Efe's game tonight

[londonblue]

Does anyone else think this is a scandalous match? The idea behind the game is to help raise money towards a £300,000 FA fine. The offence was fraud. They took money given to them by the FA for ground improvements and used it for something else.

I can understand the footballing world rallying round for some things, like helping a club out of difficulty when a chairman has stripped the club bare, but when it is fraud against the footballing world, why should anyone else help them out?

 

[overseas shrimper]

Good point.

 

[Napster]

Why should a club be punished for something carried out by the previous administration?

Imagine if we were similarly punished after Ron had done something dodgy then he legged it. I can only hope we get the support Macc have got.

Punish the man, not the club!

 

[chaco27saf]

Well, the consequences for not paying the fine are quite steep, according the official site:

Quote[/b] ]The Silkman were granted three months to repay the money or face explosion from the Football League.

 

[Shrimp in a Kilt]

Quote[/b] (Napster @ Feb. 07 2006,13:16)]Why should a club be punished for something carried out by the previous administration?

Imagine if we were similarly punished after Ron had done something dodgy then he legged it. I can only hope we get the support Macc have got.

Punish the man, not the club!

Exactly. And the people who end up paying in the end are the punters.

In fact they didn't take money and use it for something else:

Quote[/b] ]Football Foundation regulations forbid clubs to receive any more than 80% of the total funding for any construction project but it has now been established the payment eventually covered the entire cost.

Whole sorry tale here....

 

[overseas shrimper]

Quote[/b] (Napster @ Feb. 07 2006,14:16)]Why should a club be punished for something carried out by the previous administration?

Imagine if we were similarly punished after Ron had done something dodgy then he legged it. I can only hope we get the support Macc have got.

Punish the man, not the club!

So if we sold a player to a club, having agreed (with their chairman on behalf of the club) a large fee to be paid at a later date... would the club not owe us the money if that chairman hot footed it out of there?

 

[Shrimp in a Kilt]

Quote[/b] (overseas shrimper @ Feb. 07 2006,13:30)]

Quote[/b] (Napster @ Feb. 07 2006,14:16)]Why should a club be punished for something carried out by the previous administration?

Imagine if we were similarly punished after Ron had done something dodgy then he legged it. I can only hope we get the support Macc have got.

Punish the man, not the club!

So if we sold a player to a club, having agreed (with their chairman on behalf of the club) a large fee to be paid at a later date... would the club not owe us the money if that chairman hot footed it out of there?

Unfair comparison, OS. Imagine how you would be feeling if it was found that Vic Jobson had been involved in similar underhand dealings*, and we were now, years later, fined £300K and or docked points?




*Of course, this is just an example, I can't imagine that Uncle Vic would have done anything in the least like this.

 

[canveyshrimper]

Quote[/b] (Shrimp in a Kilt @ Feb. 07 2006,13:33)]

Quote[/b] (overseas shrimper @ Feb. 07 2006,13:30)]

Quote[/b] (Napster @ Feb. 07 2006,14:16)]Why should a club be punished for something carried out by the previous administration?

Imagine if we were similarly punished after Ron had done something dodgy then he legged it. I can only hope we get the support Macc have got.

Punish the man, not the club!

So if we sold a player to a club, having agreed (with their chairman on behalf of the club) a large fee to be paid at a later date... would the club not owe us the money if that chairman hot footed it out of there?

Unfair comparison, OS. Imagine how you would be feeling if it was found that Vic Jobson had been involved in similar underhand dealings*, and we were now, years later, fined £300K and or docked points?




*Of course, this is just an example, I can't imagine that Uncle Vic would have done anything in the least like this.

Unlike a certain Anton Johnson, allegedly.

 

[J]

Quote[/b] (Napster @ Feb. 07 2006,13:16)]Imagine if we were similarly punished after Ron had done something dodgy then he legged it.

Punish the man, not the club!

are you trying to predict the future..

 

[Firestorm]

The Fine was 100k the remainder was how much they defrauded and had to pay back.

Presenting bogus invoices is not "under hand dealing" it is obtaining money by deception or Theft.

No doubt the money they whould have spent on the stand was used to fund players who may well have kept them in the league at the expense of a more honest team
In the period concerned 200-2002 they finished 14th, 13th and 16th (interestingly on the same number of points as us in the last two seasons)

I don't think that our players should be used in the raising of funds to pay back stolen money.

