• Welcome to the ShrimperZone forums.
    You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which only gives you limited access.

    Existing Users:.
    Please log-in using your existing username and password. If you have any problems, please see below.

    New Users:
    Join our free community now and gain access to post topics, communicate privately with other members, respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and free. Click here to join.

    Fans from other clubs
    We welcome and appreciate supporters from other clubs who wish to engage in sensible discussion. Please feel free to join as above but understand that this is a moderated site and those who cannot play nicely will be quickly removed.

    Assistance Required
    For help with the registration process or accessing your account, please send a note using the Contact us link in the footer, please include your account name. We can then provide you with a new password and verification to get you on the site.

That's your choice, I happen to think it's a wrong one. You support a team, regardless of results, though obviously winning helps.


I don't expect super football
I don't expect every game we win 4 3
I don't expect thrilling 3 3 draws


I do expect a certain standard
I do expect my team to have an attacking threat

Sadly under Phil its boringggggggggggggggggg dull and tedious and it's getting too cold to watch that style of football.
 
What is more worrying on paper a strong bench, but in reality only one player who could offer something different, Far too many central midfield players and the best of the rest Clifford didn't make the bench. What has he done wrong ?
 
Bringing a winger on to play upfront as the only striker for the last 10 mins when 0 0 at home is incredibly negative and embarrassing

I thought a change was necessary in the last 20 mins last night...we were just banging our heads against a brick wall...so we West Yellows...were of the opinion that Weston would replace Hurst and O'Toole on for BBBC?
 
The problem is our defence is under so much pressure not to concede, because of our total lack of scoring esp at home, how can we go into the second half of the season, with trying to improve on 11 goals in the first half.
 
The goals need to come from all areas. Neither Pross nor Bolger look like scoring from a set piece in a million years. Hurst has gone dry too and Leonard timlin Atkinson are worth only a handful a season. Even if we unearth a good striker in January I'm not sure that will be enough. Ending the game last night with basically 6 midfielders you wonder if PB knows what is required in this division.
 
We play good football, much better than what we played under PS. The difference is under PS we scored goals, we dont under PB. Could all change with one loan signing, so will be interesting to see what happens.
 
The goals need to come from all areas. Neither Pross nor Bolger look like scoring from a set piece in a million years. Hurst has gone dry too and Leonard timlin Atkinson are worth only a handful a season. Even if we unearth a good striker in January I'm not sure that will be enough. Ending the game last night with basically 6 midfielders you wonder if PB knows what is required in this division.
Well if you have 6 midfielders bagging 6 or 7 goals each then a twenty goal forward is not needed, but our midfield are not doing that at the moment, there to busy making sure we don't concede.
 
The proof of PB's odd thinking has been seen this season. he constantly claimed we played with three forwards when it was clearly 4-5-1. The midfielders he claimed were forwards have shown why they are midfielders and not forward and scored far too few goals.
Corr has been the only recognised player on the pitch of late and he is out of form/ability. He has had some open play chances but failed to capitalise. Too few chances I concede but chances all the same. Corr is praised for coming back and helping out but all that does is allow the opposition to move up and press higher and we end up defending deep. If a player stays upfield, defender/s have to stay back.
PB has left us bereft of attacking options and is the only person, not the players, that deserves to receive the blame.
 
The proof of PB's odd thinking has been seen this season. he constantly claimed we played with three forwards when it was clearly 4-5-1. The midfielders he claimed were forwards have shown why they are midfielders and not forward and scored far too few goals.
Corr has been the only recognised player on the pitch of late and he is out of form/ability. He has had some open play chances but failed to capitalise. Too few chances I concede but chances all the same. Corr is praised for coming back and helping out but all that does is allow the opposition to move up and press higher and we end up defending deep. If a player stays upfield, defender/s have to stay back.
PB has left us bereft of attacking options and is the only person, not the players, that deserves to receive the blame.

He didnt claim it, he did it. The players he selected dont agree with your statement.

Are you saying Coulthirst and Weston are defensive players?

There is little logic to these claims he is defensive and they are being made solely on the fact we dont score enough .

Whether the players he selects are any good is a different thing, but if he was as defensive minded as some people claimed he would play the likes of Atkinson in those positions.

Bottom line is we are poor in the final third, but Im not seeing anyone give decent examples of how thats a tactical decision that we are defensive.

Well if you have 6 midfielders bagging 6 or 7 goals each then a twenty goal forward is not needed, but our midfield are not doing that at the moment, there to busy making sure we don't concede.

Last night we had Hurst/Worrall/Payne in the side and left out our most defensive player Deegan. Yet people will choose the path of least resistance and say our lack of goals is because thats what we plan to do.

Are Hurst, Worral and Payne really trying not to concede more than they are trying to score? Doubtful.
 
Well if you have 6 midfielders bagging 6 or 7 goals each then a twenty goal forward is not needed, but our midfield are not doing that at the moment, there to busy making sure we don't concede.

