Callum Taylor

[Chalky]

Glad you aren’t the manager then. Not really sure how those players compare anyway. Halford was signed to cover a number of different positions, none of those players do. Hart is a left back, none of those players are. Cordner is probably a better player than MMN at this stage of his career. And Goodship was already at the club.

Okay, I will compare then, Tom Clifford is best LB at the club. Cordner is most probably ahead of MMN, but Cordner is merely a backup. Just use Kyp or MMN as backup, and within 12 to 18 months they will develop. Just like our other young players who we have sold to keep the club alive. Our academy is the only bright thing about our football club.

 

[Chalky]

Some games were enjoyable, for sure. The young players played with a lot of desire but many were out of their depth. When Sol Campbell joined we were 8 points off safety, by the time the season was cancelled we were 16 points off safety. I get the feeling if MM produced a similar result you wouldn’t be so positive.

I disagree, some were for sure, but most held their own. Hence why we actually started to enjoy going to Roots Hall again and actually got results.

I feel sorry for some these young players, they have got the blame for when we had that 16 game winless streak. Despite the fact that most of the starting lineups averaged 1 or 2 youth players and the fact that some of our 'Senior' players played ****ing atrocious.

Same senior players who have still got careers in the game while some of the young boys have got to graft again to prove their worth, which is based on a false narrative.

 

[Danshrimper]

Okay, I will compare then, Tom Clifford is best LB at the club. Cordner is most probably ahead of MMN, but Cordner is merely a backup. Just use Kyp or MMN as backup, and within 12 to 18 months they will develop. Just like our other young players who we have sold to keep the club alive. Our academy is the only bright thing about our football club.

Wasn’t Clifford injured when we signed Hart? It was a sensible signing at the time. He hasn’t been as good as he was for us in L1 and I agree that Clifford is better but he is still a valuable player to have in the squad. If Clifford gets injured again who plays LB for the rest of the season if we didn’t sign Hart?

I’m not worried about 12 or 18 months time, we’re in a relegation battle. If Cordner is a better player than Kyprianou and MMN then why on earth would we want them as backup instead? What if White or Hobson gets injured? 15 games to go in a relegation battle at the bottom of L2 isn’t the time to be gambling on youth team players in the hope they’ll be good in a couple of years.

 

[Chalky]

Wasn’t Clifford injured when we signed Hart? It was a sensible signing at the time. He hasn’t been as good as he was for us in L1 and I agree that Clifford is better but he is still a valuable player to have in the squad. If Clifford gets injured again who plays LB for the rest of the season if we didn’t sign Hart?

I’m not worried about 12 or 18 months time, we’re in a relegation battle. If Cordner is a better player than Kyprianou and MMN then why on earth would we want them as backup instead? What if White or Hobson gets injured? 15 games to go in a relegation battle at the bottom of L2 isn’t the time to be gambling on youth team players in the hope they’ll be good in a couple of years.

That paragraph I do agree with. I am guilty of being biased towards the young lads as I know a few trusted staff within the setup. But I still stand by that I wouldn't have extended Halfords contract and a few others, but thats done now.

It's a shame that certain higher up man in the boardroom allowed us to get this point where we have to drastically change strategy

 

[rigsby]

It seems you want to have an argument ?

I merely said I it was good watching them.

I really don't expect anyone to agree with me but I really enjoyed Sol Campbells
time at Roots Hall.

Shame the players and staff didn't enjoy his time at RH. We might still have Humphrys and Kelman and be the other end of the table.

 

[Fairport]

Some interesting opinions regarding our young players. It will be interesting to see where the likes of Kyps, Kinali, Klass, etc are next season or the one after that. Unfortunately I predict that an awful lot of them will be plying their trade at non league level. (Not with SUFC!).

 

[rigsby]

There are only two options when a young player leaves our club.

A) If the player goes to a better club we slag them and claim its a bad move and they wont make it at that level. Got greedy, must have a good agent etc.

B) If the player is released them we slag the club, including current manger. Even though it will probably be RD's decision. We then claim some sort of unfairness or personal reason, especially if we know nothing about them. Some will state as a fact that it will come back to haunt us.......Anyone seen any ghosts in the past few years? Or do some of our staff actually know more about young players that anyone on here?

Other options aren't available. The young lad is just another one of those 99% who don't make it but at least he got to the final 10........Would be far to simple as an explanation.

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

I don't have an issue with him not playing, but clearly the most disappointing thing to read, is the fact that he wasn't even training with the other keepers, let alone the first team.

That is really poor from MM IMO.

We're likely to lose Oxley after this season, so we could have had Taylor and Seadon fighting for the No1 slot next season.

