Should corporal punishishment return?

[graysblue]

with many schools underperforming and teachers being run ragged.

is it time to bring back the cane.

i went to a pretty tough school in tilbury where the cane was a way of life,the majority of pupils feared this punishment hence they were normally well behaved.

if my year back then was transported through time to now,blooming heck we would of had a field day.

todays schools have metal detectors,high fences and prison style main gates,unruly pupils boss the classroom as teachers are generally bullied and in the end quit the proffession.

watched an interesting piece the other day where current pupils thought it would be good to bring back the good old cane.

think its about time that unruly kids were taught a damn good lesson in manners ect.

cane the buggers if needed.

 

[Einstein]

This is actually the first topic I've agreed with you.

Nothing too heavy, but having some form of discipline in schools would definitely give a sharp reminder that school is not just for p*ssing about.

 

[Nobby Snide]

GB..100%, but then you also need to take that into the home and give the parents a good kicking too.

 

[Aberdeen Shrimper]

Unfortunately it will never happen, if a parent is not allowed to chastise their own children i can not see anyone else being allowed.

Although i see nothing wrong with it at all.

 

[Nobby Snide]

it is a bigger socail problem, something we touched on in the chatroom on saturday.

 

[Napster]

absolute balderdash. Kids learn respect by being respected.

 

[Gremlin]

with many schools underperforming and teachers being run ragged.

is it time to bring back the cane.

i went to a pretty tough school in tilbury where the cane was a way of life,the majority of pupils feared this punishment hence they were normally well behaved.

if my year back then was transported through time to now,blooming heck we would of had a field day.

todays schools have metal detectors,high fences and prison style main gates,unruly pupils boss the classroom as teachers are generally bullied and in the end quit the proffession.

watched an interesting piece the other day where current pupils thought it would be good to bring back the good old cane.

think its about time that unruly kids were taught a damn good lesson in manners ect.

cane the buggers if needed.

With respect, your post and its heading are hardly firm evidence of schools performing better back then.

 

[Nobby Snide]

absolute balderdash. Kids learn respect by being respected.

agreed, but at the same time, they have to realise that going too far will not be tollerated...I had the slipper and the cane, and although it did wonders for my 'street cred' in the playground, I made sure I didnt overstep that mark again.

However, I was more ****e scared of my Mum and Dad being told what a git I was.

therein lies the problem...and as AS rightly pointed out, if the parents arnt allowed to control the kids (not abusing them), then its never going to return to civility in the classroom.

I'm afraid taking the toys away, doesnt work when everything is given so cheaply now.

 

[londonblue]

The cane isn't the issue. Hitting people doesn't teach them respect, it teaches fear. It's no different to the kids that carry guns and knives. Kids carry because they think it makes people respect them. People don't, but they do fear them.

What is needed however, is for the teacher's authority not to be undermined by the parents. When I was punished at school my parents sided with the school and made me behave. These days too many parents seem to defend their kids regardless, which undermines the teacher's/school's authority, and makes the kids feel like they're immune to punishment.

 

[Einstein]

absolute balderdash. Kids learn respect by being respected.

Completely disagree. (regarding a small minority)

Respect has got nothing to do with it anymore. A minority, and that is exactly what we are talking about, have absolutely no respect for anyone, or anything. The Police should be given back their powers as well. The troublesome teenagers are just not afraid of the ones who should be in "disciplined" careers. It's the fundamental issue with society today. Carry a knife around with you, and you're likely to get a slapped wrist at best. The trouble is, it isn't even a proper slapped wrist.

 

[Berrichonne shrimper]

My 3 youngsters go to a rural school and as with all children in france are taught manners from the age of 3 when they enter school.When a adult enters the room the class on masse get up and say bonjour,now one afternoon my 9 yr old was in a bit of a dream world and didnt stand up,the headmaster who is a young chap went behind him and yanked him upwards leaving two lovely red marks on his arms from his vest.
If this had happened in england i could have sued his arse and had him sacked,i asked my boy if he wanted me to have a word in the heads ear and he told me no as it was his fault and he wouldnt be doing the same mistake again.That is one of the many reasons i like it here.
As for the cane,i have a horse whip for the wife and i like the palm of the hand in a good old fashioned spanking my self.
Grays blue get yourself in the cliuque they need your input.

