Trouble at the Hall

[rigsby]

We have had problems against Cambridge, Luton and now Port Vale. If this trend continues whether its our fault or not we will end up with a reputation, one which may end up with another Simon Dobbin type incident. Only this time some innocent shrimper on the receiving end either at RH or in some revenge attack in the reverse fixture.

What I'm asking is there anything us fans could do to improve the current trend. I know its always easy to point fingers at everyone else, the club, police, away fans etc. My point is they could do with some obvious help from us.

I was in the Spread v Cambridge and witnessed the trouble before the game. The group I was with all new that there was a growing number of the saga Cambridge casuals infiltrating the pub. However because we had not seen trouble for a while and the fact it was only Cambridge we all ignored the obvious intent amongst their group.

Should we have told the Bar staff.....yes
Should we have told the door staff....yes
Should we and the pub staff have told the police.........yes.

I was unaware of the Hooligan forum that was running at the time and it appears so were the police. But quite a few shrimpers were aware so again could the police and club been given some intelligence beforehand.
If the whole day had been handled better would the attack on Simon have happened..... probably not.

Geographically were our pubs are situated there is always going to be opposing fans mingling so should the club cater better for away fans. A proper bar etc behind the North Bank may help?

 

[Ayrshire Blue]

We have had problems against Cambridge, Luton and now Port Vale. If this trend continues whether its our fault or not we will end up with a reputation, one which may end up with another Simon Dobbin type incident. Only this time some innocent shrimper on the receiving end either at RH or in some revenge attack in the reverse fixture.

Lol .............

 

[mrsblue]

We have had problems against Cambridge, Luton and now Port Vale. If this trend continues whether its our fault or not we will end up with a reputation, one which may end up with another Simon Dobbin type incident. Only this time some innocent shrimper on the receiving end either at RH or in some revenge attack in the reverse fixture.

What I'm asking is there anything us fans could do to improve the current trend. I know its always easy to point fingers at everyone else, the club, police, away fans etc. My point is they could do with some obvious help from us.

I was in the Spread v Cambridge and witnessed the trouble before the game. The group I was with all new that there was a growing number of the saga Cambridge casuals infiltrating the pub. However because we had not seen trouble for a while and the fact it was only Cambridge we all ignored the obvious intent amongst their group.

Should we have told the Bar staff.....yes
Should we have told the door staff....yes
Should we and the pub staff have told the police.........yes.

I was unaware of the Hooligan forum that was running at the time and it appears so were the police. But quite a few shrimpers were aware so again could the police and club been given some intelligence beforehand.
If the whole day had been handled better would the attack on Simon have happened..... probably not.

Geographically were our pubs are situated there is always going to be opposing fans mingling so should the club cater better for away fans. A proper bar etc behind the North Bank may help?

Portacabins behind the North selling booze and food,cheap start up cost and potential 10,000 customers,ker ching !

 

[ooh-andy-ansah]

Portacabins behind the North selling booze and food,cheap start up cost and potential 10,000 customers,ker ching !

10,000 away fans ? As wildy inaccurate as your opinion that Jason Williams is our messiah in waiting :smile:

 

[mrsblue]

10,000 away fans ? As wildy inaccurate as your opinion that Jason Williams is our messiah in waiting :smile:

Over the the course of the season ,I'm off to pay homage to Jason:winking:

 

[RobM]

As usual. alcohol is the cause of trouble. Nobody starts a fight because a crowd of people are all sober (or "clean").

 

[Massimo Giovanni]

The wider issues are discussed above and on other threads, AND.
The "glorification" by some of the aggro with Watford, stabbings and Leigh Comm BootBoys are either intended or not going to get some "new fans" to consider imitation and doing similar - those days were often NOT great and the unpleasantness, racism and homophobia down right repugnant.
The North Bank catering, and most of the home stuff is VERY POOR, a mingle area with beer and pie tent in the car park MIGHT be a good way to create revenue, goodwill and ease the issues of the current poor arrangements that make getting to the ground, and staying after so unappealing for home and away fans.

 

[Jam_Man]

We have had problems against Cambridge, Luton and now Port Vale. If this trend continues whether its our fault or not we will end up with a reputation, one which may end up with another Simon Dobbin type incident. Only this time some innocent shrimper on the receiving end either at RH or in some revenge attack in the reverse fixture.