As @Ricey has already said - that's presumably to do with covid bubbles. The u23s train separate to the u18s and the first team to avoid contaminating each other. I'd expect (and hope) that this is a temporary thing and I'd hope by next season that's gone and those groups can mix more easily.

I really feel for Callum. It's a horrible situation to find yourself in and with covid also affecting players ability to go out and get games on loan.

Bit harsh to say that already! When Cheltenham came to Roots Hall in 2011/2012 (not sure which one) a young Jack Butland was on loan from Birmingham. He had an absolute shocker and not one person who was at that game would ever imagine he would go onto play for England! In a position that there is only one of!

I’m not saying Hutchinson is going to play for England but to write him off after 45 minutes of his first start(?) for a club he has joined on loan where they all played pretty poorly is very harsh!

He said worse about Corr and we know how that turned out so I wouldn't be unduly worried if I was Isaac!

Some interesting opinions regarding our young players. It will be interesting to see where the likes of Kyps, Kinali, Klass, etc are next season or the one after that. Unfortunately I predict that an awful lot of them will be plying their trade at non league level. (Not with SUFC!).

It appears MM has no time for the KKK.

 

[Mad Cyril]

If the club don't think he is good enough then that is good enough for me.

 

[Rayleigh boy]

Some games were enjoyable, for sure. The young players played with a lot of desire but many were out of their depth. When Sol Campbell joined we were 8 points off safety, by the time the season was cancelled we were 16 points off safety. I get the feeling if MM produced a similar result you wouldn’t be so positive.

I am sure we have to be positive and support MM - and now the chairman has put a lot of resources his way.

But he has made loads of mistakes that have cost us loads of points and now the goal keeping situation is not great. when perhaps a bit of foresight and forward planning might have prevented this ..

Anyway I hope really Seadon gets the opportunity and makes a massive success of it !!!

 

[Rayleigh boy]

Shame the players and staff didn't enjoy his time at RH. We might still have Humphrys and Kelman and be the other end of the table.

I thought Campbell was long gone before they left... .. but I am not one for endless fact checking.

I would have thought Kelman was delighted to have a manager who played him.

I don't talk to any players so have no idea what they thought but being popular is not a necessary prerequisite to success in any field.

It is now seems a long time ago but I thought he did alright and it amuses me how sensitive the anti Sol people are about it all.

Certainly some of the posting on here was extremely questionable ;-)

 

[Holy Joe]

I think the U23's just need to be patient this season - the opportunities thay had last year were probably too soon for most of them. There will be a number of the first team squad that are out of contract in the summer, that will lead to opportunities next season.

 

[Leigh_Seasider]

I don't talk to any players so have no idea

Maybe you should?

 

[Exiled Shrimper]

In fairness, that is taken a bit out of context. From our 6th game of the season when we lost 2-0 to Cheltenham at home, only 1 academy player started. Admittedly the bench was filled with kids, but since our 6th game we have averaged between 1 & 2 youth players starting.

I get why MM is doing this, but from what I am hearing he is a bit spooked about using young players at the moment. Which is understandable considering our first couple games of the season, but the problem is he has lost a little perspective and forgetting that some of them are actually good players.

Eren Kinali is a big example, along with Michael Klass/Harry Phillips. You cannot tell me that a Greg Halford, Brandon Goodship or even a Sam Hart is any better than them. Same with Tyler Cordner, waste of a wage, could just put Kyprianou on the bench. Kyp held his own in league 1. And from people I trust at the club (my source is within the u23 set up) there is a bit of concern.

I believe Callum Taylors father is on this forum, he would have a lot to say, trust me. Some of the u23s have been dealt harshly just because a full team of them is a bit much. But individually some of them are real talents.

An example is Tom Clifford, couple months ago couldn't get in the team, when it is evident he is a much better player than Sam Hart. Tom is now our top goal scorer lol

But I don't want to rant too much, because I have really warmed to MM. What he is doing works to be fair to him. It just needs balance.

But youth players have served us well for a few years now (transfer fees and contributing to playing). Give me a Egbri, Kinali, Clifford over a Goodship/Hart any day.

Some really interesting points raised in this post, I think, although the situation is probably quite nuanced.

It's worth remembering that Mark Molesley was an Academy coach at AFC Bournemouth, who are a Category Three Academy like us. They might've been playing in the Premier League during his time there, but their Academy games programme was the same as ours (just in the south-west rather than the south-east), and at U18 and U23 level we came across Bournemouth quite a lot in that time.

Despite that, when he came in here, he wouldn't've known too much about our own young players. I'm sure in the initial weeks and months he studied what they did, he'll've spoken to Ricky Duncan and Craig Fagan, but it was quickly apparent we we fighting a relegation battle, and in that type of situation it's natural to look to experience. It would be true to say that he did bring in some youngsters, but a couple of those in Hobson and Kyle Taylor he was already aware about and knew what they would be able to contribute (or at least had an idea).

