Martin is costing us good players!

[wiggy]

Was Leon Constantine worth more than seven hundred quid, yes or no? I"m sick of Martin's silly games waiting for everyone to come pleading to him when in certain cases it should be the other way round. He won"t be satisfied until we have the best stadium in the conference!

 

[Fat Bastid]

Quote[/b] (wiggy @ May 27 2004,09:12)]Was Leon Constantine worth more than seven hundred quid, yes or no? I"m sick of Martin's silly games waiting for everyone to come pleading to him when in certain cases it should be the other way round. He won"t be satisfied until we have the best stadium in the conference!

For Christ's sake f**k off and find someone who is interested in your misguided opinions!

Wage cap based on club turnover!

That is the prime reason we cannot play bigger wages to match Hull City!

We average 4500 per game x 23 games at £12.00 per head averaged out - Turnstile turn over £ 1,242,000.

Hull must average 12000 per game x 23 games at £12.00 per head averaged out - Turnstile turn over £3,312,000.

Now do you get the picture and see the Ron Martin is not primarily to blame!

So **** off and take your whinges elsewhere!

 

[South Bank Hank]

Perhaps the best approach is to ignore it - it might go away?

 

[Beefy]

Quote[/b] (Prophet of Doom! @ May 27 2004,09:18)]For Christ's sake f**k off and find someone who is interested in your misguided opinions!

Wage cap based on club turnover!

That is the prime reason we cannot play bigger wages to match Hull City!

We average 4500 per game x 23 games at £12.00 per head averaged out - Turnstile turn over £ 1,242,000.

Hull must average 12000 per game x 23 games at £12.00 per head averaged out - Turnstile turn over £3,312,000.

Now do you get the picture and see the Ron Martin is not primarily to blame!

So **** off and take your whinges elsewhere!

I don't think the wage cap is to blame at all. Peterbrough will be subject to that very same wage cap as us from next season and yet they were able to afford to pay what Constantine wanted despite having what I would guess to be roughly the same level of turnover as us.

FWIW I think that if tilly and Ron Martin had thought that Connie was essential to our team then they would have shelled out £1500 a week for him. The fact that he has been shunted out wide in favour of Bramble, Broughton and Dudfield suggests that they don't think that which is why he has left. If Cort and Maher leave then that isn't going to be just about money either. Hull and Sheffield Weds are both big clubs with big crowds and in a higher division. I wouldn't blame either of them for chancing their arm at a higher level.

 

[fbm]

I think you'll find the £700 was a basic which could have been increased significantly through a goal bonus.

That is how his pay was structured I believe this season, and presto! 25 goals.

If Leon was that confident of his ability to score then that actually is a very good deal and puts the earnings firmly in Leons hands... the more he scores, the more he earns. However, if he isn't that confident that he could repeat last seasons performance then he would be more comfortable with the higher basic so that he earned more money without the same level of performance.

So is he worth it then?

I think Tilly had it spot on with him to be honest. I thank Leon for what he's done and wish him well anyway.

 

[Beefy]

Barry Fry is pretty renowned for offering very good bonus schemes. I think the £1500 he is on at Posh is a basic too and will be topped up dramatically should he score a few next year.

Why can't we just move on anyway? Like fbm says, cheers for last year Connie but thats in the past now.

 

[neil]

Quote[/b] (Beefy @ May 27 2004,09:30)]Peterbrough will be subject to that very same wage cap as us from next season and yet they were able to afford to pay what Constantine wanted despite having what I would guess to be roughly the same level of turnover as us.
their arm at a higher level.

The wage cap is based on all turnover, a significant proportion of which is the TV revenue received at the start of every year. Second division sides receive considerably more than those in the third. In fact I think it is at least double.

 

[Beefy]

And our turnover was boosted by two cup runs and a televised game. All I'm saying is that the wage cap is not a good enough reason why we could only offer half of what Peterbrough could.

 

[Andu]

Quote[/b] (Beefy @ May 27 2004,09:48)]And our turnover was boosted by two cup runs and a televised game. All I'm saying is that the wage cap is not a good enough reason why we could only offer half of what Peterbrough could.

The wage cap isn't based on last season, it is based on the expected turnover for the coming season so the cup runs play no part in the figures, and 2nd division sides get extra revenue from the TV deals as already stated

 

[overseas shrimper]

Quote[/b] (Andu @ May 27 2004,11:02)]

Quote[/b] (Beefy @ May 27 2004,09:48)]And our turnover was boosted by two cup runs and a televised game. All I'm saying is that the wage cap is not a good enough reason why we could only offer half of what Peterbrough could.

The wage cap isn't based on last season, it is based on the expected turnover for the coming season so the cup runs play no part in the figures, and 2nd division sides get extra revenue from the TV deals as already stated

Spot on.

Peterborough have more to offer within the wage cap limits... and I think there's a good point that leon was made an offer based on what the management at Roots Hall thought he was worth.

 

[Beefy]

really? fair play.

But the gap in TV revenue between the bottom two divisions really isn't that big. Less than £100k I think, so thats not a huge amount when you look at the bigger picture, especially considering the size of Peterbrough's squad and the number of players they already have on the books who will be earning a fair bit.