What I'm asking is there anything us fans could do to improve the current trend. I know its always easy to point fingers at everyone else, the club, police, away fans etc. My point is they could do with some obvious help from us.

I was in the Spread v Cambridge and witnessed the trouble before the game. The group I was with all new that there was a growing number of the saga Cambridge casuals infiltrating the pub. However because we had not seen trouble for a while and the fact it was only Cambridge we all ignored the obvious intent amongst their group.

Should we have told the Bar staff.....yes
Should we have told the door staff....yes
Should we and the pub staff have told the police.........yes.

I was unaware of the Hooligan forum that was running at the time and it appears so were the police. But quite a few shrimpers were aware so again could the police and club been given some intelligence beforehand.
If the whole day had been handled better would the attack on Simon have happened..... probably not.

Geographically were our pubs are situated there is always going to be opposing fans mingling so should the club cater better for away fans. A proper bar etc behind the North Bank may help?

The trouble with Luton and Port Vale originated from away fans after the game and had nothing to do with opposing fans mingling beforehand in pubs.

Is giving them more beer the solution?

 

[Kevin Hogg]

The reminiscing to days that have happened years ago have absolutely nothing to do with recent incidents. The Watford years were a part of the club's history.

What does have an effect on the current situation is the virtual "run of the area" that s given to opposing fans ..no matter how aggressive they appear to be and no matter what they do. I never want the heavy-handed policing of years gone by, where football fans were treated as criminals before a beer had been drunk or a ticket purchased. However, opposing supporters can do whatever they like at Roots Hall..unless it is at The Blue Boar half hour either side of the match.
While there is virtually nobody taking any notice of anything away supporters do? There may be incidents from time to time.

 

[Napster]

bring back Spooner....the new coppers aren't as keen.

 

[rigsby]

The trouble with Luton and Port Vale originated from away fans after the game and had nothing to do with opposing fans mingling beforehand in pubs.

Is giving them more beer the solution?

I never meant mingling actually inside the pubs. Where the Blue Boar or the Golden Lion are on the main streets fans have to cross paths. As we have heard the Port Vale trouble started before the match. there was an incident by the shop but who knows that punch could have been because of something even earlier.


After the Luton game I stayed for a drink in the ground for nearly an hour. As I walked up to the Blue Boar on my own, I could see their had been trouble, police cars in the road and about 60 or70 Luton loitering with intent outside the pub. Most of them weren't even drinking. I crossed over and thought it best to walk up to the town on the left hand side of Victoria avenue. A group of about 5 Luton saw me and started to cross the road. I new they had no intention of discussing the merits of 451 so had to take a sharp left and head towards the railway

 

[THE SEVENTIES NORTH BANK]

We have had problems against Cambridge, Luton and now Port Vale. If this trend continues whether its our fault or not we will end up with a reputation, one which may end up with another Simon Dobbin type incident. Only this time some innocent shrimper on the receiving end either at RH or in some revenge attack in the reverse fixture.

What I'm asking is there anything us fans could do to improve the current trend. I know its always easy to point fingers at everyone else, the club, police, away fans etc. My point is they could do with some obvious help from us.

I was in the Spread v Cambridge and witnessed the trouble before the game. The group I was with all new that there was a growing number of the saga Cambridge casuals infiltrating the pub. However because we had not seen trouble for a while and the fact it was only Cambridge we all ignored the obvious intent amongst their group.

Should we have told the Bar staff.....yes
Should we have told the door staff....yes
Should we and the pub staff have told the police.........yes.

I was unaware of the Hooligan forum that was running at the time and it appears so were the police. But quite a few shrimpers were aware so again could the police and club been given some intelligence beforehand.
If the whole day had been handled better would the attack on Simon have happened..... probably not.

Geographically were our pubs are situated there is always going to be opposing fans mingling so should the club cater better for away fans. A proper bar etc behind the North Bank may help?

Those Cambridge hoolies were not looking for somewhere to drink, they were looking for a punch up in a place where they knew there would be Southend fans drinking. So a bar behind the North Bank would have made no difference.