Spot on. We're missing the goals of Hurst from midfield terribly this season and no-one else has regularly stepped up to the plate. All very well blaming the forwards but Corr is never going to get many at all in this team.

P.S. We are missing a pacey striker, there's no doubt about that. We have one on the bench but.... :whistling:
 
Spot on. We're missing the goals of Hurst from midfield terribly this season and no-one else has regularly stepped up to the plate. All very well blaming the forwards but Corr is never going to get many at all in this team.

P.S. We are missing a pacey striker, there's no doubt about that. We have one on the bench but.... :whistling:

We are also missing any defenders scoring as well....

To be fair they should be trying to stop us concede :smile:
 
He didnt claim it, he did it. The players he selected dont agree with your statement.

Are you saying Coulthirst and Weston are defensive players?

There is little logic to these claims he is defensive and they are being made solely on the fact we dont score enough .

Whether the players he selects are any good is a different thing, but if he was as defensive minded as some people claimed he would play the likes of Atkinson in those positions.

Bottom line is we are poor in the final third, but Im not seeing anyone give decent examples of how thats a tactical decision.

No Jamman its you that constantly goes on about defensive. I have never said or suggested we are. We do have some very good build up play but it stops dead in the final third. Of course Coulthirst and Weston are not defensive players but Coulthirst will probably do better as a wide mid/wing and Weston is definitely not a striker.

Actually there is one defensive element of our game in that we do much more in getting back to aid the defence than we do going forward to support the attack.

We have a good midfield that can play the ball about well on their day but they will always look for four passes where two will do. Its rarely incisive.

We may well need a new striker but along with that we need to tweak the playing philosophy.
 
The only reason I mention it is because people on here always do, the thread was started on that basis and we have posts saying how negative he is:smile:

Even you suggested his comments of 433 were wrong were not backed up by the attacking players he selected.

That one thing aside totally agree with what you say, as you say its that final third that we seem to lack quality, Ive said that all season.

Most games (not last night) we have been creating plenty of chances without scoring goals, thats not a sign of us being defensive, but just poor at the business end of the pitch.

Totally agree with your last sentence, a new striker may add a spark and may even give Payne different options, but our problems are a little deeper than that.
 
Last edited:
I wouldn't say we're defensive or negative, I'd say we're too cautious, but playing 4-5-1, especially at home, adds a negative element to us. Under that umbrella term of "cautious" comes the fact that, as much as I want to see us play nice short passes, the way in which we do so is laboured, simple, easy to defend against and lacks any sense of urgency, tempo or penetration. Everything is sideways, backwards and slow. The movement off the ball is collectively so poor and unintelligent that there is little opportunity for us to keep moving forwards whilst playing the short game or to penetrate/get in behind the defence - invariably someone gets fed up of passing it sideways and backwards and so lumps it up the pitch so that it comes straight back and puts us under unnecessary pressure. There aren't one or two individuals playing like this, it is all 11 men out on the pitch and it should be plain for anyone to see that this is how they are being told to play. It's not difficult for any manager or coach to tell his players in the dressing room to be quick out of the blocks and to play up-tempo, urgent football so my guess is that this isn't how Brown wants them playing unfortunately.

We lack a decent forward to give us options in the final third but our options elsewhere in "creative" positions generally are ok - in Payne, Worrall and Hurst we have plenty of creative power. What we lack is the right mentality. As I said, by that I don't think we are defensive, but we are too cautious. If PB wants to play the short passing game then it needs to be played with some energy, some zip, some tempo and with players who are willing to work hard in running off the ball into space so that we can actually move forward with it. And as an extension of that, we want to be going for a 2nd and a 3rd goal after we have gone 1-0 up.....be ruthless and relentless, don't tlet the opposition settle into a rhythm. Our style of play should be unsettling the opposition and stretching them, making us a nightmare to play against, that's how chances to score goals come. But the mentality at the moment is doing the opposite - all we are doing is passing it sideways and backwards with zero off-the-ball movement so that our players are easy to mark and to track. It's so frustrating watching Leonard, Timlin, Payne, Atkinson and countless others break forward with the ball and then have to dwell on it with his arms outstretched in dismay because no-one in front of him is giving him an intelligent option. So all we're doing is retaining possession by going sideways or backwards, teams aren't breaking a sweat against us and we are too easily sussed out.

There is something fundamentally wrong with the tactics/mentality and quite possibly with what is being done on the training pitch too.
 
Last edited:
I wouldn't say we're defensive or negative, I'd say we're too cautious, but playing 4-5-1, especially at home, adds a negative element to us. Under that umbrella term of "cautious" comes the fact that, as much as I want to see us play nice short passes, the way in which we do so is laboured, simple, easy to defend against and lacks any sense of urgency, tempo or penetration. Everything is sideways, backwards and slow. The movement off the ball is collectively so poor and unintelligent that there is little opportunity for us to keep moving forwards whilst playing the short game or to penetrate/get in behind the defence - invariably someone gets fed up of passing it sideways and backwards and so lumps it up the pitch so that it comes straight back and puts us under unnecessary pressure. There aren't one or two individuals playing like this, it is all 11 men out on the pitch and it should be plain for anyone to see that this is how they are being told to play. It's not difficult for any manager or coach to tell his players in the dressing room to be quick out of the blocks and to play up-tempo, urgent football so my guess is that this isn't how Brown wants them playing unfortunately.

