Who Wants Our Club Dead?

[Cricko]

How can anyone call themselves a supporter and say maybe letting the club die could be a good thing.SHAME! SHAME! SHAME!

Without being rude and if I seem so I apologise in advance, how long have you been supporting this club?

 

[callan]

How can anyone call themselves a supporter and say maybe letting the club die could be a good thing.SHAME! SHAME! SHAME!

I think he actually makes a valid point, why shouldn't he call himself a supporter?....he was actually talking about the rebirth of the club.

 

[buffalowolf]

60 years , 1953 was the first match i saw ,i used to stand behind the goal Harry Threadgold was in,i attended up until 1966 when i came to Australia to live, and since that time have followed them firstly through my mother sending out the local papers to me each week, then when computerised ..But only this year decided to join Shrimperzone. But have been getting emails from the club for a few years now .Why are you unhappy because i make some comments and the fact i live in AUSTRALIA, you think dosent give me the right.Also my Brothers there have kept me up with all the news too, I have 4 brothers still live there.

 

[buffalowolf]

Its not a good thing to let any club die , even if it is reborn, no club should die without a fight being put up by its supporters.If even after a fight by the supporters to keep it alive ,then so be it , but too stand by and let it die ,a true supporter wouldnt do that ,im sorry.

 

[Cricko]

60 years , 1953 was the first match i saw ,i used to stand behind the goal Harry Threadgold was in,i attended up until 1966 when i came to Australia to live, and since that time have followed them firstly through my mother sending out the local papers to me each week, then when computerised ..But only this year decided to join Shrimperzone. But have been getting emails from the club for a few years now .Why are you unhappy because i make some comments and the fact i live in AUSTRALIA, you think dosent give me the right.Also my Brothers there have kept me up with all the news too, I have 4 brothers still live there.

Well then I admire your faith and knowledge from afar and wish, as you we survive.

 

[buffalowolf]

Losing S.u.f.c would to me be like losing a family member.Seriously i would never want to see a football match again anywhere.I understand your asking ,because of where i live.There are quite a few Southend supporters live in Australia, too many Man U and Liverpool ,they should be deported.

 

[amsemp]

I don't want to appear completely out of touch :unsure: But can someone enlighten me on exactly what the council meeting on the 10th is regarding?

 

[Jam_Man]

There is a concerted campaign going on to drive Ron Martin out of business and deny him the chance to build Martin's Mall at Fosset's Farm. So what? Martin has a reputation for making enemies and saying what people want to hear while doing things they'd rather he didn't. Not many people would shed a tear if this campaign succeeds.

But there is a fly in the ointment - if Martin fails, then there will be no new Stadium for Southend United. Not even three quarters of one - and that spells doom for our club. Sadly, it seems that the people who want to see Martin given the bum's rush are quite happy to accept that as "collateral damage". I am not.

Bernie Friend's retelling of what is alleged to be Chris Philip's story of dreadful things bearing down on the Good Ship Martin is one symptom of this (No, I don't think CP and BF are conspirators but I do think they are being nicely manipulated). So why is this campaign (which has simmered on and off ever since the Blue Knights failed in their takeover attempt) boiling up again? It is because Southend Council are about to consider the latest re-writing of the Martin Plan for Fosset's. And it is designed squarely to influence Councillors in advance of that meeting. If this campaign succeeds, our club is done. Finished. It may seem nicely romantic to talk about a "phoenix club", of starting again at the bottom, all matey fans pulling together to build the club up again from nothing, but it is likely to be a fantasy. We would have nowhere to play. Nowhere to build a new stadium. And no guarantee of success. Best avoided if at all possible.

So what can we do about it? We can put aside our differences, put also to one side our (pretty understandable) dislike of our Chairman, and start lobbying our councillors, and lobbying hard - and the Trust must take a lead in this, not least by posting councillors emails so we can lobby our representatives directly. Having a successful League Club in the Town is a real asset, from bringing in trade to building the Town's profile - most Towns and Cities understand this, and it is up to us to make sure our Councillors do too.

One of our most influential posters and supporters has been saying lately that he no longer worries, and what will be will be. That is understandable - but it is playing into the hands of people who would happily destroy our club to see Martin fail, and that cannot be tolerated. I have no desire or appetite to line RM's pockets but if that is the price that has to be paid to secure the future of the club we ALL love then so be it.

Let's start making ourselves heard!

Sorry for replying late, been away.

I'm all for trying to influence the council to agreeing the new plans, but even if they do are we actually able to progress?

Lets not ignore the main fact here, we have not been able to finance the project. Thats not the fault of the council who have been behind the project since it was agreed 7 years ago (or whenever it was). Even if Ron gets his latest amendments agreed we are still not going to get a complete stadium.

To say our problems are because of a campaign against Ron Martin is flipping the facts completely. If Ron Martin had not made such a pigs ear of everything there would have been no negativity towards him.

