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fbm

Blue tinted optimist⭐
Joined
Oct 28, 2003
Messages
10,024
Location
Cloud cuckoo land
Firstly, the stadium plans.  Well done RM, and in my opinion the plans look absolutely superb.  There is no way anyone can say that it looks crap - it may not look how they might want a ground to look, but it will be clean, futuristic, spacious and worthy of Championship football.  It may be unusual - but crap it ain't.

But now the real issue - how we are going to stay in this league and why are Col U having a better time than we are?

In my opinion we came up too quickly.  We essentially have the nucleus of a league 2 side that through spirit, guts, passion and a fair amount of luck have elevated ourselves to the second tier of English football.

Col U on the other hand have an established league 1 side that had a superb season last year.  If you look at the physical stature of their players - especially at the back - they are more equipped to cope with the demands of this league.

This is highlighted by the volume of goals this year we have conceded from set pieces.  We just are not big enough.

Lets now look at each individual player and the partnerships they have (or haven't) developed.

Flahavan - Has been superb over the last season and a half but his physical stature is now possibly showing itself to be more of a liability.  Is he commanding enough at this level?  Do we need a 6'4" monster keeper who comes for everything and prevents the danger from happening in the first place?

Francis - I mentioned in one of my pre season friendly reports that he looked better at centre half.  His attacking play is first class, but he seems lacking in his defensive duties at times and I think Hunt would be a better choice at present.

Hammell - A huge improvement in the left back berth - but again his defensive qualities seem to let him down a bit.  I'd still have him over WIlson though.

With both our new full backs, these shortcomings could be down to the fact that they are still settling into a new team and gelling with their team mates.

Now, the real concern - the centre backs.  Prior is ageing and injury prone, despite the aerial dominance and organisational quality he gives us.  Barrett has performed adequately enough but lacks a yard or two of pace against the pacy players.  Clarke is in my opinion too similar to Barrett and must really play instead of rather than alongside him, if he is to play at all.  He has had such a torrid time of late that he must now surely take a back seat for a while.  Our only remaining dominant defender, Efe Sodje, must now come into the side and stay there, fitness permitting.  We must, must, MUST have a large and aerially dominant centre half and if Sodjes fitness is doubtful then get one in on loan.

Up front, we all know what Freddy can do but he is finding it tougher this season.  Despite his goal tally, 3 of those have come against league 1 opposition in the league cup, and one of his league goals was a penalty.  That has just left 2 goals from open play in 10 league games.  He is definitely shouldering the burden up front and the pressure is showing.

Paynter just hasn't gelled and I am not sure he is our "type" of player.  He seems a bit like Broughton and that style of play makes us too one-dimensional.  Besides, Freddy is not a feeder - he can make things happen himself.  Hooper may be a better partner for Paynter.  Talking of Hooper - he looks a good prospect but it's a big step up from 5 minutes of first team conference football as a sub to the Championship.  He could be better played behind the front 2 rather than a striker.

Ricketts has obvious class but I have concerns over his fitness.  A half fit Ricketts is probably best avoided and I suspect an operation on his achilles will be needed.  Then there's Lawson who doesn't do it for me as an out and out striker and Matt Harrold, who again is possibly only a bit part player this year.  However, he could be the most effective partner for Mr Eastwood, thereby giving us "Fred and Ginger" as an attacking force.  We'll have to wait and see though, due to his injury as well.  This leaves us with Bradbury, who could prove to be the ace in the hole once he is fit too.  I don't think it's co-incidence that the last game he played was the last game we won (in the league).

Now the real problem area - the midfield.

In order to play a defensive midfielder like Kevin Maher you need three other midfielders who can chip in with 8-10 goals a season at least.  We just don't have that.  Gower might, but as for the others - Guttridge, 4 or 5 at best, Hunt, well he's only just scored his first ever goal.  JCR maybe 3, Bradbury 1 or 2 when played in the midfield, Lawson the same,  The only other 2 potential goalscoring midfielders are Cole and Smith, neither of whom are in the team.  This is where we miss a player like Bentley.