If we had wanted to pay Constantine what he wanted we could have done so is all I'm saying.

 

[Andu]

Quote[/b] (Beefy @ May 27 2004,10:18)]really? fair play.

But the gap in TV revenue between the bottom two divisions really isn't that big. Less than £100k I think, so thats not a huge amount when you look at the bigger picture, especially considering the size of Peterbrough's squad and the number of players they already have on the books who will be earning a fair bit.

If we had wanted to pay Constantine what he wanted we could have done so is all I'm saying.

But could we?
If we gave into Constantine and trebled his wages, there is probably a case for other players coming back and asking for more money.
The only way to have done this was offer an acceptable wage and then bump up the goal bonus. If Constantine wanted 3 times his current wage he could then have got it by scoring goals

 

[Beefy]

well it goes back to what we were saying about the club offering him what he thinks he is worth. If we work on the assumption that Maher already earns around the level that Constantine wanted then we can see that the club will pay out a decent wage if and when it feels that the player is worth it. f course if Connie gets that amount then the likes of Gower and Jay Smith are entitled to ask why he should be earling more than them which opens up a whole different can of worms. But if the club had thought him worth it then they may well have considered doing that.

Fact is that Constantine has barely been able to get a game upfront recent if Tilson has been able to select any two of his remaining strikers. That doesn't say much for the level of confidence that the club had in him. They've offered him a contract though and now they can't be accussed by us of not trying to keep our leading scorer, and Constantine has found a club happy to pay his wages. And we get a strike force built around servicing Lawrie Dudfield, a far superior center-forward.

Everyones a winner.

 

[nnatt76]

You have to stop looking at how much "Other Teams are paying"
You will be moaning when the club goes bust .

for christ sake everyone moaned when they found out the club had been mismangaed for years we were all seething ....now when Ron tries to get it back on an even keel the whinging starts.

FACT: We don't have a lot of money and we cannot start paying silly money and matching Other teams (Get real if you think we can match Hull)
This is the third divison not the galmour of higher divisions, its gritty unfair and unforgiving.

unfortunatly if we want to get pormotion it has to be a team that we can afford to maintain...the culture of Buy now in hope of gaining promotion later is not an option for us.

I suggest you get behind the team (whatever one we put out ) and sit back and enjoy the roller coaster that is lower league football.

I know i will

 

[Andu]

Its interesting reading the article about Constantine from the official site
Wages - SUFC were wiling to increase his wages from £500 to £700 per week. So he was getting a pay increase from £26,000 pa to £36,400 pa an increase of £10,400 and I assume there would be a bonus for each goal increasing his wages further. As someone who works for a company that has just given an average 1% pay rise I don't find the clubs offer too insulting.
Other players - Constantine mentions other players being on a lot more money, thats just a case of "me too". I am sure if he had stayed on and continued to score goals the club would have rewarded him for his efforts.
No info - Constantine complains that he didn't know what was going on, sorry but if it was me waiting to find out about a contract I would have been on the phone making a nuisance of myself, after all its not the clubs earnings at stake.

 

[overseas shrimper]

Quote[/b] (nnatt76 @ May 27 2004,12:20)]You have to stop looking at how much "Other Teams are paying"
You will be moaning when the club goes bust .

for christ sake everyone moaned when they found out the club had been mismangaed for years we were all seething ....now when Ron tries to get it back on an even keel the whinging starts.

FACT: We don't have a lot of money and we cannot start paying silly money and matching Other teams (Get real if you think we can match Hull)
This is the third divison not the galmour of higher divisions, its gritty unfair and unforgiving.

unfortunatly if we want to get pormotion it has to be a team that we can afford to maintain...the culture of Buy now in hope of gaining promotion later is not an option for us.

I suggest you get behind the team (whatever one we put out ) and sit back and enjoy the roller coaster that is lower league football.

I know i will

Complete and utter rubbish.

I'd agree with you if we were a club millions of pounds in debt...

 

[SHRIMPALISIOUS]

llok at it this way jay smith was offered £1000 a week where as our top goal scorer was only offered £700. Im sorry but that doent seem fair. And i find it very funny how someone who scores 20+ goals a season get pushed aside for someone who scores 8 goals a season. Now tell if that makes sense!

 

[blue sky]

Shrimpalisious - youre not comparing like with like. I'd be happy if our highest paid player was a centre-half if we only conceed a goal a month!

 

[blue sky]

Two thoughts.....
1. Why did the club wait until the end of season to offer key players (Connie, Maher etc) new contracts? Surely these negotiations could have been started months ago? Connie didnt suddenly start scoring goals in April but had been consistently getting them all season. Surely contracts could of been offered earlier so that at least we could of known about those who really didnt want to stay or we could of tried to sign people up with a view to keeping them (ie Kightly got a better contract half way through the season)

2. Now that Connie has gone, how would people feel about some of that money being used to try to keep Maher/Cort/Warren by offering them improved terms?

 

[Napster]

Quote[/b] (blue sky @ May 27 2004,15:14)]Two thoughts.....
1. Why did the club wait until the end of season to offer key players (Connie, Maher etc) new contracts? Surely these negotiations could have been started months ago?

erm, because we didn't have a manager?