Hereford decisions

[southchurch]

Have had a good look at the game on the i player and wonder about a couple of decisions.


1- Did the ball definitely cross the line ?

2-Should Belford have been sent off or yellow carded for the penalty incident ?(he was yellow carded later)

3-Was there a good pass on before Hall shot for goal , he scored this time but has been greedy in the past ?

4- Does PS panic when we are leading and did he make the correct sub ? Hills for Hall in the 83rd when it was 3-1

If your answer to any of these is, 'The ref made the decision , so thats it' . Please don't bother.

 

[blue79]

The game is over with . Can't change anything. Be grateful we got maximum points. Apologies if this post comes under your " don't bother" slogan. Not that I'm knocking this thread.

 

[Earls Hall Blue]

Have had a good look at the game on the i player and wonder about a couple of decisions.


1- Did the ball definitely cross the line ?

2-Should Belford have been sent off or yellow carded for the penalty incident ?(he was yellow carded later)

3-Was there a good pass on before Hall shot for goal , he scored this time but has been greedy in the past ?

4- Does PS panic when we are leading and did he make the correct sub ? Hills for Hall in the 83rd when it was 3-1

If your answer to any of these is, 'The ref made the decision , so thats it' . Please don't bother.

Cant really tell from iPlayer if the ball was over or not tbh. If Im honest that was never a penalty, Belford looks to have got his hands to it. I dont understand the ref there, last player so if a pen he should have walked. There was a pass on but im glad Hall chose to shoot, will do his confidence the world of good to see that go in. I dont know about panic but PS does make some odd substitutions, but even tho we won I thought it was an odd team selection from the off.

 

[shrimpled]

1) Hard to tell from the anlge of Camera, but the Hereford fans report suggested it certainly had and the linesman was right up with play and in a great position to see. But who cares, it's a goal.

2) No. He got the ball. It shouldn't have been a penalty in my opinion.

3) I hope there was, it would say a lot if his only option was to shoot. Hall chose correctly this time thats for sure though.

4) Does Sturrock panic? No. Was it a sub I would have made? No.

 

[Sleaford Shrimper]

Looking at photos 3 and 4 on the OS gallery photos of the Harris goal, the Hereford defender's left foot looks to be directly above the goal line with his right leg outstretched into the goal to hook the ball away, so the whole of the ball must have crossed the line unless he has a remarkably short right leg!

 

[McNasty]

Looking at photos 3 and 4 on the OS gallery photos of the Harris goal, the Hereford defender's left foot looks to be directly above the goal line with his right leg outstretched into the goal to hook the ball away, so the whole of the ball must have crossed the line unless he has a remarkably short middle leg!

Edited for accuracy.

 

[Jam_Man]

Why are we questioning whether a player who scored should have passed !?

 

[fbm]

Have had a good look at the game on the i player and wonder about a couple of decisions.


1- Did the ball definitely cross the line ?

2-Should Belford have been sent off or yellow carded for the penalty incident ?(he was yellow carded later)

3-Was there a good pass on before Hall shot for goal , he scored this time but has been greedy in the past ?

4- Does PS panic when we are leading and did he make the correct sub ? Hills for Hall in the 83rd when it was 3-1

If your answer to any of these is, 'The ref made the decision , so thats it' . Please don't bother.

I can't help wondering why on earth you have had such a good look at the match and come up with this lot, most of which I might have expected to see on a Hereford forum, not on here.

1 - The camera angle doesn't and cannot help anyone see whether it was over the line but the lino, who was best placed, plus Hereford fans presumably in the same area, have said that it did. The goal was given. No-one moaned much. Is that not enough? If it ever transpired (which it won't) that somehow the ball didn't cross the line, what on earth can we do about it now? Also, what response were you hoping to get from your question? A load of "yes" responses just confirm the situation as is and "No" is pretty pointless really, isn't it? We can't learn from or affect anything to do with the goal and if we got lucky, then it's about time.

2 - Personally I think the penalty award was enough punishment but again, why the question? Thank God he wasn't. But if he had been yellow carded then I doubt he would have time wasted later on. If he had got a straight red he wouldn't have been on the pitch to time waste. I'm sure Sturrock doesn't need any of us to point out the risks of not having a sub keeper on the bench. The pure facts are that sub keepers are rarely needed (maybe once or twice a season at most and often never) whereas having different outfield options is much more useful. We could win or protect points through a season much more often with an outfield sub than with a keeper. To illustrate the point, Bentley has come on for Morris once this season in a game we were winning 4-0 and ended up winning 4-1. When was the last time a sub keeper was needed for Blues? I can't recall many... maybe Bramble for Flahavan against Boston years ago when we were winning 2-0 and won 2-1? The keeper subs didn't make any difference to the result in those games and therefore the sub keeper has been almost wasted for years. Sturrock plays percentages and it's a simple as that.

