Gove sending a copy of KJ Bible to every school

[pickledseal]

Did you use to post on here under another name - the bloke in the pram shop/desert shrimper?

There are plenty of my posts on here that don't fill me with much pride when I look back on them though I don't think I ever said 'anyone who doesn't believe what I believe in is destined for a fiery afterlife in "hell." ' or if I have I take it back as I do not what happens to people who reject God.

I have bored people on here in the past with how I became a Christian but the gist of it was that it was almost the last thing I wanted to do as I was previously a hardline atheist
The message of Christianity, admittedly not always very well conveyed by many of its adherents including myself, is that God, in the form of his Son, died for everyone. He gives people the free will to accept or reject that. If they reject I do not what happens to them other then they spend eternity without God. It's not an easy message but was never intended to be as far as I can see.
I have no problem with people challenging my views though some of the 'challenging' isn't exactly conducive to a constructive debate.
Teaching children there is no God is equally 'indoctrinating' if you don't teach them that lots of people around the world and throughout history have believed there is a God.

A good and brave post.

As most of you know, I'm Catholic and we're a billion+ strong... That doesn't make us right, perfect or without criticism (I ain't stupid!)... but I'm passionate about RE because I feel tolerance and understanding are two things society need right now. Indoctrination is not good, and if you bother to find out what RE is about these days, you'll se it is far from it. Even in our local communities religion isn't dead, and as fascinating as science is (I teach a lot about science/religion), it still doesn't provide the ultimate answers for many.

Ridicule me all you like; Christian, Muslim, Jew, Sikh, Hindu, agnostic or atheist... I respect and appreciate your beliefs.

 

[Ron Manager]

Teach kids that people believe and have believed in various religions by all means. In the same way we teach them that people used to believe that the earth was flat or carried on the back of a turtle or any other half baked theories that have been proven to be untrue. It's good that they see how far we've come in terms of scientific understanding, they will appreciate that more when put into the context of what used to be the accepted wisdoms of the world.

Then teach them about all the war and suffering that's happened in the history of this planet in the name of religion. And the abuse of children that's carried out by ministers of religion, and the acts of terror and murder carried out in the name of certain religions still.

Teach and discuss it all openly and fully. Because kids aren't stupid and we'll have future generations of rational athiests as a result and that will be a good thing.

 

[Berrichonne shrimper]

A very brave post spitty boy and spot on in my dumbarse humble view.
My older kids dont do RE because france is a sectular country but they do learn about it in history which i feel is great because religon is so yesterday.
I was catholic by birthrite(mother was Spanish) and taught at junior school by nuns and at senior school by monks/brothers and found my catholic education to be taught parrot fashion,god did this and jesus died for this blah blah blah,no room for debate or questions answered,thats what happened its the one real truth.
When my kids are old enough i will supply them with a bible to read so they can make up thier own minds on the story of your god because to me all thats all it is a story and not a very good one at that.
signed yours
A BIGOT(a offended zoner)

 

[Smudger]

Did you use to post on here under another name - the bloke in the pram shop/desert shrimper?

There are plenty of my posts on here that don't fill me with much pride when I look back on them though I don't think I ever said 'anyone who doesn't believe what I believe in is destined for a fiery afterlife in "hell." ' or if I have I take it back as I do not what happens to people who reject God.

I have bored people on here in the past with how I became a Christian but the gist of it was that it was almost the last thing I wanted to do as I was previously a hardline atheist
The message of Christianity, admittedly not always very well conveyed by many of its adherents including myself, is that God, in the form of his Son, died for everyone. He gives people the free will to accept or reject that. If they reject I do not what happens to them other then they spend eternity without God. It's not an easy message but was never intended to be as far as I can see.
I have no problem with people challenging my views though some of the 'challenging' isn't exactly conducive to a constructive debate.
Teaching children there is no God is equally 'indoctrinating' if you don't teach them that lots of people around the world and throughout history have believed there is a God.

Hi Teesside, yes, I began posting in the first few weeks of Shrimperzone as Smudger, then the site crashed years later and my login no longer worked so I changed to TBITPS...then I moved to the Middle East and became Desert Shrimper. I think we may have crossed swords on this issue a few times. That said, I like 99.9% your posts and it's not personal at all.

I respect your right to believe whatever you want but I resent people who don't believe what you believe being called bigots and worst of all, I resent psychological blackmail, that being the theory that because we don't buy whichever brand of organised religion you're selling ("great claims require great proofs" as someone you probably don't like once said...) we will automatically suffer eternal damnation and god's wrath. You have said that on this site previously and I would liken that to a religious extremist view.

Remember my view of the world is influenced by the divisions that I see every day (just google the city I live in and the word "sectarian.")

 

[Reg Martin]

Teach kids that people believe and have believed in various religions by all means. In the same way we teach them that people used to believe that the earth was flat or carried on the back of a turtle or any other half baked theories that have been proven to be untrue. It's good that they see how far we've come in terms of scientific understanding, they will appreciate that more when put into the context of what used to be the accepted wisdoms of the world.

Then teach them about all the war and suffering that's happened in the history of this planet in the name of religion. And the abuse of children that's carried out by ministers of religion, and the acts of terror and murder carried out in the name of certain religions still.

Teach and discuss it all openly and fully. Because kids aren't stupid and we'll have future generations of rational athiests as a result and that will be a good thing.

There is no doubt that many evils have been committed in the name of God. The other side of the coin is that many good things have been done in the name of God.
It is also the case that a great many evils have been committed by people who openly reject God - Stalin, Mao, PolPot
In my opinion the idea that people will became more rational and we will all live happily together one day is an irrational one given human nature.