 

[Aberdeen Shrimper]

Completely disagree. (regarding a small minority)

Respect has got nothing to do with it anymore. A minority, and that is exactly what we are talking about, have absolutely no respect for anyone, or anything. The Police should be given back their powers as well. The troublesome teenagers are just not afraid of the ones who should be in "disciplined" careers. It's the fundamental issue with society today. Carry a knife around with you, and you're likely to get a slapped wrist at best. The trouble is, it isn't even a proper slapped wrist.

completely agree with that, i am not sure what the Police officers name is but the one who travels with Southend, (oldish chap with grey hair) he seems to be old school and i remember being at my last home game before the Col U game and watching him challenge a guy who was smoking, the guy got lippy and the Police officer took no s**t at all, grabbed him in a really forceful way and ejected him from the ground, now i bet he gets respect from the most Southend supporters.

 

[graysblue]

Completely disagree. (regarding a small minority)

Respect has got nothing to do with it anymore. A minority, and that is exactly what we are talking about, have absolutely no respect for anyone, or anything. The Police should be given back their powers as well. The troublesome teenagers are just not afraid of the ones who should be in "disciplined" careers. It's the fundamental issue with society today. Carry a knife around with you, and you're likely to get a slapped wrist at best. The trouble is, it isn't even a proper slapped wrist.

ageed 100%

youngsters realise they can take the **** and use it to their own advantage.

they are to a point untouchable and boy dont they know it.

 

[OldBlueLady]

Don't know if I'd go as far as the cane, but I definitely agree with some kind of physical reprimand. We have to have training and all sorts of guidelines and policies instructing us how to "handle" a child so that it can't be misconstrued - did you know that if a child runs out of the school premises we aren't even supposed to grab them?

A few slapped backs of hands or legs earlier on in life might have taught some children how to behave in an acceptable way, nanny state gone mad. Sensible disciplining is an integral part of life, look at the natural world, a lion cub goes too far in its play with its parent, what happens? It gets a cuff - so what can be more natural?

 

[Einstein]

Don't know if I'd go as far as the cane, but I definitely agree with some kind of physical reprimand. We have to have training and all sorts of guidelines and policies instructing us how to "handle" a child so that it can't be misconstrued - did you know that if a child runs out of the school premises we aren't even supposed to grab them?

A few slapped backs of hands or legs earlier on in life might have taught some children how to behave in an acceptable way, nanny state gone mad. Sensible disciplining is an integral part of life, look at the natural world, a lion cub goes too far in its play with its parent, what happens? It gets a cuff - so what can be more natural?

Not again OBL - can we please stop agreeing ;)

 

[OldBlueLady]

Not again OBL - can we please stop agreeing ;)

Is it you coming round to my way of thinking or the other way round then? :D

Back in the day, it was always the dread of having to go to the Head (mistress in my case)'s study to get the punishment dealt out. We used to have to go and "stand under the clock", which was a euphemism for being told you were "in big trouble". It was being kept standing there, waiting, that made you determine to try not to be naughty. We also had plenty of board rubbers thrown at us and the odd ruler across the knuckle., and at home, I still remember my dad slapping the backs of my legs when I was about 16 or so - for cheeking my mum more than likely.

 

[Slipperduke]

Absolutely. I genuinely believe that the lack of corporal punishment is behind the problems we're all experiencing now. Pain is the in-built warning signal for mankind and we're so stupid that we don't use it to our advantage.

Does anyone like sticking their hands in naked flames? Probably not. You'll have been hurt if you tried it before and you won't want to do it again. With the greatest of respect to my learned friend Napster, he needs to come up to North London.

Teachers, police officers, social workers, they've all worked really hard on giving kids respect here, allowing them a bit of freedom, never punishing them, only trying to respect and understand them. The little ****ers have had a lifetime of never being pulled up on anything so they actually can't understand the ramifications of sticking a blade in someone's ribs. They cry in court when they get sent down, because it's the first time that anything serious has ever happened to them.

