Sit Down

[Ron Manager]

Plenty as been said on the other thread about 'Ricketts-Gate' and I don't wish to add to that particular debate.

However the trouble we have at Roots Hall at the moment is a real crackdown on any displays of passionate support. I was singled out and warned by a steward that I'd been spotted on camera abusing Windass (me and a thousand others I hasten to add) and that I could face the threat of being ejected. As I pointed out to the steward I wasn't being racist and I was in no threat of actually physically harming him (not from the South Upper) and so I wouldn't change what I was doing as in my opinion I wasn't doing anything wrong. Sadly though the way the game is heading we will all be expected to stay seated at all times, applaud both teams politely and munch cucumber sandwiches at half-time......and when that rapidly approaching time comes I shall not be going anymore.

It's the sanitising of our national (working class) game that is threatening to destroy it and I for one am absolutely sick to the back teeth of it. Yes have family stands where bad language is not tolerated but for goodness sake, if you can't shout and swear in the home (or away) end where can you?

 

[Guest]

Well said that man.

Football is gradually becoming more and more sanitised, I can understand crackdowns on abuse in family areas but in the main stands it is ridiculous. More and more people will elect to stay away if we can't vent our frustrations or are restricted from displaying passion for our team.

 

[C'mon you Blues]

without knowing exactly what you said Ron it's hard to have a view. For me as long as the abuse has a bit of style and humour to it then the more the merrier. Unfortunately some fands think calling Windass a fat c%&t is banter. Oh actually on second thoughts

 

[Ron Manager]

Quote[/b] (C'mon you Blues @ Dec. 11 2005,12:15)]without knowing exactly what you said Ron it's hard to have a view. For me as long as the abuse has a bit of style and humour to it then the more the merrier. Unfortunately some fands think calling Windass a fat c%&t is banter. Oh actually on second thoughts

Oh, it wasn't banter it was downright abuse...but I still defend my right to dish it out. I don't swear at all during the week but use my entire quota up during the 90 minutes of football on a Saturday. That's part of what football is all about for me (certainly if you sit in certain sections of the ground) and if we can generate a cauldron like atmosphere at Roots Hall that is intimidating for opposition players then it will be to the benefit of the team.

Like I say, as long as it's not racist and doesn't cross the line of physical violence (as with Simon Royce at Stoke last week) then it should be allowed....at least in the stands where the more passionate group of fans congregate. IMO of course

 

[C'mon you Blues]

Quote[/b] (Ron Manager @ Dec. 11 2005,12:23)]I don't swear at all during the week but use my entire quota up during the 90 minutes of football on a Saturday.

love it

 

[McNasty]

I approached a steward at half-time , he of the earpiece and two-way radio, and told him that the stewards are antagonising the people in the South Upper by not letting anyone even stand up to stretch their legs. I advised him that many of us had been seasos for many years and were not young lads out for a row but we would not tolerate being treated like naughty children over the "you must not swear or stand" issue.
I said that many fans object to being threatened with eviction for standing ,even for a short while, when the club cannot , or will not ,enforce the same law for away fans , bearing in mind we are usually treated like sh!te by away stewards ourselves.
I explained that as seasos we put our visiting rights to Roots Hall at risk as the club can easily trace who sits where , even down to our addresses , so there was no likelihood of trouble from the seasos as we didn't want banning orders. He told me that "he didn't mind us swearing as it is a man's game , but we musn't swear at the stewards or we were out"

I hope that clears up the problem.

 

[overseas shrimper]

Quote[/b] (mcnasty @ Dec. 11 2005,14:23)]He told me that "he didn't mind us swearing as it is a man's game , but we musn't swear at the stewards or we were out"

Did you tell him to f%&k off?

 

[Uncle Leo]

Quote[/b] (Ron Manager @ Dec. 11 2005,12:10)]It's the sanitising of our national (working class) game that is threatening to destroy it and I for one am absolutely sick to the back teeth of it. Yes have family stands where bad language is not tolerated but for goodness sake, if you can't shout and swear in the home (or away) end where can you?

Agree with your point re being allowed to stand up and sing/swear/shout, but why bring class in to it?

Football is for everyone, regardless of class (or colour, or creed, or political views or choice of hat).

 

[Uncle Leo]

Quote[/b] (mcnasty @ Dec. 11 2005,13:23)]He told me that "he didn't mind us swearing as it is a man's game , but we musn't swear at the stewards or we were out"

I hope that clears up the problem.

Precious little things. Shame to swear at them.

 

[Xàbia Shrimper]

Just got back from an away game down south (we lost 2-1) and had a far greater time than I did at Roots Hall last week. You can stand, sit, crouch, kneel in whatever position you wish; you can drink, smoke, swear, gesticulate in whatever you manner you find fit. By thunder, you could probably even march off behind the stand with an opposing fan and have a few rounds of fisticuffs without threat of explusion.