What we need to play alongside Maher is someone with the skill of JCR, the creativity of Gower, the stamina of Bentley, the speed of Cole, the stature of Ricketts, the aerial ability of Sodje and who knocks in a dozen goals a season.  I hate to say it, and it won't happen, but we need to give serious thought as to whether we can afford to have a defensive midfielder like Maher in a 4-4-2 formation.

So, should our team be

                               Collis

Hunt           Sodje                Barrett            Hammell

                             Maher
                Gower              Guttridge

                           Hooper

             Eastwood            Harrold/Bradbury/Ricketts



Thoughts?
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] ] Collis

Hunt Sodje Barrett Hammell

Maher
Gower Guttridge

Hooper

Eastwood Harrold/Bradbury/Ricketts



Thoughts?
Not enough width. Freddy often drops into the soace between up front and midfield.
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]What we need to play alongside Maher is someone with the skill of JCR, the creativity of Gower, the stamina of Bentley, the speed of Cole, the stature of Ricketts, the aerial ability of Sodje and who knocks in a dozen goals a season. I hate to say it, and it won't happen, but we need to give serious thought as to whether we can afford to have a defensive midfielder like Maher in a 4-4-2 formation.

I'd love that, but the problem is thats what the whole world wants.
 
My thoughts are the reason we're stuggling is, Tilly's signings for this league are IMHO not up to Championship standard.

I haven't been impressed by our new full backs, Francis and Hammell.

Paynter is way out of his depth and a waste of money.

Same can be said for Gary Hooper.

I've not been impressed by Clarke so far.

JCR has no end product and is so predictable.

Harrold i've not seen yet.

Ricketts, the jury's still out.

To be honest we have not made use of the loan option for players, when other teams have and it's paying dividends for them.

In depth our squad is not good enough for CCC football and need's strengthening big time before anything worse happens.

If WBA do come calling, i can really see Tilly going!
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (fredheim_holm @ Oct. 03 2006,08:34)]
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]What we need to play alongside Maher is someone with the skill of JCR, the creativity of Gower, the stamina of Bentley, the speed of Cole, the stature of Ricketts, the aerial ability of Sodje and who knocks in a dozen goals a season.  I hate to say it, and it won't happen, but we need to give serious thought as to whether we can afford to have a defensive midfielder like Maher in a 4-4-2 formation.

I'd love that, but the problem is thats what the whole world wants.
It was a rather tongue in cheek comment... I think Gerrard possibly fits the bill.

Of course, we're not going to get a midfielder like that.  But whereas Guttridge and Maher worked very well last year, it just isn't the same now.

Last year we went up based on the goals we kept out, rather than the vast amount we scored.  This year we need more goals and I can't see where they are going to come from in the current system we play.
 
All good points, I agree with you to a degree about Simon Francis, but replacing him with Hunt is not an option IMO. I think Francis is the better option long term, but both have the same fault, in that both play too tight to the centre half, therefore affording lots of space for for the opposition wide left player(s) to play in. Whatever the faults of Duncan Jupp, this was not one.

I thin Sodje will definitely return to the side soon, possibly against Coventry. A lot of the problem in the defence is that 3 new players have been introduced in Francis, Hammell & Clarke and understanding needs to develop. I don't see any point in dropping Flahavan either, but would like Collis to get a game or two under his belt.

I think our major problem lies in supply from midfield, we are just not giving our strikers enough chances in the penalty area. Apart from the Paynter header and his disallowed goal against Cardiff, I can't think of another chance in the box in that game. A similar story at Derby on Saturday I believe. I am a big fan of wingers/wide players and would dearly love to see Mitchell Cole come back from his loan at Northampton to claim the left wing spot. Gower or JCR can be utilised on the right. I don't see a better central pairing than Guttridge & Maher unless Tilly goes into the loan market, and gets a genuine central player. I think Maher has been excellent so far this season. I agree that Hooper has bags of potential, and this should be nurtured. Ideally my front two would be Eastwood & Ricketts, a very similar pairing to last season with The Goat, though Ricketts certainly appears to have more pace & power. And Matt Harrold also fits this bill ideally if there are doubts over the fitness of Michael Ricketts.

Looking at the fixture list the next five games, Coventry, Burnley, Ipswich, Hull & Leeds are crucial for our season. These are all games that you think we should get points from, and I think we should be lokking for 9 points from these games which will double our tally. I don't think I am being overly optimistic there.

Let's just keep the faith and support the team.

Up the Blues.
 
Pretty much agree fbm, except that I think that if you are going to have Rickets (or Harrold) in the team then you have to have JCR as well. As has been mentioned on another thread JCR's contribution is more than a bit of fancy footwork, he provides an outlet from defence and the ball doesn't usually come flying straight back when it gets to him, buying time for the team, and he works very hard supporting the defence which is essential at the moment. I would play JCR and Gower, and look urgently for that no-nonsense tough-tackling midfielder.
 
One of the problems tilly n brush have this time round is that last season the team virtually picked itself, however the squad has now increased and decisions have to be made, giving the new blood a run out has affected the overall balance of the team/s we went up with....Im sure we shall see some stabilitiy in the near future with a fully fit sodje, Harold and ricketts not forgetting Bradbury of course,Think we shall see more changes leading up to christmas until tilly gets the balance right
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (fbm @ Oct. 03 2006,08:20)]In order to play a defensive midfielder like Kevin Maher you need three other midfielders who can chip in with 8-10 goals a season at least. We just don't have that. Gower might, but as for the others - Guttridge, 4 or 5 at best, Hunt, well he's only just scored his first ever goal. JCR maybe 3, Bradbury 1 or 2 when played in the midfield, Lawson the same, The only other 2 potential goalscoring midfielders are Cole and Smith, neither of whom are in the team. This is where we miss a player like Bentley.
I think you are being very optimistic with your prediction of needing three players who will get 8-10 goals. Having done a large number of the player valuations for the Fantasy Championship comp, I realised that very few midfielders hit this level. Personally, I think we need two midfielders who contribute that between, say, 6 and 10 goals and one midfielder who will create a lot.

Right now, I feel, Gutts being off form is killing us a little. He could and should have already got a couple this season but he's still not off the mark. One of these, I have little doubt, would have earned us all three points at Leicester. Gower has done well and will get us goals as well as assists. He's one of the few players who have really done what has bee needed IMO. Maher, I feel is a given in the team and even he has assisted a few times this season. Then, JCR. I still feel that he is being underused a lot fo the time when in good positions but looking at stats, he simply hasn't produced enough goals or assists for someone of his position. I honestly feel that this will come and his workrate and unfailing confidence are almost good enough reasons for his inclusion anyway. Almost. Still need the goals.

One other thing to consider is that with Eastwood and Paynter dropping deep to collect the ball, our whole system is cramped up. By bringing in Ricketts or Harrold, at least we will open up more room in the midfield. Even Bradbury played ont he last defender when he played and was very disciplined with it. I think Paynter should have played Saturday. Unless we have a fit replacement out of Ricketts, Harrold or Bradbury, he should still be persisted with.
 
You talk alot of sense Phil. Its such a shame that ...

wink.gif
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (The General @ Oct. 03 2006,12:11)]You talk alot of sense Phil. Its such a shame that ...

wink.gif
...I never bother typing any of it on here?

laugh.gif
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (fbm @ Oct. 03 2006,08:20)]But now the real issue - how we are going to stay in this league and why are Col U having a better time than we are?

In my opinion we came up too quickly.  We essentially have the nucleus of a league 2 side that through spirit, guts, passion and a fair amount of luck have elevated ourselves to the second tier of English football.

Col U on the other hand have an established league 1 side that had a superb season last year.  If you look at the physical stature of their players - especially at the back - they are more equipped to cope with the demands of this league.

So, should our team be

                               Collis

Hunt           Sodje                Barrett            Hammell

                             Maher
                Gower              Guttridge

                           Hooper

             Eastwood            Harrold/Bradbury/Ricketts



Thoughts?
I dont think Col U are any better placed than us, they have just found a bit of form, they did lose their first four games and lost their best player in the summer.

I agree with a lot of your summations about our squad, and whilst I dont think our form is simply caused by one or two players we could benefit from a couple of changes.

I dont think your suggested formation works due to lack of width, and would result in hoof ball, especially with Ricketts or Harrold there.