A very brave post spitty boy and spot on in my dumbarse humble view.
My older kids dont do RE because france is a sectular country but they do learn about it in history which i feel is great because religon is so yesterday.
I was catholic by birthrite(mother was Spanish) and taught at junior school by nuns and at senior school by monks/brothers and found my catholic education to be taught parrot fashion,god did this and jesus died for this blah blah blah,no room for debate or questions answered,thats what happened its the one real truth.
When my kids are old enough i will supply them with a bible to read so they can make up thier own minds on the story of your god because to me all thats all it is a story and not a very good one at that.
signed yours
A BIGOT(a offended zoner)

As I mentioned earlier, many of my posts on here don't fill me with pride in hindsight and my 'bigot' comment on this thread falls into that category and I apologise for it.

Hi Teesside, yes, I began posting in the first few weeks of Shrimperzone as Smudger, then the site crashed years later and my login no longer worked so I changed to TBITPS...then I moved to the Middle East and became Desert Shrimper. I think we may have crossed swords on this issue a few times. That said, I like 99.9% your posts and it's not personal at all.

I respect your right to believe whatever you want but I resent people who don't believe what you believe being called bigots and worst of all, I resent psychological blackmail, that being the theory that because we don't buy whichever brand of organised religion you're selling ("great claims require great proofs" as someone you probably don't like once said...) we will automatically suffer eternal damnation and god's wrath. You have said that on this site previously and I would liken that to a religious extremist view.

Remember my view of the world is influenced by the divisions that I see every day (just google the city I live in and the word "sectarian.")

Thought it was you and yes we have crossed swords and I think we got to the point of agreeing to disagree in as amicable way as possible.
The only further I would make point is that I am not trying to sell any form of organised religion. These have a tendency to lose their original objective of telling people about God and start to see continuing the existence of their orgnaisation as their main goal. My own view is that a time comes when each person will have to stand before God and the only thing that will be of any consequence then is the person of Jesus Christ and whether in this life they have chosen to accept or reject him. Whether or not someone has been part of an organised religion will be irrelevant.

 

[osymandus]

I'm with many people on here , in that knowledge is the best answer to these issues . The teaching about the New and old testaments and its social impact is acknowledged even by the arch atheists Richard Darwkin. As are influences on its creation (Zoroastrian , the Persian worship of Mithra , the Athenian/Olympian gods and goddess etc etc ).

Understanding the history and the influences of the religions is necessary but the belief IMHO is not a requisite for respect and understanding.

 

[OldBlueLady]

just out of interest, what do they do in school assembleys these days?

When i was in Junior School (one which OBL knows quite well), although it was not a religious school, quite often the head teacher would read a story from the bible, such as Sampson etc, as well as all the usual tat of giving out certificates to kids that they had brough it etc. Does this not happen anymore? Only asking, as it never done me any harm, and some of the story's were fairly enjoyable

School Assemblies do not even take place every day now! We have one assembly a week which is classed as a "singing" assembly, which is as it suggests; one where a story is read which may or may not be from the Bible or other religious text but frequently is one with a strong moral; one which is subject related so it might be to do with anti-bullying, being safe (a PCSO normally attends) or fundraising, promoting library usage or possibly a class assembly, and the final one of the week which is "Celebration" assembly, in which we celebrate special achievements, birthdays and award the attendance cup for the week. Each of them finishes with a thought (often in the form of a prayer) which the children are invited to bow their heads for.

For those of you wondering about the 5th day (Wednesday), this is classed as "circle time" in each class and may be used to address a particular issue in a class or year group. We also have year group and house assemblies probably once a half term which replace the assembly for whichever day they are scheduled.

Personally, I think it's a real shame that there's not a bit more religion attached to assemblies. I used to love singing the good old hymns in my school assemblies!

 

[Napster]

School Assemblies do not even take place every day now! We have one assembly a week which is classed as a "singing" assembly, which is as it suggests; one where a story is read which may or may not be from the Bible or other religious text but frequently is one with a strong moral; one which is subject related so it might be to do with anti-bullying, being safe (a PCSO normally attends) or fundraising, promoting library usage or possibly a class assembly, and the final one of the week which is "Celebration" assembly, in which we celebrate special achievements, birthdays and award the attendance cup for the week. Each of them finishes with a thought (often in the form of a prayer) which the children are invited to bow their heads for.

For those of you wondering about the 5th day (Wednesday), this is classed as "circle time" in each class and may be used to address a particular issue in a class or year group. We also have year group and house assemblies probably once a half term which replace the assembly for whichever day they are scheduled.

Personally, I think it's a real shame that there's not a bit more religion attached to assemblies. I used to love singing the good old hymns in my school assemblies!

Assemblies every day in my kids' school - along with prayers and readings. Mind you it is a CofE school.

 

[Napster]

A good and brave post.

As most of you know, I'm Catholic and we're a billion+ strong... That doesn't make us right, perfect or without criticism (I ain't stupid!)... but I'm passionate about RE because I feel tolerance and understanding are two things society need right now. Indoctrination is not good, and if you bother to find out what RE is about these days, you'll se it is far from it. Even in our local communities religion isn't dead, and as fascinating as science is (I teach a lot about science/religion), it still doesn't provide the ultimate answers for many.

Ridicule me all you like; Christian, Muslim, Jew, Sikh, Hindu, agnostic or atheist... I respect and appreciate your beliefs.

OK, I'm CofE and you're wrong about the Bishop of Rome.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

As Lenny Bruce said "lots of people are leaving the church and finding God.":winking: