Football Hooliganism

[southend4ever]

I propose we discuss football hooliganism.

I, as I am sure many of you would have, both read books, scoured the internet and through other methods happen to know a fair bit on the history, the movements, the rise and fall of football hooliganism.

But how do you interpret it and what do you make of it?

To me it is very much a tribal movement. The days of invading the home supporters main stand and making it your own have moved on in the UK. Police employ staff to monitor calls, texts and internet postings and study the history of football hooliganism to gain an insight for future trouble.

Football seems to be the innocent party in all of this. Civil Rights activists are involved in fighting. If you were alone one afternoon would you go and bash a bloke with an opposition's tattoo or shirt on? Far more unlikely. The history shows it is a bunch of game blokes looking for a bit of fun away from the wife and kids on a Saturday afternoon. But why?

Do you welcome it? Do you welcome fighting away from the ground (if they want to risk a few digs and injuries then let them at it)?

Can you understand or even go to explain why it all started and why now many are still associated with it?

I expect violence in South Africa at the World Cup. Pretty standard. But why is it standard for these big events. Because someone was born in another country you want to bash them up?

I noticed a number of fans injured and I think killed a couple of weekends ago in Brazil. Hooliganism is still big in Russia.

Will hooliganism ever come back to the terraces? Or will the OB almost abolish it 100%? Your thoughts on anything hooligan related?

 

[Slipperduke]

There are about a million things more worthy of spilt blood than an over-hyped game played by teenage multi-millionaires who might as well live on the moon for all that they have in common with the people watch them.

 

[Smiffy]

The scene is dead. Has been since the turn of the noughties.

You get the odd scrap here and there, for the big games. Other than that nothing.

Police have cracked down and as a result, it is not as appealing to the youngsters anymore. Throwing a few punches is not worth a 3+ year ban, fine and possible custodial sentence. Unlike the old days when at worst you would get a whack with a truncheon and a night in the clink.

I'm not expecting much trouble in S.A. (The odd bar brawl etc of course) But the days of big tournaments bringing out mobs of 300 a-side, battling in the streets all day and night, just doesn't happen anymore. Oddly enough I think there will be more trouble with the locals. I can see a few murders, muggings, shootings, stabbings etc being brought upon the footie fans through no fault of their own. Let's hope this is not the case.

 

[Yer Blues]

A few words from my journalist brother:

http://sportsbowski.wordpress.com/2009/11/24/90-minutes-with-cass-pennant/

 

[EastStandBlue]

There'll be the odd scuffle in SA, probably involving the likes of Slovakia, Slovenia and Serbia, but it's highly unlikely anything major involving England fans will kick off such is the requirements for travel. If you've been shortlisted, you're not going anywhere as you're on a no-fly permit.

A lot of it will also do with South African attitudes towards the English. They're not exactly hostile towards us, unlike the Portuguese whose police hounded English fans and goaded them into retaliation at Euro 2004. If anything, we'll be welcomed... If you spoke to any European fan at Euro 2008 most commented on the lack of atmosphere and blamed the lack of an English contingent for it.

Domestically, as Smiffy has pointed out, the powers that be did a pretty conclusive job of stopping it in it's tracks with banning orders and custodial sentences handed out.

 

[Pubey]

A few words from my journalist brother:

http://sportsbowski.wordpress.com/2009/11/24/90-minutes-with-cass-pennant/

RIP Bluetonic

 

[Smiffy]

They'll be the odd scuffle in SA, probably involving the likes of Slovakia, Slovenia and Serbia, but it's highly unlikely anything major involving England fans will kick off such is the requirements for travel. If you've been shortlisted, you're not going anywhere as you're on a no-fly permit.

A lot of it will also do with South African attitudes towards the English. They're not exactly hostile towards us, unlike the Portuguese whose police hounded English fans and goaded them into retaliation at Euro 2004. If anything, we'll be welcomed... If you spoke to any European fan at Euro 2008 most commented on the lack of atmosphere and blamed the lack of an English contingent for it.

Domestically, as Smiffy has pointed out, the powers that be did a pretty conclusive job of stopping it in it's tracks with banning orders and custodial sentences handed out.

I was out in Portugal for the '04 tournament. Didn't see much trouble in and around the towns we were playing. The only trouble was in the holiday resorts down south. As you say, the police didn't help. But neither did the UK journalists, offering £1,000 to anyone who would launch a chair through a window etc. It happened believe me and that makes them even more scummy than the taunting gun carrying, kosh wielding police.

 

[EastStandBlue]

I was out in Portugal for the '04 tournament. Didn't see a sniff of trouble in and around the towns we were playing. The only trouble was in the holiday resorts down south. As you say, the police didn't help. But neither did the UK journalists, offering £1,000 to anyone who would launch a chair through a window etc. It happened believe me.

Indeed, and what little coverage they did get can easily be distributed as a scene that's commonly appearing across the Algarve.