WS

 

[Ron Manager]

Quote[/b] (Uxbridge Shrimper @ Dec. 11 2005,14:24)]

Quote[/b] (Ron Manager @ Dec. 11 2005,12:10)]It's the sanitising of our national (working class) game that is threatening to destroy it and I for one am absolutely sick to the back teeth of it. Yes have family stands where bad language is not tolerated but for goodness sake, if you can't shout and swear in the home (or away) end where can you?

Agree with your point re being allowed to stand up and sing/swear/shout, but why bring class in to it?

Football is for everyone, regardless of class (or colour, or creed, or political views or choice of hat).

Fair point...football is for everybody. However it can't be denied that it traditionally has been a working class sport in this country and that is reflected in much of the 'culture' of being a football fan - including the language of the fans.

However over the past 15 or so years the game has become more universally popular and more and more of what you might call middle-class fans are attending games. Now that's fine but I think it is a mistake to expect the traditional supporters to have to change how they and their fathers and grandfathers have always behaved at games (shout, swear etc) for the sake of the more 'gentrified' tastes of newer fans. Now it is only my opinion of course but that is what I believe is happening in the game generally.

For what it's worth to many people I may be viewed as a middle class fan - white collar management job, homeowner etc - but I do and always will consider myself working-class and am proud of that fact. Once again it's just a personal view I have and I'm not on my soap box preaching to anyone else.

I want to continue my outlet at a weekend of drinking a few pints before going to football and shouting and swearing a bit. That to me is a traditionally working class thing to do - what's the problem with that?

 

[Uncle Leo]

Quote[/b] (Ron Manager @ Dec. 11 2005,14:37)]Fair point...football is for everybody. However it can't be denied that it traditionally has been a working class sport in this country and that is reflected in much of the 'culture' of being a football fan - including the language of the fans.

However over the past 15 or so years the game has become more universally popular and more and more of what you might call middle-class fans are attending games. Now that's fine but I think it is a mistake to expect the traditional supporters to have to change how they and their fathers and grandfathers have always behaved at games (shout, swear etc) for the sake of the more 'gentrified' tastes of newer fans. Now it is only my opinion of course but that is what I believe is happening in the game generally.

For what it's worth to many people I may be viewed as a middle class fan - white collar management job, homeowner etc - but I do and always will consider myself working-class and am proud of that fact. Once again it's just a personal view I have and I'm not on my soap box preaching to anyone else.

I want to continue my outlet at a weekend of drinking a few pints before going to football and shouting and swearing a bit. That to me is a traditionally working class thing to do - what's the problem with that?

Son of accountant, now I'm also a white collar manager, so definitely middle class me.

BUT...my Dad was watching Southend back in the 1960s and I've been going since 1985.

With you all the way on this one though Ron. I don't want the football crowd traditions I was brought up on to be forced out.

If I don't have a couple before the game and don't get up and swear at the opposition at least a couple of times I feel short changed  

 

[RobM.]

"I say, you ruffian! That was rather feisty of you!"

"Nice shot Archibald, well played my good fellow!"

"Oh how annoying! An own goal! Unlucky, my friend!"

"Hey Mister referee! Please reconsider that decision as I believe it to be incorrect!"

Yeah, right....:D

 

[rabbloke]

It is a very frustrating situation. Reaction and over-reaction. Should players expect to receive polite applause or be prepared for some 'tribal' banter/abuse?. PC always seems to go to the extreme. If it were to appear reasonable then more people would be welcoming to adaptations in our 'laws of civility'. Of course we should not tolerate racism and only the minority known as biggots would disagree. It is however an over-reaction to believe that supporters should behave as proverbial paragons of virtue. Cricket used to be a sanitised sport and very few people bothered going. Now it is in the ascendency and the crowds chant and mexican wave. Football stadia would be like ghost towns if it took on the mantle of cricket from days gone by. Soccer is a passionate sport with passionate support. Take away the passion and you take away the supporter. End of club! Even last week on the official site, RM complained about a letter in the Echo which knocked Tilson. Why?. The writer had the right to air his views. Tilly has so much support from the fans that the majority scoffed at the letter. It was of no importance. I don't see RM making an official statement on the reasons why Blues World cannot get a decent commentary for the fans. Why?. In the modern game it is the fan who must pay up and shut up. The football world may wake up one morning and find itself with less supporters than 'Norman no-mates'. Perhaps the sport should act now before that day comes.