 

[rigsby]

Those Cambridge hoolies were not looking for somewhere to drink, they were looking for a punch up in a place where they knew there would be Southend fans drinking. So a bar behind the North Bank would have made no difference.

I'm not claiming there's one easy solution. Each game that's involved trouble its been in a different place around the local area

Out of interest what would be your ideas then?

 

[THE SEVENTIES NORTH BANK]

I'm not claiming there's one easy solution. Each game that's involved trouble its been in a different place around the local area

Out of interest what would be your ideas then?

A bar for the away fans would be O.K., but it will never stop trouble. The Golden Lion was the away fans pub, and it worked well with hardly any trouble with Southend fans a few yards away in The Spread Eagle. The trouble was always from away fans that had come for a punch up and went looking for Southend fans in and around The Spread. That's when it kicked off. The Blue Boar is now the away pub. The Luton fans outside The Blue Boar were very mouthy to passing Southend fans, but didn't attack them, thanks to a police presence. The separate Luton mob that came up Shakespeare Drive did all the damage, with no police escort, and were given a free reign to assault anyone they wanted. So in my view, better policing is the answer. No away fans should be allowed to come out of The North Bank and go up Shakespeare Drive. No large mob of obviously away fans, should be allowed to enter The Spread Eagle, and should be shepherded up to The Blue Boar, or down to The North Bank.

 

[Cockle43]

SNB, I think you've pretty much summed it up.

I do have a couple of points to make, as you said, the Luton fans were outside giving it large to the passing Southend fans, again, last Saturday, the Vale fans seemed to be bunched outside the Blue Boar and also appeared to be drinking outside. There were a couple of police officers there but didn't seem to be taking much action. I stand to be corrected but I was under the impression that it was forbidden in Southend to drink outside the curtilage of a licenced premise, so why was no action taken? Certainly we have been told, in no uncertain terms by the police, that we cannot drink in the street outside the Spread.

The second point is that it is all about intelligence, I was most surprised that it all kicked off with Vale on Saturday, and I'm told so were the police although they knew there'd been some incidents in town on Friday night. I would suggest that intelligence indicates that there is a higher risk with certain clubs, however with others there's very little. A couple of years ago several Mansfield supporters came in the Spread they were a good bunch of lads who just wanted to have a beer and chat about football and the upcoming game, personally I'd welcome them back anytime. Whereas the Cambridge 'fans' in the Spread were definitely not up for a chat about football, I've not seem such hate and aggression in men's faces for many a long year; I was in there with rigsby and a few others and there's no two ways about it, without the timely intervention of the police the half a dozen or so of us left in there were going to get a good kicking and any one of us could have been Simon Dobbin.......

 

[Jai]

Still can't believe the Spread let them in. The Railway knew the score and had already turned them away.

 

[Clinton Baptiste]

The doormen on the Spread check your match ticket dont they? They have everytime Ive been.

 

[Jai]

I've never been asked to show my match ticket on the door of the Spread. Mind you I don't go in there any more after the way they handled that Cambridge game. Rather give my custom to the Railway.

 

[OldBlueLady]

I stand to be corrected but I was under the impression that it was forbidden in Southend to drink outside the curtilage of a licenced premise, so why was no action taken? Certainly we have been told, in no uncertain terms by the police, that we cannot drink in the street outside the Spread.

I don't know the Blue Boar, is there no outside drinking space other than out the front? If the licensing boards are coming down hard on the Roots Hall bars at present and being quite strict on numbers permitted, then surely this ought to be continuing in the pubs and bars outside the ground? It can be quite intimidating walking past the Boar, even on the other side of West Road at times.

The doormen on the Spread check your match ticket dont they? They have everytime Ive been.

I may be wrong, but I think, since the Cambridge game, the guys on the door at the Spread have been "upgraded" (if you understand what I mean). They have more "presence" and I would suggest, give off more of an aura of being less likely to accept any BS from opposing fans.

 

[rigsby]

The doormen on the Spread check your match ticket dont they? They have everytime Ive been.

Before the Cambridge incident it all became very relaxed. Now they are more likely to ask where your from and there's plastic glasses. However would be easy to lie anyway.

The Cambridge hoolies slipped in two or three at a time and were texting. Like I say could have been handled much better. To allow them to leave the ground that early and eventually bring their coaches to right outside the Spread was really poor.