Macedonia v England

[Tangled up in Blue]

Agree it was another lack lustre performance that England deliver on a semi regular basis, however am I right in interpreting your above post that the penalty was justified?

That was one of the worst decisions I have ever seen,

The debutante's arm was over his head in an unatural position.Pen all day long for me.

 

[EastStandBlue]

The debutante's arm was over his head in an unatural position.Pen all day long for me.

What has “unnatural position” got to do with it? The penalty wasn’t given for handball.

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

Our lack of depth is slightly worrying. Without players like Kane and Bellingham in the starting XI we look pretty average at the moment.

Yep. A real lack of depth up front (Watkins isn’t it), central midfield to replace Henderson and probably Phillips and left-back whilst the jury is out at centre-back on Guehi, Tomori, Dunk etc.

C4 had a Rooney documentary and the depth available in 2004 (Beckham, Scholes, Hargreaves, Lampard in midfield; Campbell, Ledley King, Terry, Ferdinand (albeit he was banned) in central defence) was quite striking. But then we still had Vassell and Gerrard so it wasn’t all great.

Maybe there are more options out there from those of you who watch the EPL?

On the positive side I felt Foden stood out in a good way. He’s growing as an international player.

 

[Tribal Chief]

The debutante's arm was over his head in an unatural position.Pen all day long for me.

 

[Massimo Giovanni]

The officials were poor, most of Macc players a tad nasty and fired up, BUT just about the whole starting England were underwhelming and, to put it bluntly, PANTS.

Without Kane, Fodan, Bellingham and Rice we seem bang average.

 

[Tribal Chief]

The officials were poor, most of Macc players a tad nasty and fired up, BUT just about the whole starting England were underwhelming and, to put it bluntly, PANTS.

Without Kane, Fodan, Bellingham and Rice we seem bang average.

I would add Saka and Walker to that list as well. And more that aren't far off. We have four players who could walk into any team in the world - that's a good thing.

 

[Massimo Giovanni]

I would add Saka and Walker to that list as well. And more that aren't far off. We have four players who could walk into any team in the world - that's a good thing.

Agreed, Stones, Grealish, Palmer could make most top sides but we seem light on centre backs and balance or depth of squad..

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

I would add Saka and Walker to that list as well. And more that aren't far off. We have four players who could walk into any team in the world - that's a good thing.

Was thinking last night how unappreciated Walker is. He’s got to be England’s best right sided defender of my lifetime, if not ever.

Him and Ashley Cole would have to be the two easiest selections for my all-time England XI. They are just miles ahead of the competition.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

What has “unnatural position” got to do with it? The penalty wasn’t given for handball.

If the guy's arm is over his head and he handles the ball then his arm is in an "unnatural position" IMO.No idea why the pen .was given all I saw was the ref.go to VAr to check.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Was thinking last night how unappreciated Walker is. He’s got to be England’s best right sided defender of my lifetime, if not ever.

Him and Ashley Cole would have to be the two easiest selections for my all-time England XI. They are just miles ahead of the competition.

George Cohen was a better LB than AC any day.

 

[Napster]

Was thinking last night how unappreciated Walker is. He’s got to be England’s best right sided defender of my lifetime, if not ever.

Him and Ashley Cole would have to be the two easiest selections for my all-time England XI. They are just miles ahead of the competition.

I’d have Pearce above Cole just for the passion

 

[Holy Joe]

If the guy's arm is over his head and he handles the ball then his arm is in an "unnatural position" IMO.No idea why the pen .was given all I saw was the ref.go to VAr to check.

He didn't handle the ball. The forward ran into his arm and went down.

 

[EastStandBlue]

If the guy's arm is over his head and he handles the ball then his arm is in an "unnatural position" IMO.No idea why the pen .was given all I saw was the ref.go to VAr to check.

So what would you have given the decision for, considering it’s a “pen all day long”?

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

So what would you have given the decision for, considering it’s a “pen all day long”?

IT looked as though he handled the ball while airborne.That's presumably wht the ref saw too on VAR.

Anyway I'm rather reminded of an amusing (and I think) relevant story from the 60's.The (late,great ) Johhny Haynes was playing in a Fulham match when Jack Taylor the ref.had just given a pen.

Johhny said to JT "That was never a pen.ref." To which Taylor replied (presumably smilingly)."Buy a Sunday paper tomorrow and you'll see it was a pen. all right,Johhny." Time to move on I think.

 

[ozzie]

We beat Italy at home which was good.Ok Italy are not the team they were,but the Ukraine(A),Malta(H) and now North Mac(A) were "iffy".
But we are always being told that the England squad are one of the best in Europe/world
I not sure thats right,but does anybody think so?
A good Euro cup draw will help,but i think we no chance of winning it sadly.
Just watched Englands (U 17) get knocked out of the world cup by Uzbekistan...so my "mood" is not getting better...off for a walk

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

IT looked as though he handled the ball while airborne.That's presumably wht the ref saw too on VAR.

Anyway I'm rather reminded of an amusing (and I think) relevant story from the 60's.The (late,great ) Johhny Haynes was playing in a Fulham match when Jack Taylor the ref.had just given a pen.

Johhny said to JT "That was never a pen.ref." To which Taylor replied (presumably smilingly)."Buy a Sunday paper tomorrow and you'll see it was a pen. all right,Johhny." Time to move on I think.

VAR is all about endlessly going over mistakes.

 

[londonblue]

VAR is all about endlessly going over mistakes.

And that was one hell of a mistake. There's no offence there at all, and having read the laws of the game recently I can't even work out what it was supposed to have breached. The only thing that even comes seems to be this:

"A direct free kick is awarded if a player commits any of the following offences against an opponent in a manner considered by the referee to be careless, reckless or using excessive force:"

• strikes or attempts to strike (including head-butt)

The issue is that he simply doesn't. He jumps and the player runs into him. Even if you don't agree with that, there's still nothing there that is "careless, reckless or using excessive force".

 

[Holy Joe]

And that was one hell of a mistake. There's no offence that at all, and having read the laws of the game recently I can't even work out what it was supposed to have breached. The only thing that even comes seems to be this:

"A direct free kick is awarded if a player commits any of the following offences against an opponent in a manner considered by the referee to be careless, reckless or using excessive force:"

• strikes or attempts to strike (including head-butt)

The issue is that he simply doesn't. He jumps and the player runs into him. Even if you don't agree with that, there's still nothing there that is "careless, reckless or using excessive force".

And for VAR to be involved it needs to be a clear and obvious error. The consensus on here would suggest it wasn't.

 

[GNH]

And that was one hell of a mistake. There's no offence that at all, and having read the laws of the game recently I can't even work out what it was supposed to have breached. The only thing that even comes seems to be this:

"A direct free kick is awarded if a player commits any of the following offences against an opponent in a manner considered by the referee to be careless, reckless or using excessive force:"

• strikes or attempts to strike (including head-butt)

The issue is that he simply doesn't. He jumps and the player runs into him. Even if you don't agree with that, there's still nothing there that is "careless, reckless or using excessive force".

What would be very interesting here is to hear the communication between the match officials and the VAR team. I'm almost certain there was confusion about what they were looking at. If they were clear that is what they have penalised him for then they should suffer the consequence of an appalling level of officiating.

Don't hold out any hope of this being looked into properly by the authorities and the audio being made available

 

[londonblue]

And for VAR to be involved it needs to be a clear and obvious error. The consensus on here would suggest it wasn't.

One day a ref. will have the balls to look at the screen and tell the VAR that he's talking crap, and ignore him.