What makes it worse is it'll probably be a red-top paper antagonising fans and the drama will be caught by the Daily Mail, who'll publicise it as the occuring armageddon.

 

[Slipperduke]

If you spoke to any European fan at Euro 2008 most commented on the lack of atmosphere and blamed the lack of an English contingent for it.

.

The only Europeans who said that to me in Vienna were the marketing reps at Carlsberg reflecting on the amount of beer that was going to go unsold.

A lot of the fans that I spoke to, particularly the Austrians, were delighted that England weren't in it.

Oddly though, every tout I saw in Vienna was English. Almost all of them were scousers.

 

[TrueBlue]

The scene is dead. Has been since the turn of the noughties.

You get the odd scrap here and there, for the big games. Other than that nothing.

Police have cracked down and as a result, it is not as appealing to the youngsters anymore. Throwing a few punches is not worth a 3+ year ban, fine and possible custodial sentence. Unlike the old days when at worst you would get a whack with a truncheon and a night in the clink.

I'm not expecting much trouble in S.A. (The odd bar brawl etc of course) But the days of big tournaments bringing out mobs of 300 a-side, battling in the streets all day and night, just doesn't happen anymore. Oddly enough I think there will be more trouble with the locals. I can see a few murders, muggings, shootings, stabbings etc being brought upon the footie fans through no fault of their own. Let's hope this is not the case.

It is dead indeed its more about going for a drink now and talking about old times, call me a fool but I do enjoy a drink and listening to some of the events in Southend's history from the older lads with just infamous tales of battling Brighton and Colchester to giving Lincoln a right hiding at Roots Hall years ago.

Stuff still goes on, its much more organised now but nothing on the randomised huge scale it use to.

 

[TrueBlue]

I was out in Portugal for the '04 tournament. Didn't see much trouble in and around the towns we were playing. The only trouble was in the holiday resorts down south. As you say, the police didn't help. But neither did the UK journalists, offering £1,000 to anyone who would launch a chair through a window etc. It happened believe me and that makes them even more scummy than the taunting gun carrying, kosh wielding police.

I remember you telling me about this Portuguese bloke who got a slap that would not stay down

 

[Mad Cyril]

I think everyone realised what a **** Danny Dyer is and decided to pack it in.

 

[EastStandBlue]

The only Europeans who said that to me in Vienna were the marketing reps at Carlsberg reflecting on the amount of beer that was going to go unsold.

Probably because we're the only nation foolish enough to drink the stuff...

 

[Slipperduke]

I think everyone realised what a **** Danny Dyer is and decided to pack it in.

Steady on, Cyril. Young Daniel is pwopper nawty. He'll have your guts for garters.

 

[Slipperduke]

Probably because we're the only nation foolish enough to drink the stuff...

Too right. No wonder the Danes export it.

 

[Smiffy]

I remember you telling me about this Portuguese bloke who got a slap that would not stay down

The knife wielding portuguese bloke yeah.

He was ****ing he-man I kid you not.

Not a good moment in my life. But we lived to tell the tale.

Again, back on topic. This incident was with a nutbag local, who was after money. After we politely told him to **** off. He pulled a blade on a small group of us. Backed into a corner all we could do was smash him. The ******* took 10+ full blown smacks to the face before his super power deserted him. Thank god!

These sort of incidents are what worry me about S.A. It is the worst place on earth for these sorts of crimes. If you are going, have your wits about you and travel in big groups.

 

[TrueBlue]

The knife wielding portuguese bloke yeah.

He was ****ing he-man I kid you not.

Not a good moment in my life. But we lived to tell the tale.

Again, back on topic. This incident was with a nutbag local, who was after money. After we politely told him to **** off. He pulled a blade on a small group of us. Backed into a corner all we could do was smash him. The ******* took 10+ full blown smacks to the face before his super power deserted him. Thank god!

These sort of incidents are what worry me about S.A. It is the worst place on earth for these sorts of crimes. If you are going, have your wits about you and travel in big groups.

Thing with South Africa some England lad will get mouthy and some big black dude is going to pull a shooter - you go Europe you have a row there is an unwritten understanding amongst most lads/firms over here or in Europe that you don't carry weapons like knifes and certainly not guns but somehow going to Africa and shooting your mouth off will not go down well and them guys do not play by the rules!!

 

[chadded]

Thing with South Africa some England lad will get mouthy and some big black dude is going to pull a shooter

I reckon by shooter you mean a gun. Although you'd probably be more accurate if you meant their c*ck.....

 

[TrueBlue]

I reckon by shooter you mean a gun. Although you'd probably be more accurate if you meant their c*ck.....

Either would work getting Aids or being shot?

 

[Thorpe Groyney]

It's only really in some Jo'burg suburbs where there will be that sort of danger. Walk on the wrong pavement, let alone street, and you could find yourself devoid of limbs as well as cash. They don't discriminate, black, white, football hooligans, pride marchers, they just take and if you don't give they make you.

The rest of the country is fine.