The bigger picture is that relegation would mean the Academy itself would become a ticking time-bomb. Relegated clubs receive funding for two seasons after dropping out of the EFL, so you need to get back into the league within that time or completely subsidise the Academy to maintain it's place. As generous as Ron Martin has been towards the Academy, it's unlikely his finances would stretch to that.

So, even if MM would like to promote more Academy players, he's got to make sure that we retain our league status, or the promise of future Elvis Bwomonos, Charlie Kelmans, Tom Cliffords and Nathan Bishops deteriorates.

I also think the picture is a little more rosy in terms of Academy representation. Following Saturday's match, almost a quarter (82 of 341 starts) in the league have been given to Academy graduates. Elvis has started almost every league game outside of his international call-up, Terrell Egbri was virtually ever-present until his injury and Clifford and Acquah have both started almost half (15 out of 31) league games this season.

 

[rigsby]

I thought Campbell was long gone before they left... .. but I am not one for endless fact checking.

I would have thought Kelman was delighted to have a manager who played him.

I don't talk to any players so have no idea what they thought but being popular is not a necessary prerequisite to success in any field.

It is now seems a long time ago but I thought he did alright and it amuses me how sensitive the anti Sol people are about it all.

Certainly some of the posting on here was extremely questionable ;-)

Neither did Sol....Unless it was a txt via their girlfriends phone.

 

[flangejackrabbit]

George Murray-Jones. He’s still a schoolboy but he’s attended a training camp with England U16s already. Fin Purcell has also already played for our U18s and U23s as a schoolboy.

Our goalkeeping conveyor belt has been quite extraordinary, really (with massive credit to Terry Mason, Reece Otley and others).

Hopefully Callum Taylor can find another club quickly and show what he’s capable of, having represented his country at U16 and U17 level.

If Murray-Jones is seen as being ahead of CT now then I suppose it's a sensible decision for all concerned, though still a shame as I did like what I saw of CT.

 

[Rayleigh boy]

Maybe you should?

I don't know any of the players personally or through family and live quite a way away and am not sure when I do see players on match days having to deal with fans questions (politely and positively and without giving anything away) that it adds much.

the things I have heard first hand about another professional sport does suggest that what really goes down in very different from what is reported or known about on the outside ..

I have always assumed that the "in the know" posting do have the inside track on things but my colleague at work dismisses this..

 

[Danshrimper]

I disagree, some were for sure, but most held their own. Hence why we actually started to enjoy going to Roots Hall again and actually got results.

I feel sorry for some these young players, they have got the blame for when we had that 16 game winless streak. Despite the fact that most of the starting lineups averaged 1 or 2 youth players and the fact that some of our 'Senior' players played ****ing atrocious.

Same senior players who have still got careers in the game while some of the young boys have got to graft again to prove their worth, which is based on a false narrative.

The ones that held their own are still within the squad. The ones that didn’t and weren’t quite ready aren’t. It’s harsh but that’s football. They were never all going to keep their place in the squad unless we wanted to get relegated again.

And I don’t think anyone blamed the youth players for the 16 game winless streak. They gave their all. One man took most of the blame and I certainly wouldn’t describe him as youthful.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Bit harsh to say that already! When Cheltenham came to Roots Hall in 2011/2012 (not sure which one) a young Jack Butland was on loan from Birmingham. He had an absolute shocker and not one person who was at that game would ever imagine he would go onto play for England! In a position that there is only one of!

I’m not saying Hutchinson is going to play for England but to write him off after 45 minutes of his first start(?) for a club he has joined on loan where they all played pretty poorly is very harsh!

Guilty as charged. (It was his first start apparently for them btw).Can't say I ever really rated him with us either.

 

[rigsby]

I don't know any of the players personally or through family and live quite a way away and am not sure when I do see players on match days having to deal with fans questions (politely and positively and without giving anything away) that it adds much.

the things I have heard first hand about another professional sport does suggest that what really goes down in very different from what is reported or known about on the outside ..

I have always assumed that the "in the know" posting do have the inside track on things but my colleague at work dismisses this..

Like all institutions and businesses their are circles of secrecy. Depending on what is involved then its right that not everyone should know. Fans are out there on the last ring before the general public.

What i can tell you is some people on here do get to hear or know stuff. Some of it might be personal, so i personally would not mention that on here. Nor if i thought some on here would use it against certain players or the club.

Even as we speak there are things that would not help our situation if they were public. If your work colleagues want to dismiss that then fine. Its best they don't know anyway.

In Sols case then it should be public because he knew exactly what he was doing and knew the consequences of his actions. Especially when he has bleated to the world that he has been overlooked because of his race.