Echo News Southend United smaller Fossetts Farm stadium plans held up (Feb 23)

[Jai]

We have submitted detailed plans for the revisions - theres 14 pages with 10 documents on each page on the council website!

Having been through the planning process before on a residential build, I'd suggest it's not the same for everyone. Really depends on who you know as to how fast and how flexible the council can be.

I think this has even been classed as a delegated decision, councillors probably won't even vote on it!

The council hasn't disclosed what further info they require - that'd be interesting to know.

There doesn't appear to be any record of correspondence from the council following the revised application, which was submitted in August.

Should it not be a matter of public record if the council have contacted the applicant setting out the information they require?

 

[Holy Joe]

There doesn't appear to be any record of correspondence from the council following the revised application, which was submitted in August.

Should it not be a matter of public record if the council have contacted the applicant setting out the information they require?

I don't think correspondence is normally added to the website - I think it's probably a good idea in the interests of transparency.

It might be available as a FOI request?

 

[Prawn]

Well with Hilton pulling out of the fourth side because of it only being residential.

Those residents are going to need to get there dinner from somewhere, couldn’t we get McDonalds and KFC to build the fourth stand and they can sell outside seven days a week and open on the inside on match days.

 

[southendkid]

Well with Hilton pulling out of the fourth side because of it only being residential.

Those residents are going to need to get there dinner from somewhere, couldn’t we get McDonalds and KFC to build the fourth stand and they can sell outside seven days a week and open on the inside on match days.

Why would McDonald's waste millions on building us a stand when they could just buy a nearby commercial property for a fraction of the price instead? Sure they wouldn't be able to sell inside the stadium but a couple of hundred burger sales a week is nothing to McDonalds so they won't lose sleep over it. The reason a hotel would potentially have been interested is because there aren't many buildings for sale that can be converted into a hotel of the size.

 

[Shrimper]

Why would McDonald's waste millions on building us a stand when they could just buy a nearby commercial property for a fraction of the price instead? Sure they wouldn't be able to sell inside the stadium but a couple of hundred burger sales a week is nothing to McDonalds so they won't lose sleep over it. The reason a hotel would potentially have been interested is because there aren't many buildings for sale that can be converted into a hotel of the size.

He was being sarcastic

 

[flangejackrabbit]

I can probably shed a bit of light on the hotel saga, having undertaken feasibility studies for hotel development in the past. I can confirm that very, very few hotel buildings are actually owned by the chain occupying/managing them and rarely do they get involved with funding a new hotel building. In respect of FF, I would guess (and it is only a guess) that Hilton was prepared to either lease the proposed hotel or to have it operated on a franchise basis with a share of the profits going to the building owner. Having such an agreement signed up for a fixed term with a reputable company, it would have enabled the developer to borrow the required capital for construction of the building with security provided by the lease/franchise income.

As I understand it, the official reason cited for Hilton pulling away from the FF site is they preferred to have a hotel closer to Southend airport. However, as Rigsby has said above, the changed nature of the whole development to residential makes it no longer a desirable location for a hotel chain. Once a chain has rejected a particular location it has the effect of deterring the interest of other players in the industry so it would be extremely unlikely for another hotel chain to be attracted. In this scenario RM has to find another way of financing the development of the fourth side of the stadium and hence the change to residential units.

As I said, the above is just my guess based upon past experience of hotel development projects. I would add also that it is not as simple as building a hotel and then finding a chain to manage it because every chain has its own corporate standards and many of those have to be designed in from the outset.

I expect the reduction in airport traffic might have had something to do with them pulling out as well. Am I wrong in thinking it was Topland group who were planning to operate the hotel for Hilton?

 

[Realist]

I have a headache.

 

[getintoem]

I expect the reduction in airport traffic might have had something to do with them pulling out as well. Am I wrong in thinking it was Topland group who were planning to operate the hotel for Hilton?

I think Topland are an investment group, so if they were involved they were probably prepared to provide the capital to build the hotel and let Hilton manage it for them on a long lease.

The reduction in airport traffic may have had a bearing on the decision, but I think the official explanation is that Hilton already had plans to have a Hampton hotel at the airport if FF did not get progressed quickly. Hilton were obviously aware of RMs track record for delivery timescales.