By all means campaign for whatever you think will help the club, but lets not ignore where the real problems and hurdles actually are.

I dont want to drive Ron Martin out of the club, I want him to deliver what he set out to do, if he cant do so Id like him to let someone else do so, but we all know that wont happen.

 

[Jam_Man]

I don't want to appear completely out of touch :unsure: But can someone enlighten me on exactly what the council meeting on the 10th is regarding?

Signing of the final plans for a 3 sided stadium and a reduction in the amount we have to pay the council for redevelopment. Basically we want to pay them about 3 million pound less than we agreed to...

 

[A Century United]

Sorry for replying late, been away.

1. I'm all for trying to influence the council to agreeing the new plans, but even if they do are we actually able to progress?

2. Lets not ignore the main fact here, we have not been able to finance the project. Thats not the fault of the council who have been behind the project since it was agreed 7 years ago (or whenever it was). Even if Ron gets his latest amendments agreed we are still not going to get a complete stadium.

3. To say our problems are because of a campaign against Ron Martin is flipping the facts completely. If Ron Martin had not made such a pigs ear of everything there would have been no negativity towards him.

​4. By all means campaign for whatever you think will help the club, but lets not ignore where the real problems and hurdles actually are.

I dont want to drive Ron Martin out of the club, I want him to deliver what he set out to do, if he cant do so Id like him to let someone else do so, but we all know that wont happen.

1. Sainsburys think so or they wouldn't be issuing letters on joint letter head.
2. Nobody is saying it is the fault of the Council. Ron is responsible for a lot, but the banking crisis isn't in that list, so it's not his fault either. The Council need to recognise the financial reality of 2013 when it considers this.
3. (and 4.) Where have I said our problems are because of a campaign against RM? What I have said is that there is a campaign being waged, and the people who want to bring Ron down don't care if we go too. I have nowhere tried to exculpate Ron for his responsibility for our situation, but for people to simply point at RM and say "It's all his fault!" is to ignore the wider picture.

 

[Jam_Man]

[*]Sainsburys think so or they wouldn't be issuing letters on joint letter head.
[*]Nobody is saying it is the fault of the Council. Ron is responsible for a lot, but the banking crisis isn't in that list, so it's not his fault either. The Council need to recognise the financial reality of 2013 when it considers this.

It is Rons fault he clung onto the dream that he couldn't afford to make reality.

The credit crunch happened long time ago, why hasn't he taken actions to deal with it, one of which would be selling up and walking away?

[*](and 4.) Where have I said our problems are because of a campaign against RM? What I have said is that there is a campaign being waged, and the people who want to bring Ron down don't care if we go too. I have nowhere tried to exculpate Ron for his responsibility for our situation, but for people to simply point at RM and say "It's all his fault!" is to ignore the wider picture.

Ron can not be forced anywhere, he owns the whole shebang. Any 'campaign' against him would be totally fruitless if he was actually able to run the club financially. If people undermine him and he pays the bills it would be pointless.

To say its not RM's fault is to ignore the actual root cause. If he doesnt have the ability to build it no supporting him will make the blind bit of difference.

If the council rubber stamp the ground do you actually believe work will start anytime soon ?

 

[A Century United]

I don't want to appear completely out of touch :unsure: But can someone enlighten me on exactly what the council meeting on the 10th is regarding?

Signing of the final plans for a 3 sided stadium and a reduction in the amount we have to pay the council for redevelopment. Basically we want to pay them about 3 million pound less than we agreed to...

Read This Thread

That's misleading and unhelpful Jam_Man. If you read the thread, I am not the only one who thinks that changing the amount offered (and we are under no legal obligation to offer it) in view of the change in the plans and the effect the plans will have on the Town Centre isn't entirely unreasonable. Note also, that Sainsburys are co-signatories of the letter and therefore are of the same opinion as RM.

 

[Jam_Man]

Read This Thread

That's misleading and unhelpful Jam_Man. If you read the thread, I am not the only one who thinks that changing the amount offered (and we are under no legal obligation to offer it) in view of the change in the plans and the effect the plans will have on the Town Centre isn't entirely unreasonable. Note also, that Sainsburys are co-signatories of the letter and therefore are of the same opinion as RM.

How is it misleading,its how it is ?

We agreed as part of the original plan to pay X amount and now we want, because we have been unable to progress the plan, to pay less.

I can certainly see the reasoning that the amount agreed would be different now and I expect the council will agree to it as 3 million is better than nothing if it all falls through. No big shock Sainsbury agree either as its in their own interest.

Again though, the issues here are not this fee but our overall inability to actually pay for the stadium.

If the whole project is on a knife edge over 3 million how are we going to pay the 80 million or so the whole stadium will cost seeing as Sainsbury are stopping at 3 sides?

