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Youth Team Set up

DTS

The Business
Joined
Oct 25, 2003
Messages
16,173
Location
In a world of my own.
Looking at our results again this season the youngsters seem to lose nearly every game they play. We havent really produced a youth product who has had a continous break in the first team since say Leo Roget nearly years ago.

Kightly looked good but has gone off the boil a bit from what I hear, McSweeney was alright but never really set the world on fire and before him can hardly recall a youth player coming through in the past 7 seasons.

My point really and I am talking as someone that hasnt seen the Youth lads is - Is it really worth pursuing this venture which has totally fail to deliver any tangible results or would we not be beter of putting our resources into say poaching a couple of good lads a season who are released by say Arsenal,Spurs etc...?
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DtS
 

southend4ever

I used to play a little.
Joined
Oct 24, 2003
Messages
8,756
this is a fair point. it could be worthing looking into it and every now and then it is good to see a player pushing the current squad for places.

kights got injured and hasn't recovered the same sort of form since. he still very much wants to play for southend. whether he will or not shall remain to be seen. to be honest he has never had a decent chance in the side at league level.
 

DTS

The Business
Joined
Oct 25, 2003
Messages
16,173
Location
In a world of my own.
Too add to my point Nicolau,Gower,Maher and Fredy were all released by London based clubs early in their careers and now at least3 of them make up the back done of our team.Oyr location must make us an attractive offer to young southern based players.

Think, you will find Leo was released by West Ham as a younster before we ever got him.

Think of the number of YTS players we must have say 16 in there first 2 years, if they are paid just £50 a week which is possibly below minimum wage then that is £2600 per player or £41,600 a year. Add to this Ross Maclaren money say £25k pa and the cost of travel and running the team and you probably not getting much change from £100k a season and for what - To be a fedder club to the likes of Heybridge,Grays, Thurrock etc etc.
 

southend4ever

I used to play a little.
Joined
Oct 24, 2003
Messages
8,756
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Mr Wooly @ Jan. 02 2005,21:47)]Is he still at Farnborough?
apparently so. but i would have thought that is right near to the end now. i haven't spoken to him over xmas and not seen him about.

i think he may have picked up a little knock again since going there unsure about that...

i await someone in the know to reply
tounge.gif
 

Shrimp in a Kilt

Guest
[b said:
Quote[/b] (southend4ever @ Jan. 02 2005,23:02)]
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Mr Wooly @ Jan. 02 2005,21:47)]Is he still at Farnborough?
apparently so. but i would have thought that is right near to the end now. i haven't spoken to him over xmas and not seen him about.

i think he may have picked up a little knock again since going there unsure about that...

i await someone in the know to reply  
tounge.gif
Just read on the official site that he is injured.
 

shrimper roman

Guest
to have a successful youth policy you must have a good scouting network first and second some good coaching staff and at the end of that conveyor belt someone who loves coaching youngsters,he is dedicate,has passion and the necessary know-how to deal with youngsters.at present , we haven't got anyone with this credentials at the club and we will never have one. if we believe that clubs like arsenal,ipswich,west ham, do things that tiny southend can't do i will invite everyone of you to visit some clubs on the continent to realize that isn't the case.it is down to good scouting and good coaching things that don't need loads of money.the lilliputians from dario gradi's crewe alexandra are the living proof of that! but anyway who gives a toss,the only
thing that really counts is the first team, the rest has got to be done just to keep up appearances!
 

Stan

Youth Team
Joined
Dec 10, 2003
Messages
166
Location
Chelmsford
[b said:
Quote[/b] (southend4ever @ Jan. 02 2005,23:02)]
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Mr Wooly @ Jan. 02 2005,21:47)]Is he still at Farnborough?
apparently so. but i would have thought that is right near to the end now. i haven't spoken to him over xmas and not seen him about.

i think he may have picked up a little knock again since going there unsure about that...

i await someone in the know to reply  
tounge.gif
Kightly agreed to a third months loan a few days ago i think( so they said on the farnborough messageboard), but he has picked up a calf injury.
 

TheLittleGazette

First XI
Joined
Oct 27, 2003
Messages
388
You have to remember that just three years ago our lads were under the 'leadership' of Marc Massey, a man who I won't even bother teling you about, and they have come a long way since then.

Yes, they have lost a few games, but they have beaten C********r away (who knocked Chelsea out of the Youth Cup) and also beaten Premier$hite side Portsmouth away from home.

Theyt are not always getting the results, but they are a decent set of lads and our youth set up is gradually recovering from the Massey days.
 