Keepers, I dont see why we should drop Flavs just because the team is playing poorly, he stopped us from losing against WBA after all.

Defence, agree with your choice.
I think Prior is too old for this league, he has experience true but not the legs. Clarke I think will be a good player for us, but I think we could do with Sodjes pace.

Midfield, no width there so Id have JCR Maher Gutts Gower. I actually think JCR will be a better player with Ricketts or Harrold to aim at.

Strikers, Id like to get Ricketts in the first team asap. If not then possibly Harrold. Either one of them who should play on the shoulders of the centrebacks and hopefully allow Freddy to drop deep.

Flavs
Francis Sodje Barrett Hammell
JCR Gutts Maher Gower
Eastwood Ricketts
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] ]Flavs
Francis Sodje Barrett Hammell
JCR Gutts Maher Gower
Eastwood Ricketts

same as me.
Dont give up on Francis after a bad game, but get Sodje back in there to win some headers. Rickets must start with Harrold as a sub option.
 
Personally I think we are letting in way too many headers and set pieces. It has been like this since Sodje got injured at Bournemouth last season.
 
If you care to look back as far as July you'd see I was saying that we would struggle because we didn't have a centre half who could head the ball away without Sodje. This is while most posters on these boards were clambering for a forward. I feel that I have, sadly, been proved right.

Goals change games in football matches, and when you are likely to concede from every set-play you give yourself a mountain to climb. How many goals have we shipped from set-plays? Probably more than 50%. Add the many goals were we've failed to just put our foot through it in the penalty area, and that's nearly every goal against accounted for.

You can go through every player in the side, but the fact remains that without centre halves that can head the ball away you will lose games. I think we've been outplayed by Cardiff (and I assume Derby) otherwise we have coped well.

So many games have changed because of a poor goal given away from a set-play: Palace, QPR, Cardiff, Leicester, and to a lesser extent Derby.

That is the bottom line. Yes, some players have not yet hit top gear but it is early days still in many respect. The dividing line between winning and losing is narrow, and when you gift a goal away every game you change the nature of the game and make it hard for yourself.
 
In answer to your question, I believe someone said in the chat room that we have conceded nine from set pieces this season compared to six all last season.

Hmm, that sounds like a lot. Might be right though
 
i think most of the people on here agree that we need sodje back for his heading abilitys,i dont think clarke is a bad player just also agree with most that him and barrett are very similar.IMO when we have a fit bradbury back it will make a difference think he likes to put himself about and is just a menace,personally cant wait to see him back.

lets hope results come soon
UP THE SHRIMPERS
biggrin.gif
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (glentheblue @ Oct. 03 2006,21:08)]i think most of the people on here agree that we need sodje back for his heading abilitys,i dont think clarke is a bad player just also agree with most that him and barrett are very similar.IMO when we have a fit bradbury back it will make a difference think he likes to put himself about and is just a menace,personally cant wait to see him back.

lets hope results come soon
UP THE SHRIMPERS
biggrin.gif
clarke isnt a bad player, he just isnt playing well and isnt the player to partner barrett.
 
WHAT ABOUT JCR IN CENTRE MID? GOOD TACKLER, GOOD SKILL GOOD PASSER NOT NECESSARILY CROSSER, UP AND DOWN AND WILL PROBABLY OFFER A GOAL OR MORE TOO. GOWER RIGHT, COLE LEFT MAHER AND JCR IN MID, RICKETTS AND FREDDY UP FRONT, USUAL DEFENCE (SODJE)
 
[b said:
Quote[/b] (bluethroughandthrough @ Oct. 04 2006,03:05)]WHAT ABOUT JCR IN CENTRE MID? GOOD TACKLER, GOOD SKILL GOOD PASSER NOT NECESSARILY CROSSER, UP AND DOWN AND WILL PROBABLY OFFER A GOAL OR MORE TOO. GOWER RIGHT, COLE LEFT MAHER AND JCR IN MID, RICKETTS AND FREDDY UP FRONT, USUAL DEFENCE (SODJE)
Its not a bad idea.

But Gutts is a good player, on scandalous form.
 
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