The Fine may be argued......

 

[Murkey_Mouse]

Where did the money from the sales of ex SUFC players like of Collymore, Brett Angell & Prior etc. went? prehap to build a sth stand & seating for West Stand, looking at it, its don't cost that much to build & where did the rest of money went? I cannot remeber we spend much on replacing these players & our only big money dealing was Mike Marsh .... I never know.

 

[Firestorm]

Didn't they lose money on the Flats ? that may well of swallowed some of it up. Also wages outweighed income dramatically in our Divison 1 days, our attendances were dreadful.

But that, to a degree, was "Jobsons money" ie he was the owner, this lot took from the FA

 

[Upminster Blue]

Quote[/b] (londonblue @ Feb. 07 2006,13:07)]Does anyone else think this is a scandalous match? The idea behind the game is to help raise money towards a £300,000 FA fine. The offence was fraud. They took money given to them by the FA for ground improvements and used it for something else.

I can understand the footballing world rallying round for some things, like helping a club out of difficulty when a chairman has stripped the club bare, but when it is fraud against the footballing world, why should anyone else help them out?

Couldn't agree more and I posted something similar in all leagues chat when they were first fined.

Let's hope Efe doesn't pick up an injury.

 

[Upminster Blue]

Quote[/b] (Murkey_Mouse @ Feb. 07 2006,13:52)]Where did the money from the sales of ex SUFC players like of Collymore, Brett Angell & Prior etc. went? prehap to build a sth stand & seating for West Stand, looking at it, its don't cost that much to build & where did the rest of money went?  I cannot remeber we spend much on replacing these players & our only big money dealing was Mike Marsh .... I never know.

I think you'll find the rest of the money covered day to day operating losses. Remember, for most of the Division 1 days our crowds were lower than now, admission prices were lower and we were shelling out far more in wages. Before player sales we must have been lossing £1m+ a year in the early to mid nineties.

 

[Upminster Blue]

Quote[/b] (Napster @ Feb. 07 2006,13:16)]Why should a club be punished for something carried out by the previous administration?

Imagine if we were similarly punished after Ron had done something dodgy then he legged it. I can only hope we get the support Macc have got.

Punish the man, not the club!

The fact is that the club is the legal entity that made the fraudulent application and therefore it is the club that should be punished. The directors are meerly the guardians of the club. Whether they should also be barred from football or banned from being company directors is a separate matter.

Ultmately the fraud generated a lot of extra money to subsidise the playing side of the club. Macc spent a hell of a lot of money on players last year, possibly from these ill-gotten gains. How would you have felt if they'd pipped us to promotion as a result?

Final thought, if you defrauded your firm would you expect a wip round when you get caught?

 

[SUFCFARAWAY]

but the fraud at Maccs was because of one man. Why punish everyone else including the fans and players? As previously stated punish the man not the club.

 

[Firestorm]

Quote[/b] (SUFCFARAWAY @ Feb. 07 2006,14:37)]but the fraud at Maccs was because of one man. Why punish everyone else including the fans and players? As previously stated punish the man not the club.

The money was given to the club, not the individual, based on fraudulent information .Therefore the club should pay it back.
The individual did not benefit personally.

 

[Hambone]

At least it shows that Efe is capable of playing a game and is not injured. I hope he doesn't aggravate this injury. That would REALLY annoy me!

 

[shrimperman]

Quote[/b] (Murkey_Mouse @ Feb. 07 2006,13:52)]its don't cost that much to build

i know this getting off subject but believe me, as an architect that stand would have cost alot more than your probable oringinal estimation.

 

[SUFCFARAWAY]

Quote[/b] (Firestorm @ Feb. 07 2006,14:44)]

Quote[/b] (SUFCFARAWAY @ Feb. 07 2006,14:37)]but the fraud at Maccs was because of one man. Why punish everyone else including the fans and players? As previously stated punish the man not the club.

The money was given to the club, not the individual, based on fraudulent information .Therefore the club should pay it back.
The individual did not benefit personally.

ah-ha. i see. then i agree if the money was invested into the club than the club should pay it back. however i do disagree on the length of time they were given to pay it back. i read somewhere that the amount of money maccs had to pay back in that time is the same as asking Man utd to pay back 50 million pounds in the short space of time. 300K is a lot to us. yet along one of the least support teams in the country