Thenewblue

Manager
Joined
Oct 4, 2004
Messages
1,074
I played under Massey and cab driving aside I had no problems with the man, good stand up citizen, I like the guy and although I have no idea what went on while he was at Southend as a PERSON he's a nice guy so I feel u should explain somewhat ur last statement pls!
 

shrimper roman

Guest
i would like to remind you that 7-8 of the players that form the youth team now, were first year scholars under massey.
they were asked to play against boys two years older than them,a massive task plus he had some 2nd year scholars inherited from ricky duncan that were not up to the task(attitude and ability wise). after the first thumpings everybody
at the club realized what mistake they have made (throwing 16 years old boys in an u'19's league because of lack of decent 2nd and 3rd year boys from previous managements)
frustration got to mark and the boys ending with his "resignation"(ask rob and tilly what went on in this case)
massey had the same crop of players when they were 14's and
had a very successful year with them playing against the right age group.the present youth team coach has in his hands
an older team with most of them coming to an end of their scholarship thus he should win some more matches. at this point i would say it 's not what really matter: the most important thing is pushing players through and if lawson and a few others make their first team debut and get rewarded with a first team contract then it's job done for the fella! the big problem will be how to replace them because,there isn't a lot looming behind,but that's another story...
wow.gif
 

rabbloke

Coach
Joined
Aug 13, 2004
Messages
718
[b said:
Quote[/b] (TheLittleGazette @ Jan. 03 2005,01:10)]You have to remember that just three years ago our lads were under the 'leadership' of Marc Massey, a man who I won't even bother teling you about, and they have come a long way since then.

Yes, they have lost a few games, but they have beaten C********r away (who knocked Chelsea out of the Youth Cup) and also beaten Premier$hite side Portsmouth away from home.

Theyt are not always getting the results, but they are a decent set of lads and our youth set up is gradually recovering from the Massey days.
I am glad you report that the youth set up is going in the right direction. If in the next three years it produces three player that give extended service to the first team then it has done its job and been of value. We must also realise that the senior youths prop up the reserve team and I doubt we could field a stiffs team week in and week out without them. I for one believe the period we did not have a reserve side was a bleak time and it contributed to the first teams decline. Also the youth side has a community interest value and introduces the young players, their families, their friends and their schools to Roots Hall soccer. We are nothing unless we can gaurantee the next generation of supporters.
 

DTS

The Business
Joined
Oct 25, 2003
Messages
16,173
Location
In a world of my own.
My question really tho is - Is this venture worth continuing looking at it on a purely financial basis which is the only way a lub like our can do.

Yes - The players are getting better and Yes - Ut us important for the communit etc etc but for the cost of running it for the past 10 years if my calcualtions are correct has been a cool milloin.....Is it really worth this massive invesment...???
 

TerryintheWest

Guest
The club do get a hefty grant from a consortium made up by  the Government, the Lottery, Sport England, the FA, the PFA, and one or two others for running the Centre of Excellence.  
smile.gif
 

sufcintheprem

This is a modified caption
Joined
Mar 26, 2004
Messages
10,185
Location
Putney
Sadly, at the moment, there is a glut of good players going round the leagues for free after widespread cutbacks reduced squad sizes. Even after the football league acclimatises to new financial positions, it still seems that there is more of a case for Prem teams having centres of excellence and lower leagues feeding from it.

I really hope this doesn't turn out to be the case. Homegrown players always get much more chances to perform and are generally endeared to home fans more easily (f.ex. was Roget really a top player or was it just because he was perceived as home grown?).

IMO, if we run the academy for ten years and produce two players who can break in to the first team then I think the academy has done a pretty good job.

Just need to stop the hamsters poaching our local youngsters

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I'm sure there was one lad at the start of this season, only 14, who signed his future away to them. Can't help feeling that may be one that's slipped through the net for us....
 

OlvisIII

Coach
Joined
Nov 20, 2003
Messages
865
Those people suggesting that the youth set up is a waste of money are completely short sighted. To abolish our centre of excellence would be a massive step backwards - the first team is finally moving forwards again under Tilly, so why make life difficult for ourselves. It's the same with the reserves - it is an important part of player development and integration of the youth to first team football. Let's keep the structure of the club secure at this exciting time.
 

Guest

Guest
[b said:
Quote[/b] (TheLittleGazette @ Jan. 03 2005,01:10)]You have to remember that just three years ago our lads were under the 'leadership' of Marc Massey, a man who I won't even bother teling you about, and they have come a long way since then.

Yes, they have lost a few games, but they have beaten C********r away (who knocked Chelsea out of the Youth Cup) and also beaten Premier$hite side Portsmouth away from home.

Theyt are not always getting the results, but they are a decent set of lads and our youth set up is gradually recovering from the Massey days.
Come on then Mark, what's your beef with me?
 

Upminster Blue

Manager
Joined
Feb 12, 2004
Messages
1,567
[b said:
Quote[/b] (Dave the Shrimper @ Jan. 04 2005,10:31)]Would agree with Olvis's comment if players were filtering through but there not.
And that's the problem. Prior, Edwards, Edinburgh and Roget are the total product of the last 15 years. We haven't had anyone coming through and making a real impact since Roget - nearly 10 years ago.

The problem seems to be making the step up from reserves to 1st team. We've had a number of promising ypungsters who looked on the verge of breaking through - Perkins, Fitzpatrick, McSweeney, Cross and Kightly to name but a few but they all eventually fizzled out which was a pity. There seems to lie the problem.

Other lower league clubs seem to bring on more of their youngsters in the first team. Why is it not the case at Southend, with many promising players being lost as a result, which is a shame?
 
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