The mobile phones blasting out gangsta rap, the feet on train seats, the smoking on buses, the abuse to pensioners, the thrown stones at buses, the beatings, the muggings, the rapes, the murders. It's all interlinked. If someone had just come along and whacked them upside the head at the right time, they might have some comprehension of cause and effect. Respect makes them laugh. Respect lets them off.

If your dog ****es on your carpet, what do you do? If you raise dogs well, you'll slap it across the nose, rub its nose in the ****-puddle and then boot it out the house. It might take a couple of repeat performances, dogs not being as clever as children, but eventually the dog will equate ****ing on the carpet with pain and will stop doing it.

Our society would tell the dog off, listen to the dog's version of events, send the dog to Butlins, tell the dog off again, lock the dog up with 200 other incontinent dogs, bring the dog back home and then lock it in the shed for 20-30 years. And just think how those carpets would smell after all that.

Plus, corporal punishment allows the victim to know that justice is being done. If some little toerag kicked in my door and made off with my laptop, I'd want someone to open up several cans of kickarse on him. I wouldn't want him to get a good talking to and his 142nd caution, which is what happens now.

And, to continue the long list of pros, it's infinitely better than capital punishment because it's rather less permanent. Mistakes will always happen, but at least a beatdown doesn't have to end your existence.

You should see Singapore, it's incredible. There's no litter, there's no discarded gum, there's barely any street crime and you can wander about quite happily without the fear of being bummed into next week by a gang of borderline ******* who were never shown the error of their ways with a well-swung two-by-four. I'm not saying it's Utopia, but it might be worth a little look.

 

[OldBlueLady]

Is this going to be one of those rare threads where we are massively in agreement with one another (there's always a few exceptions!)?

 

[Uncle Leo]

The cane in schools? Absolutely not.

Police allowed to give a teenage lout the proverbial 'clip round the ear'? Certainly.

 

[graysblue]

Absolutely. I genuinely believe that the lack of corporal punishment is behind the problems we're all experiencing now. Pain is the in-built warning signal for mankind and we're so stupid that we don't use it to our advantage.

Does anyone like sticking their hands in naked flames? Probably not. You'll have been hurt if you tried it before and you won't want to do it again. With the greatest of respect to my learned friend Napster, he needs to come up to North London.

Teachers, police officers, social workers, they've all worked really hard on giving kids respect here, allowing them a bit of freedom, never punishing them, only trying to respect and understand them. The little ****ers have had a lifetime of never being pulled up on anything so they actually can't understand the ramifications of sticking a blade in someone's ribs. They cry in court when they get sent down, because it's the first time that anything serious has ever happened to them.

The mobile phones blasting out gangsta rap, the feet on train seats, the smoking on buses, the abuse to pensioners, the thrown stones at buses, the beatings, the muggings, the rapes, the murders. It's all interlinked. If someone had just come along and whacked them upside the head at the right time, they might have some comprehension of cause and effect. Respect makes them laugh. Respect lets them off.

If your dog ****es on your carpet, what do you do? If you raise dogs well, you'll slap it across the nose, rub its nose in the ****-puddle and then boot it out the house. It might take a couple of repeat performances, dogs not being as clever as children, but eventually the dog will equate ****ing on the carpet with pain and will stop doing it.

Our society would tell the dog off, listen to the dog's version of events, send the dog to Butlins, tell the dog off again, lock the dog up with 200 other incontinent dogs, bring the dog back home and then lock it in the shed for 20-30 years. And just think how those carpets would smell after all that.

Plus, corporal punishment allows the victim to know that justice is being done. If some little toerag kicked in my door and made off with my laptop, I'd want someone to open up several cans of kickarse on him. I wouldn't want him to get a good talking to and his 142nd caution, which is what happens now.

And, to continue the long list of pros, it's infinitely better than capital punishment because it's rather less permanent. Mistakes will always happen, but at least a beatdown doesn't have to end your existence.

You should see Singapore, it's incredible. There's no litter, there's no discarded gum, there's barely any street crime and you can wander about quite happily without the fear of being bummed into next week by a gang of borderline ******* who were never shown the error of their ways with a well-swung two-by-four. I'm not saying it's Utopia, but it might be worth a little look.

that sir is a damn fine post and you are spot on.