 

[rlb999]

I'm actually in favour of a slightly smaller stadium (with 4 stands). It should cost less to build, less to maintain going forwards, and if we pull in a 10k crowd (which is big for us) the stadium won't still be half empty. I remember us playing Coventry at the Ricoh a few seasons back and the (lovely) stadium must have been 90% empty - there's no fun in that.

 

[overseas shrimper]

Why would we ‘need’ a 21,000 capacity stadium when at best we will be top half L1/bottom half Championship? Brentford are in the Premier League and only built a 17,000 capacity stadium.

Fair points IMO, but my issue is that this wasn't decided before and Ron is still making changes and delaying the start of the project even now... when our very existence is hanging by a very weak thread. Getting started could potentially help our financial woes / bring us closer to seeing the back of Ron.

 

[Chairman Trigg]

Why would we ‘need’ a 21,000 capacity stadium when at best we will be top half L1/bottom half Championship? Brentford are in the Premier League and only built a 17,000 capacity stadium.

Why did W Ham take on a 60k stadium when they only ever pulled in 35k odd.We used to pull in well over 10k in the old div 4 and the area has grown substantially since the 70s.The club could easily if in the championship cope with a 20k + stadium.The first build will always be the cheapest instead of the ..we can always add on later attitude.If we ever get back in the league and experience cup runs those Extra 6k of seats generate big income . Will be one hell of an odd stadium with so many living in it on match days

 

[TJC]

I'd be in favour of smaller capacity as others have said, but keep the design so it can easily be increased in the unlikely event its ever needed. However, I think the amended plans will not allow for any kind of expansion as it will all be hemmed in by residental properties.
Am I right in saying that the reduction is the removal of a tier from one stand and a height reduction? If the height was kept, it would allow a second tier in the future, although might feel like an empty warehouse.

 

[Dutch Branch]

I came across a flyer this week put out by the new MP for Southend West - Anna Frith regarding her first year in office and all the good stuff that’s been achieved as well all the things planned for the future and you would think that a project so big as FF coupled with her recent comments in Parliament about SUFC being the heart beat of the town not a single word was mentioned neither was airport come to think about it .

 

[TJC]

I came across a flyer this week put out by the new MP for Southend West - Anna Frith regarding her first year in office and all the good stuff that’s been achieved as well all the things planned for the future and you would think that a project so big as FF coupled with her recent comments in Parliament about SUFC being the heart beat of the town not a single word was mentioned neither was airport come to think about it .

Does the airport fall under her area? Taking a guess, is it not under Rochford?
Perhaps she didn't want to mention Fossetts/Club as its such a mess right now

 

[Smiffy]

I'd be in favour of smaller capacity as others have said, but keep the design so it can easily be increased in the unlikely event its ever needed. However, I think the amended plans will not allow for any kind of expansion as it will all be hemmed in by residental properties.
Am I right in saying that the reduction is the removal of a tier from one stand and a height reduction? If the height was kept, it would allow a second tier in the future, although might feel like an empty warehouse.

I believe a tier of seating has been removed from the main stand and the residential towers are actually 1 or 2 storeys higher than previous.

16,000 will probably do us up to Championship level (If we ever get there again) but yes expansion is a concern with all the residential in the main stand and surrounding.

 

[Dutch Branch]

Does the airport fall under her area? Taking a guess, is it not under Rochford?
Perhaps she didn't want to mention Fossetts/Club as its such a mess right now

The airport probably is Rochford thinking about it.

 

[Barling Magna]

The airport probably is Rochford thinking about it.

Wherever it is, it needs almost as much help as we do!

 

[tommy tucker]

No the airport borders between Rochford and southend the runways are in the rochford area .The main terminal is on the southend border .The rochford area does not start untill a few hundred yards over warners bridge .

 

[Dutch Branch]

No the airport borders between Rochford and southend the runways are in the rochford area .The main terminal is on the southend border .The rochford area does not start untill a few hundred yards over warners bridge .

Probably the reason it took so long to get built.

 

[rigsby]

The airport probably is Rochford thinking about it.

They take off over Southend so many of her voters are divided. Those that love to use Southend and hypocrites who love a holiday as long as they are flying over someone else's house.

In many ways its the same as a new stadium. Fans are still divided between those know rightly or wrongly it is now the only way forward and those that want Ron to fail.