 

[dave cusaks nose]

Quote[/b] (Ron Manager @ Dec. 11 2005,12:23)]

Quote[/b] (C'mon you Blues @ Dec. 11 2005,12:15)]without knowing exactly what you said Ron it's hard to have a view. For me as long as the abuse has a bit of style and humour to it then the more the merrier. Unfortunately some fands think calling Windass a fat c%&t is banter. Oh actually on second thoughts

Oh, it wasn't banter it was downright abuse...but I still defend my right to dish it out. I don't swear at all during the week but use my entire quota up during the 90 minutes of football on a Saturday. That's part of what football is all about for me (certainly if you sit in certain sections of the ground) and if we can generate a cauldron like atmosphere at Roots Hall that is intimidating for opposition players then it will be to the benefit of the team.

Like I say, as long as it's not racist and doesn't cross the line of physical violence (as with Simon Royce at Stoke last week) then it should be allowed....at least in the stands where the more passionate group of fans congregate. IMO of course  

see thats were your going wrong I F and C all week, to however I choose, but when the wekend comes im all ****ed out...........................

 

[McNasty]

Quote[/b] (Uxbridge Shrimper @ Dec. 11 2005,14:45)]

Quote[/b] (Ron Manager @ Dec. 11 2005,14:37)]Fair point...football is for everybody. However it can't be denied that it traditionally has been a working class sport in this country and that is reflected in much of the 'culture' of being a football fan - including the language of the fans.

However over the past 15 or so years the game has become more universally popular and more and more of what you might call middle-class fans are attending games. Now that's fine but I think it is a mistake to expect the traditional supporters to have to change how they and their fathers and grandfathers have always behaved at games (shout, swear etc) for the sake of the more 'gentrified' tastes of newer fans. Now it is only my opinion of course but that is what I believe is happening in the game generally.

For what it's worth to many people I may be viewed as a middle class fan - white collar management job, homeowner etc - but I do and always will consider myself working-class and am proud of that fact. Once again it's just a personal view I have and I'm not on my soap box preaching to anyone else.

I want to continue my outlet at a weekend of drinking a few pints before going to football and shouting and swearing a bit. That to me is a traditionally working class thing to do - what's the problem with that?

Son of accountant, now I'm also a white collar manager, so definitely middle class me.

BUT...my Dad was watching Southend back in the 1960s and I've been going since 1985.

With you all the way on this one though Ron. I don't want the football crowd traditions I was brought up on to be forced out.

If I don't have a couple before the game and don't get up and swear at the opposition at least a couple of times I feel short changed  

I , on the other hand , am as rough as arseholes , fart , swear, bite people , eat babies when I am hungry and detest the fact posh people are allowed to watch MY game .

 

[McNasty]

Quote[/b] (rabbloke @ Dec. 11 2005,14:49)]Soccer is a passionate sport with passionate support. Take away the passion and you take away the supporter. End of club! Even last week on the official site, RM complained about a letter in the Echo which knocked Tilson. Why?. The writer had the right to air his views.

Whatever happened to Freedom of Speech? It is what seperated our country from those foreign countries run by tyrants who refused to hear criticism.

Slippery slope.

 

[TerryintheWest]

Quote[/b] ]the stewards are antagonising the people in the South Upper by not letting anyone even stand up to stretch their legs

The ground rules state that "no-one may stand in any seated area whilst play is in progress." So if the ball goes out of play you have every right to stand up and stretch your legs as long as you sit down when play commences!

 

[Ron Manager]

Fantastic! Let's hand out copies of these rules and encourage everyone to do exactly that, each time the ball goes out of play everyone stand up and then sit down when play resumes. Any interference from the stormtroopers and we can show them the rules they are supposed to be enforcing and politely inform them that we are doing nothing wrong!

 

[Xàbia Shrimper]

Quote[/b] (TerryintheWest @ Dec. 11 2005,17:05)]The ground rules state that "no-one may stand in any seated area whilst play is in progress." So if the ball goes out of play you have every right to stand up and stretch your legs as long as you sit down when play commences!

Rule 9 of the Ground Regulations.

The same FLA report into Persistent Standing at Grounds also notes that:

"Spectators who deliberately choose to stand for prolonged periods in seated areas are effectively refusing to accept the authority of the ground management and the stewards. While there is no automatic correlation between standing in seated areas and misbehaviour, there is evidence that some groups of standing spectators regularly adopt a hostile attitude to stewards and to the authorities generally. This can make it harder to tackle offensive conduct such as racist chanting or obscene language.

Even where this does not lead to misbehaviour, standing spectators may not be in the mood to comply with reasonable requests (in particular to keep the gangways and exits clear - see above) that may be for their own safety."

Source: Football Licensing Authority

Note the above underlined: "reasonable requests". Does a clutch of over-zealous stewards bundling spectators down flights of stairs and ejecting them from the ground constitute a "reasonable request"?

WS