We lack a decent forward to give us options in the final third but our options elsewhere in "creative" positions generally are ok - in Payne, Worrall and Hurst we have plenty of creative power. What we lack is the right mentality. As I said, by that I don't think we are defensive, but we are too cautious. If PB wants to play the short passing game then it needs to be played with some energy, some zip, some tempo and with players who are willing to work hard in running off the ball into space so that we can actually move forward with it. And as an extension of that, we want to be going for a 2nd and a 3rd goal after we have gone 1-0 up.....be ruthless and relentless, don't tlet the opposition settle into a rhythm. Our style of play should be unsettling the opposition and stretching them, making us a nightmare to play against, that's how chances to score goals come. But the mentality at the moment is doing the opposite - all we are doing is passing it sideways and backwards with zero off-the-ball movement so that our players are easy to mark and to track. It's so frustrating watching Leonard, Timlin, Payne, Atkinson and countless others break forward with the ball and then have to dwell on it with his arms outstretched in dismay because no-one in front of him is giving him an intelligent option. So all we're doing is retaining possession by going sideways or backwards, teams aren't breaking a sweat against us and we are too easily sussed out.

Really well put! :clap:
 
Yes PB what has happened between yourself and Clifford ,that you deem him not good enough to make the bench,is he like many on here ,dosent agree with your tactics ans substitutions etc.Personally i hope PB goes and Clifford stays .
 
I wouldn't say we're defensive or negative, I'd say we're too cautious, but playing 4-5-1, especially at home, adds a negative element to us. Under that umbrella term of "cautious" comes the fact that, as much as I want to see us play nice short passes, the way in which we do so is laboured, simple, easy to defend against and lacks any sense of urgency, tempo or penetration. Everything is sideways, backwards and slow. The movement off the ball is collectively so poor and unintelligent that there is little opportunity for us to keep moving forwards whilst playing the short game or to penetrate/get in behind the defence - invariably someone gets fed up of passing it sideways and backwards and so lumps it up the pitch so that it comes straight back and puts us under unnecessary pressure. There aren't one or two individuals playing like this, it is all 11 men out on the pitch and it should be plain for anyone to see that this is how they are being told to play. It's not difficult for any manager or coach to tell his players in the dressing room to be quick out of the blocks and to play up-tempo, urgent football so my guess is that this isn't how Brown wants them playing unfortunately.

We lack a decent forward to give us options in the final third but our options elsewhere in "creative" positions generally are ok - in Payne, Worrall and Hurst we have plenty of creative power. What we lack is the right mentality. As I said, by that I don't think we are defensive, but we are too cautious. If PB wants to play the short passing game then it needs to be played with some energy, some zip, some tempo and with players who are willing to work hard in running off the ball into space so that we can actually move forward with it. And as an extension of that, we want to be going for a 2nd and a 3rd goal after we have gone 1-0 up.....be ruthless and relentless, don't tlet the opposition settle into a rhythm. Our style of play should be unsettling the opposition and stretching them, making us a nightmare to play against, that's how chances to score goals come. But the mentality at the moment is doing the opposite - all we are doing is passing it sideways and backwards with zero off-the-ball movement so that our players are easy to mark and to track. It's so frustrating watching Leonard, Timlin, Payne, Atkinson and countless others break forward with the ball and then have to dwell on it with his arms outstretched in dismay because no-one in front of him is giving him an intelligent option. So all we're doing is retaining possession by going sideways or backwards, teams aren't breaking a sweat against us and we are too easily sussed out.

There is something fundamentally wrong with the tactics/mentality and quite possibly with what is being done on the training pitch too.



Agreed.

Every good team will ping it about with pace yet we are just so slow it is criminal to watch.I don't understand what the management are trying to achieve and I doubt if the players actually know either.
 
How anyone can say Brown is not negative is beyond me.

I never recall him playing two forwards at the same time. Look at the balance of the side, one maybe two recognised strikers yet four holding midfielders. I don't recall Brown signing a decent forward in his three years here and were the lowest scorers in the top sixteen.

Brown sets every side out not to get beat. It's functional and as we're 5th you can't moan but he is a very negative manager in my opinion.
 
MOTD this morning the pundits discussed why QPR are strong at home yet terrible away,the answer was at home they play 442 whilst away it's 451 with Shearer also saying they have little pace,their remedy was Rangers should go for it away simply because the current 451 does not work.
 
How anyone can say Brown is not negative is beyond me. I never recall him playing two forwards at the same time.

Try the 1-1 home draw with Bury towards the end of October. He started with Corr & Barnard. We were awful. Worse than 4-5-1 in my opinion.
 
Back
Top