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Yorkshire Blue

Super Moderator⭐
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This is an excellent article on Southampton's success.

As recently as 2010 we were playing them in the league. Since then our paths have diverged as they have established themselves as a top half Premiership side.

Whilst I think it unlikely that we'd have had quite the same success had we followed their blueprint (certainly not without the new stadium) it was interesting to note that they've pursued almost exactly the mirror opposite strategy as us.


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There's some truth in what you say, but it's a bit harsh to say our strategy is the mirror oppposite of the Saints'. We've developed some good academy players, especially goalkeepers and tried to recruit character players such as Neil Harris and Anton Ferdinand (not to mention a certain jailbird and a crazy Tunisian.....).

Southampton's urban area has a population of over 800,000 so they have a much larger catchment than we do, plus a long tradition of being a successful top flight club of course.
 
I understand our Bob was last seen heading towards Canvey Island on a donkey for our first overseas signing, He is expected to arrive next Thursday at 2.47 a.m providing there are no problems with the cost of carrots, european sat nav and the heavily weighing bags of old one cent franc coins. so expect the first signing of a highly analysed, scientifically assessed, very young talent, ( church going and Red Cross volunteer and distant blood relative of Mother Theresa) around Friday night ready to enjoy a Malaga pre season this is how we do it the Southend Way, get together.
 
There's some truth in what you say, but it's a bit harsh to say our strategy is the mirror oppposite of the Saints'. We've developed some good academy players, especially goalkeepers and tried to recruit character players such as Neil Harris and Anton Ferdinand (not to mention a certain jailbird and a crazy Tunisian.....).

Southampton's urban area has a population of over 800,000 so they have a much larger catchment than we do, plus a long tradition of being a successful top flight club of course.

Last season we had three players who have served prison sentences play for us. If we are recruiting on character we might not be doing a very good job of it!

As for developing youth, last season Jack Bridge played 109 minutes in the league. Kyprianou (if he counts as academy) 140 minutes. I don't think any other outfield players from the academy appeared in the league, although Ted Smith was second choice keeper. The development link between the youths and the first team seems to be broken.
 
Fifty years ago, a comparison of the two clubs would be valid. Their trajectories since then make this idea of following their 'model' almost asinine. You may as well be questioning why we aren't following the Spurs model. To be one of the better clubs in the third tier is an acceptable position when we thought we wouldn't even have a club a few years ago.
 
Fair point YB, both in terms of our new preparedness to flirt with Characters inclined in the past to being naughty and not great for our reputation or role modelling as a family club, I am hoping on the development front with 9 youngsters signed up that at least one of them manages to step up this year, but I still dont think we are sharp enough at pushing them on because if not given sufficient opportunities from the bench, I would like to see us provide more constant action on the loan out front especially into the Conference, although we did start to wake up to the concept a bit more last year. We also know Phil tends to favour the more elderly citizen within the playing fraternity.
 
Last season we had three players who have served prison sentences play for us. If we are recruiting on character we might not be doing a very good job of it!

As for developing youth, last season Jack Bridge played 109 minutes in the league. Kyprianou (if he counts as academy) 140 minutes. I don't think any other outfield players from the academy appeared in the league, although Ted Smith was second choice keeper. The development link between the youths and the first team seems to be broken.

Our under 18's have already lost 6 players to bigger clubs. The ones like Southampton who can afford the better youth players and that's why we lose them. When you see a Bentley, Payne or even a Bridge running around in a blues shirt its because nobody else wanted them.
 
Fair point YB, both in terms of our new preparedness to flirt with Characters inclined in the past to being naughty and not great for our reputation or role modelling as a family club, I am hoping on the development front with 9 youngsters signed up that at least one of them manages to step up this year, but I still dont think we are sharp enough at pushing them on because if not given sufficient opportunities from the bench, I would like to see us provide more constant action on the loan out front especially into the Conference, although we did start to wake up to the concept a bit more last year. We also know Phil tends to favour the more elderly citizen within the playing fraternity.

That depends on a Conference club wanting them in the first place. Maybe we could do a better job of marketing them by giving them more minutes off the bench in League One. A player who has already tasted League Football and is on the fringe of the first team will appear a more attractive loan target than one who is looking to step up from junior football and is training with the youth development squad.
 
That depends on a Conference club wanting them in the first place. Maybe we could do a better job of marketing them by giving them more minutes off the bench in League One. A player who has already tasted League Football and is on the fringe of the first team will appear a more attractive loan target than one who is looking to step up from junior football and is training with the youth development squad.

What about the under 23's matches. What about when they train with the first team or play against them.
 
Our under 18's have already lost 6 players to bigger clubs. The ones like Southampton who can afford the better youth players and that's why we lose them. When you see a Bentley, Payne or even a Bridge running around in a blues shirt its because nobody else wanted them.

Over what time frame?

