alleged in this case gets very little opportunity to defend themselves.

As long as there is perceived offence, he's likely going to be charged and subsequently banned from SUFC regardless of what he meant.

I think it could end up being quite unfair if he was using an old phrase as an older man with no intention of malice, it may be easily misinterpreted by younger football players.

As I've said before we don't have the full story so we'll see if this turns out to be the case.

I don't think being old is a defence.
Forty years ago bananas were thrown at the feet of John Barnes. We've learned from that. Age doesn't preclude change for the better.

 

[hlane17]

I'm always saying to my other half.

Whos rattled your cage, or get back in your cage.

It's just a saying that people say. I think that this has been taken well out of context.

I've heard it mainly from older family members. It is a phrase maybe not heard as often nowadays and could be easily misconstrued by someone who doesn't know what it means.

Might well be a case of wrong place, wrong time, wrong words. But people intent on tearing this guy apart already should remember that everyone is human and therefore imperfect as @Yorkshire Blue says.