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England

Went to Wembley yesterday.

Pretty average showing, bored me to tears to be honest, but par for the course against a side just there to keep the scoreline respectable.

Have to say Jordan Henderson is an absolute beast. Such a workhorse and leader. You wouldn't pick it up on TV, but the bloke is phenomenal, absolutely everywhere and doesn't get the praise he deserves.
Some players don't get the credit until they are not there. You see what you think is average but the coaches/ manager sees differently. It's pretty much always defensive midfielders. I remember when the powers that be wouldn't give Claude Makelele the contract he deserved at Real Madrid and he left. It was the season Beckham arrived and Zidane said "we have put another layer of gold paint on the Roll Royce but we have taken out the engine".
 
It was a poor effort from England sadly.Still think Antonio is a better player than Bamford.
Andorra (so say the Germans),have only 1,000 registered players....
 
Watching players on TV is completely different to watching them in stadiums. It's amazing how different it is. You see movement that you don't see on TV, Emile Heskey and James Milner being two other examples. And Marcus Rashford's pace is absolutely unreal when you watch it live.

I also watched an England v Germany womens friendly a few years back and the difference between the two teams was striking. The Germans were receiving the ball on the half-turn and starting attacks rapidly, whereas England were receiving the ball facing the player and passing it back again even when there was no pressure. You don't see that sort of thing on TV.

There's a reason why Henderson is in the mix for England and Liverpool's key player; @Smiffy was spot on.
In a game against opposition such as Andorra, where we were crying out for some creativity, a 'workhorse' who keeps dropping back in front of his own back line is a waste of space. The number of times he runs to receive a pass then immediately passes the ball back again is plain ridiculous. I've seen him do it time and time again both on TV and live at a game....oh so predictable. Was Southgate really that terrified of Andorra's threat he needed a holding midfielder rather than a creative playmaker?
 
In a game against opposition such as Andorra, where we were crying out for some creativity, a 'workhorse' who keeps dropping back in front of his own back line is a waste of space. The number of times he runs to receive a pass then immediately passes the ball back again is plain ridiculous. I've seen him do it time and time again both on TV and live at a game....oh so predictable. Was Southgate really that terrified of Andorra's threat he needed a holding midfielder rather than a creative playmaker?
Why not trust Smiffy's opinion? He was there.
 
In a game against opposition such as Andorra, where we were crying out for some creativity, a 'workhorse' who keeps dropping back in front of his own back line is a waste of space. The number of times he runs to receive a pass then immediately passes the ball back again is plain ridiculous. I've seen him do it time and time again both on TV and live at a game....oh so predictable. Was Southgate really that terrified of Andorra's threat he needed a holding midfielder rather than a creative playmaker?

Thought that was why Grealish came on? At least the game picked up when the 3 subs were introduced.
 
Why not trust Smiffy's opinion? He was there.
Eh? Why should I be trusting someone else's opinion and not keep to my own? If you're trying to convince me we needed Henderson yesterday then maybe say what he did that was of such great importance to the team against such abject opposition. I'd suggest bordering on zilch!
 
He should have been on instead of Henderson from the start.
Why would Grealish be on instead of Henderson when they play completely different positions? Henderson's a holding midfielder whilst Grealish is a winger. As for why Southgate felt the need for a defensive midfielder it's because this is basically a friendly for us, you want your players to get used to the formation you intend to use against credible opposition, yes we could have just played 8 attacking players and won but that doesn't help the second string team get used to the formation.
 
Eh? Why should I be trusting someone else's opinion and not keep to my own? If you're trying to convince me we needed Henderson yesterday then maybe say what he did that was of such great importance to the team against such abject opposition. I'd suggest bordering on zilch!
While I get what you are saying about the opposition, there still needs to be balance on the pitch, e.g. someone to receive the ball and play it simple, or sit in when a defender goes forward. There's no point in a playmaker coming that deep to get the ball; he should be in the opposition's half.

To give you an example of this, the infamous Gerrard/Lampard partnership was a disaster and you could argue cost England a trophy during the 'golden generation' period (not just my opinion but also that of Alex Ferguson in his second book). By playing both, they were cutting each other in half - one would always have to cover the other and receive the ball in deep areas where they couldn't hurt the opposition. At club level both were used to having a player behind them who could do the dirty work and allow them to play their natural game.

Another example is Ossie Ardiles being sacked by Spurs because he insisted on playing four attacking midfielders, which made them lose points as a result. Gerry Francis came in and made the team more pragmatic.

Henderson also played to protect Bellingham and to win the second balls, which is why he is also an asset at Liverpool. For every Zidane there is a Deschamps, for every Ronaldo there's a Dunga and for every Xabi Alonso there's a Sergio Busquets. Before you spontaneously combust, I'm not comparing Henderson with any of them, except to say that you need different types of players in different parts of the pitch to knit the team together. Otherwise the team becomes a set of individuals, like England were under Erikssen and Belgium before Roberto Martinez took over from Marc Wilmots.

Grealish didn't start because we have a vital game on Wednesday away at Poland, which will be the toughest game in the group.
 
Why would Grealish be on instead of Henderson when they play completely different positions? Henderson's a holding midfielder whilst Grealish is a winger. As for why Southgate felt the need for a defensive midfielder it's because this is basically a friendly for us, you want your players to get used to the formation you intend to use against credible opposition, yes we could have just played 8 attacking players and won but that doesn't help the second string team get used to the formation.
I repeat, why do you need a ‘holding player’ against a side like Andorra????
 
I repeat, why do you need a ‘holding player’ against a side like Andorra????
I answered that in my comment. We were going to beat Andorra no matter what so we treated it as a friendly, we used a holding player because that's what we'll use against better teams and it gets the second string side used to the formation.
 
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Didn't even realise they were playing untill looking at this mornings sports news.
 
It was a so-so game,like Andorra and the first half v Hungary.
a draw was fair.
We knew we were going to qualify,the tests will start in the finals.
 
Southgate, despite his "success" of late shows his tactical naievity. A manager of a 5yr old's teams would have told him to make some substitutions after Kane scored. Freshen it up & change it around but no, and that 1-1 draw felt like a loss.

He's lucky he has a group of some the very best players in the world to carry him or he'd been out on his arse years ago.
 
I repeat, why do you need a ‘holding player’ against a side like Andorra????
Playing a holding midfielder frees up the other midfielders to take up more attacking positions. Instead of all of them sharing defensive duties they give them to one guy and the others push on more. It’s been a staple of Brazilian sides for decades.
 
Southgate, despite his "success" of late shows his tactical naievity. A manager of a 5yr old's teams would have told him to make some substitutions after Kane scored. Freshen it up & change it around but no, and that 1-1 draw felt like a loss.

He's lucky he has a group of some the very best players in the world to carry him or he'd been out on his arse years ago.
I agree that 1-1 felt like a loss but I think most of us would have taken that before the game. If we'd lost, Poland would be 2 points behind us.

To a certain extent it was strange that GS didn't make any changes but we were comfortable and you just know that if he had he would have been panned by everyone for being negative. And to be fair you can't legislate for the terrible defending by Walker and Mount for their equaliser, which was in added time.

Not a dig at you personally but I'm amazed how many people still don't rate GS, or claim he's lucky. In Euro 2016 we lost to Iceland and as I mentioned previously neither SGE nor Capello got the best out of the players they had at their disposal, shoehorning players like Scholes on the left just to have him on the pitch, rather than picking a balanced line-up. Neither got any further than the quarter-finals whereas GS has taken England to two semi-finals and a final. That's no fluke.
 
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