I get that the big clubs hoover up most of the talent. But they don't hoover it all up. Good players are out there - as we found with Bentley, Payne and Bridge and previously the likes of Leoanard, Moussa, Kane Ferdinand. You might not hit on every occasion but if you don't shoot you won't score.

What about the under 23's matches. What about when they train with the first team or play against them.

I expect Conference clubs give more weighting to League matches than to the developmental under 23 matches.
 
Over what time frame?

I get that the big clubs hoover up most of the talent. But they don't hoover it all up. Good players are out there - as we found with Bentley, Payne and Bridge and previously the likes of Leoanard, Moussa, Kane Ferdinand. You might not hit on every occasion but if you don't shoot you won't score.



I expect Conference clubs give more weighting to League matches than to the developmental under 23 matches.[/QUOTE]

In addition our club and the players themselves state it is a much tougher and more demanding proposition day in and day out
 
Over what time frame?

I get that the big clubs hoover up most of the talent. But they don't hoover it all up. Good players are out there - as we found with Bentley, Payne and Bridge and previously the likes of Leoanard, Moussa, Kane Ferdinand. You might not hit on every occasion but if you don't shoot you won't score.



I expect Conference clubs give more weighting to League matches than to the developmental under 23 matches.

As you know Man City signed a 13 year old for a record fee last year. Others will be snapped up at different age groups. we do of course benefit if they go on to be professional players.

When we move to FF then we will up our academy status and have a dome etc. This will not only help us attract better talent but will help keep them and believe we get more money per player if your academy is cat 2.

We do have a good blue print and some real good staff at the academy. Players are often called over during training to play against a Ranger or a Cox during the contact games, which is far better than training against a conference striker. PB sees then perform daily, so has a good idea who can cut it at L1 level.
 
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Southampton aren't really comparable to us - yes we were in the same division a few years ago but they already had the incredible stadium, big fanbase and elite youth setup. They've since had billionaire owners but even at that stage they were no paupers - they signed Rickie Lambert for £1m in 2009. The structure across the club that they've had in place has all cost money

Reading through the article I'm struggling to see any real 'lessons' for a club like ours. What specific things that they've done do you think that we should have done? Signing young players?
 
Southampton aren't really comparable to us - yes we were in the same division a few years ago but they already had the incredible stadium, big fanbase and elite youth setup. They've since had billionaire owners but even at that stage they were no paupers - they signed Rickie Lambert for £1m in 2009. The structure across the club that they've had in place has all cost money

Reading through the article I'm struggling to see any real 'lessons' for a club like ours. What specific things that they've done do you think that we should have done? Signing young players?

Build a shiny new stadiu.....oh :sad:
 
Southampton aren't really comparable to us - yes we were in the same division a few years ago but they already had the incredible stadium, big fanbase and elite youth setup. They've since had billionaire owners but even at that stage they were no paupers - they signed Rickie Lambert for £1m in 2009. The structure across the club that they've had in place has all cost money

Reading through the article I'm struggling to see any real 'lessons' for a club like ours. What specific things that they've done do you think that we should have done? Signing young players?

Sign players based on resale value, plan long term, sign good character players, develop a way of playing and find managers who play that way, give more opportunities to academy players, look for tactically adept players and for players who can run for longer etc

(I realise most of them equate to sign more Ryan Leonards - can we clone him?)
 
Sign players based on resale value, plan long term, sign good character players, develop a way of playing and find managers who play that way, give more opportunities to academy players, look for tactically adept players and for players who can run for longer etc

(I realise most of them equate to sign more Ryan Leonards - can we clone him?)

Sounds all very easy but our budget is closer to Southend Manor than it is Southampton.

No point in signing the next Leoanard because in L2 and the last 2 seasons PB had time to develop Lenny into the player he is. The fans won't give the next Lenny the time of day, just look at the posts about Ted Smith, Inniss or Amos.
 
I'd like to see Amos again. Both PB and the players were hugely impressed by him and in the little I saw of him his use of the ball was excellent.
 
Time to revisit this.

One of the key factors behind Southampton's success was managers who fit the Southampton way.

We've now had three managers in 18 months, all recruiting players for different philosophies.

Such a changing recruitment policy isn't a recipe for success. Players who fit one manager won't fit his replacement.
 
Time to revisit this.

One of the key factors behind Southampton's success was managers who fit the Southampton way.

We've now had three managers in 18 months, all recruiting players for different philosophies.

Such a changing recruitment policy isn't a recipe for success. Players who fit one manager won't fit his replacement.

We could pursue a such a philosophy but when the Chairman is too busy trying to get the new stadium pushed through to give enough attention to the footballing side of things (leading to managerial appointments being made without due diligence being undertaken) and won’t employ a CEO to look after it. I just don’t think we’d be able to put the cohesive structure needed in place at the moment.
 
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