Syria; intervention or steer clear

[Massimo Giovanni]

As I see it Syria is gradually getting more and more onto our TVs and involved with from UK, EU, USSR (whatever its called now!) and US policy.
Is it time for the 1st world countries to step in? or should it be left to the Muslims to fight it out and escalate the conflict, openly, into what it is, a sectarian quasi religious war of discrimination and revenge that is centuries old?
To me its a head you lose, tails they win situation and any form of interventionism other than protecting Turkey's border (as a NATO ally) would have longer term negative impacts similar to Iraq and not change short term hatreds and distrust.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

As I see it Syria is gradually getting more and more onto our TVs and involved with from UK, EU, USSR (whatever its called now!) and US policy.
Is it time for the 1st world countries to step in? or should it be left to the Muslims to fight it out and escalate the conflict, openly, into what it is, a sectarian quasi religious war of discrimination and revenge that is centuries old?
To me its a head you lose, tails they win situation and any form of interventionism other than protecting Turkey's border (as a NATO ally) would have longer term negative impacts similar to Iraq and not change short term hatreds and distrust.

No.We shouldn't be supplying arms to the rebels (along with France) either.

Our intervention in Iraq didn't do much good ten years on,did it?

 

[Benfleet A1]

No.We shouldn't be supplying arms to the rebels (along with France) either.

Our intervention in Iraq didn't do much good ten years on ,did it?

What about Russia supplying the Syrian government with Air Defense Systems?

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

What about Russia supplying the Syrian government with Air Defense Systems?

That was obviously a deliberate ploy to stop the West declaring a no-fly zone over Syria, as they did previously in Libya, (before eventually invading).

 

[Benfleet A1]

That's not what I asked. I asked if it was alright for Russia to supply weapons to the Syrian government while disagreeing with the west supplying the anti government forces. Its a simple enough question.

 

[MK Shrimper]

Russia (and previously the USSR) are historic allies.

As of 2011, Syria's arms contracts with Russia were worth at least $4 billion

Russia has significant trade relations with Syria. Its exports to Syria were worth $1.1 billion in 2010 and its investments in the country were valued at $19.4 billion in 2009

I think we can guess why Russia is happy for Assad to stay in power even if he is gassing his own people. The rest of the world wants a bite of that cherry and they only way they can do that is to oust Assad.

However reading about this, the West could be on a dangerous course of supporting the rebels - they're allegedly full of Islamic fundamentalists - the same enemies they're battling in Afghanistan.

 

[mrsblue]

The west refuse to learn from past mistakes.

 

[ozzie]

steer clear,what ever we do,we will end up the idiots..be more like the germans!!! always looking like the good "guys",wanting peace!! never wanting to get involved!!! not wanting wars!!! but are now the third biggest exporters of weapons in the world and getting much better every year...

 

[Benfleet A1]

steer clear,what ever we do,we will end up the idiots..be more like the germans!!! always looking like the good "guys",wanting peace!! never wanting to get involved!!! not wanting wars!!! but are now the third biggest exporters of weapons in the world and getting much better every year...

Ozzie, have a little look at a history book just to see Germany's track record on 'Wanting Peace and Not Wanting Wars'

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

According to this poll less than 25% of the British public support Britain selling arms to Syria.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/01/syria-hague-arms-intervention-military

 

[Massimo Giovanni]

According to this poll less than 25% of the British public support Britain selling arms to Syria.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/01/syria-hague-arms-intervention-military

I am not sure of what the fighting is about other than sectarianism shia/shiite?
Was the question asked about selling arms to Assad as I suspect that a similar % would sell to him as well.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

I am not sure of what the fighting is about other than sectarianism shia/shiite?
Was the question asked about selling arms to Assad as I suspect that a similar % would sell to him as well.

1.It's a civil war against Assad's murderous,undemocratic regime.

2.Probably not, as Russia (and also China) seem to have that sewn up.

 

[MK Shrimper]

1.It's a civil war against Assad's murderous,undemocratic regime.

But who protects a minority Christian population. The rebels that the West are so keen to arm are, by all accounts, Muslim Fundamentalists who have more in common with the Taliban.

 

[Massimo Giovanni]

1.It's a civil war against Assad's murderous,undemocratic regime.

2.Probably not, as Russia (and also China) seem to have that sewn up.

As you point out it isn't a good regime but the same is true in many Arab or non 1st world countries & if Iran is supporting the rebels isn't it similar to "pot calling kettle?"
My point was I suspect a lot of people would not give a hoot if arms were sold to either side and not necessarily just the rebels.l

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

As you point out it isn't a good regime but the same is true in many Arab or non 1st world countries & if Iran is supporting the rebels isn't it similar to "pot calling kettle?"
My point was I suspect a lot of people would not give a hoot if arms were sold to either side and not necessarily just the rebels.l

MKS made an excellent point in an earlier post, where he suggested that both Britain (and France)would love to get the deal supplying arms to Assad,which Russia currently provides.

 

[MK Shrimper]

MKS made an excellent point in an earlier post, where he suggested that both Britain (and France)would love to get the deal supplying arms to Assad,which Russia currently provides.

All it's about. Human life is way down on the scale to £s, $s and €s as usual.

 

[Massimo Giovanni]

I guess that MI6 and the CIA are all over the rebels and using it as a bonus to gain knowledge and intel on islamists and such. At the same time I would wager lots of stuff finds it's way back to Assad and helps him knock off those same unloved types. For sure it is a dirty business going on and it is probably, in the longer term interests of the West and lots of Arab rulers that it continues; as long as it is kept in Syria's borders.
Also most don't give a stuff about the human rights abuses happening "out there" as long as that is were it stays. France is particularly worried as French is well spoken by many Syrian and makes France (the colonial power) to be the No1 popular destination for the displaced.

 

[EastStandBlue]

Does this morning's news change anyone's opinions on this matter at all? Confirmation that Lebanon are turning a blind eye to hoards of Hezbollah forces "invading" Qusair in Assad's name and ousting the ill-prepared and ill-equipped rebel forces is surely a worrying development?

 

[londonblue]

Does this morning's news change anyone's opinions on this matter at all? Confirmation that Lebanon are turning a blind eye to hoards of Hezbollah forces "invading" Qusair in Assad's name and ousting the ill-prepared and ill-equipped rebel forces is surely a worrying development?

Rebel forces are always ill-prepared and ill-equipped, just look what they're up against: Darth Vader and a Death Star.

 

[Massimo Giovanni]

So at least 80 MPs are also considering IF Syria is too complicated and dangerous to engage with: who would have thought there were that many non idiots in parliament?