 

[tommy tucker]

Colchester council backed that silly stadium on the A12 so why would Southend council want our new stadium to fail .To me this just does not add up . To say no to Southend united may kill the club off .But I thought this so called government and council want to build up the economy not knock it down .And as for the council saying they want to build up the high street not kill it off .Have they looked at there so called high street lately it died long ago without Fossetts farms help .

 

[shrimperjon]

I've always said that I would support the club no matter what league they are in, however, having watched Billericay over the years including against the likes of Dagenham and Wimbledon, it feels me with dread to think that we could actually be in that position one day, I don't want the club that we love to die, but we all bleed blue blood, and once a shrimper, always a shrimper!

 

[GodblessArthurRowley]

Maybe having the club die isn't so bad. Chester fans were so fed up with the way their club was being run that they got the old club shut down and started again with the club being run by the fans. Now they lead Conference North by a mile and I wouldn't be at all surprised to see them back in the Football League very soon.

This has been my position for a while now.This club will never die because of the fans who support it, but can we really carry on like this for much longer.

 

[A Century United]

It is Rons fault he clung onto the dream that he couldn't afford to make reality.

The credit crunch happened long time ago, why hasn't he taken actions to deal with it, one of which would be selling up and walking away?



Ron can not be forced anywhere, he owns the whole shebang. Any 'campaign' against him would be totally fruitless if he was actually able to run the club financially. If people undermine him and he pays the bills it would be pointless.

To say its not RM's fault is to ignore the actual root cause. If he doesnt have the ability to build it no supporting him will make the blind bit of difference.

If the council rubber stamp the ground do you actually believe work will start anytime soon ?

Wait and see. I think your perspective is simplistic, and clouded by dislike of RM. While I have no problem understanding why people hate him, it isn't helpful to make judgements about other people's behaviour based on personal feelings. Ron has taken action - he has brought in Sainsburys as co-developers, which is always either ignored or forgotten.

What if selling ruins him? Would you sell in his position, if that was the case, or would you hang on to try and rescue your investment? Absolutely I'd hang on. I might not like the position that RM has got us into, or his behaviour, but I am honest enough to know that in his position I would fight to the end.

And your comment "any campaign against him would be totally fruitless if he was actually able to run the club financially...." misses the point completely. He can't, therefore it might not be, and WE will be the ones to suffer.

There is a "Blame Game" going on here. It is as if, finding ourselves in a car stalled on a level crossing, we are spending all our time berating the driver instead of trying to move the car clear or stop the oncoming train.

(PS - sorry for late reply, idiots Muir burning brought down electricity poles and we had a power cut)

 

[fbm]

If Ron Martin had not made such a pigs ear of everything there would have been no negativity towards him.

By all means campaign for whatever you think will help the club, but lets not ignore where the real problems and hurdles actually are.

I dont want to drive Ron Martin out of the club, I want him to deliver what he set out to do, if he cant do so Id like him to let someone else do so, but we all know that wont happen.

To be honest, he actually hasn't made a pigs ear of anything. Yet. Given the issues that weren't anything to do with him (credit crunch etc) I personally think it's a miracle that we're still where we actually are.

 

[A Century United]

How is it misleading,its how it is ?

We agreed as part of the original plan to pay X amount and now we want, because we have been unable to progress the plan, to pay less.

I can certainly see the reasoning that the amount agreed would be different now and I expect the council will agree to it as 3 million is better than nothing if it all falls through. No big shock Sainsbury agree either as its in their own interest.

Again though, the issues here are not this fee but our overall inability to actually pay for the stadium.

If the whole project is on a knife edge over 3 million how are we going to pay the 80 million or so the whole stadium will cost seeing as Sainsbury are stopping at 3 sides?

But you didn't debate or acknowledge the situation in the round. You simply posted up a comment which people who haven't been following the situation will use as confirmation of Ron's duplicity and/or incompetence, and in this case that is misleading.

My point about Sainsburys agreeing was intended to show support for more than just paring down the S106 payment. Sainsburys are co-developers of the whole project. If they didn't think that the whole project (up to the three sides of the stadium, but including the retail) could be finished they wouldn't still be sharing a letter head with SUFC.

Finishing the Stadium is of course a concern, but not even starting it is a bigger one. Martin's argument is that he needs to find a Hotel chain who will co-develop that fourth side. While nothing is guaranteed, the success and expansion of the Airport would seem to give hope that a Hotel chain will find the idea of a Hotel on the site attractive.

 

[davewebbsbrain]

To be honest, he actually hasn't made a pigs ear of anything. Yet. Given the issues that weren't anything to do with him (credit crunch etc) I personally think it's a miracle that we're still where we actually are.

This is something I have long been saying. The rug was pulled from under RM at the last hurdle by the banks and he has been given the blame by all and sundry on here.