3 - There is usually a good pass on wherever you are but a confident player will shoot. He scored. He won't always. No striker scores with every shot. We can't use hindsight to select when a player should shoot and when he should pass. If he passes there's no guarantee the player he passes to is going to even control the ball, let alone do anything with it. It went in and put us 3-1 up.

4 - No, he doesn't panic. As I said, he plays percentages. Some he wins, some he loses. It's that simple.


We won 3-2, have gone third and every single question of yours is designed to somehow try and undermine that achievement and pretend it didn't happen. It sounds as though you feel as though Harris's goal shouldn't have counted, Belford should have walked and Hall should have passed. Would you have been happier if we had lost 2-1 then?

 

[RobM]

I must admit, seeing it on i-player a pass left looked a more viable option!
What do I know?

 

[RobM]

Tilson went in goal v. Middlesborough after Sansomme was sent off.
Peter Taylor went in goal v. Cambridge when the keeper (Cawston?) was imjured.

 

[Mick]

1 - The camera angle doesn't and cannot help anyone see whether it was over the line but the lino, who was best placed, plus Hereford fans presumably in the same area, have said that it did. The goal was given. No-one moaned much.

Agreed, it is impossible to be sure from that angle although it looked from players' positions and body language to be as likely to be in as not. Not only is the lino well placed but he is clearly paying attention and leaning slightly to his right to get a better view round the two players in front of him. I suspect it was a good call.

2 - Personally I think the penalty award was enough punishment but again, why the question? Thank God he wasn't. But if he had been yellow carded then I doubt he would have time wasted later on. If he had got a straight red he wouldn't have been on the pitch to time waste. I'm sure Sturrock doesn't need any of us to point out the risks of not having a sub keeper on the bench. The pure facts are that sub keepers are rarely needed (maybe once or twice a season at most and often never) whereas having different outfield options is much more useful. We could win or protect points through a season much more often with an outfield sub than with a keeper. To illustrate the point, Bentley has come on for Morris once this season in a game we were winning 4-0 and ended up winning 4-1. When was the last time a sub keeper was needed for Blues? I can't recall many... maybe Bramble for Flahavan against Boston years ago when we were winning 2-0 and won 2-1? The keeper subs didn't make any difference to the result in those games and therefore the sub keeper has been almost wasted for years. Sturrock plays percentages and it's a simple as that.

Two points here. A harsh and far from clear cut penalty. A decent referee who has made a harsh call is going to be looking for reasons not to compound it with a red card; in this case the forward's touch is taking the ball sideways and not towards goal. No reason for a yellow - it's nothing or red for me. It is poor refereeing to show a "compromise" yellow.

Regarding no sub keeper, I think it is very foolish. There are at least a couple of dozen referees who would have walked Belford on Saturday and that would in all probability have cost us three points. Past statistics are irrelevant. I'd guess your house hasn't burnt down over the last few years, but you don't cancel your insurance. A risk not worth taking, just to give a forward who hasn't scored a League goal for months a place on the bench.

3 - There is usually a good pass on wherever you are but a confident player will shoot. He scored. He won't always. No striker scores with every shot. We can't use hindsight to select when a player should shoot and when he should pass. If he passes there's no guarantee the player he passes to is going to even control the ball, let alone do anything with it. It went in and put us 3-1 up.

You can get away with greedy when you score ! I'd rather have a player who thinks he's going to score (provided he does every now and again) than one who hasn't a clue where the goal is.

4 - No, he doesn't panic. As I said, he plays percentages. Some he wins, some he loses. It's that simple.

I too don't think he panics. I do think however that, like Tilson before him, substitutions are not his strongest suit and a number of his decisions are perverse.

 

[canveyshrimper]

Tilson went in goal v. Middlesborough after Sansomme was sent off.
Peter Taylor went in goal v. Cambridge when the keeper (Cawston?) was imjured.

Derek Bellotti and it was Gillingham 1971/72. :smile:

Keith Mercer went in goal when John Keeley obligingly got sent off, and filled the goal a lot more than Keeley did.

 

[southchurch]

The game is over with . Can't change anything. Be grateful we got maximum points. Apologies if this post comes under your " don't bother" slogan. Not that I'm knocking this thread.

Sorry but this does come under the don't bother category.

'Why are we questioning whether a player who scored should have passed !?'

I know what your saying. I am just interested in general terms if Hall gets his head up and looks whats around him. He shot and sort of scuffed it but went right in the corner , so all is good. I only have i player hi lights. So can't pick out other instances where he should have passed.

'I can't help wondering why on earth you have had such a good look at the match and come up with this lot, most of which I might have expected to see on a Hereford forum, not on here.'

We have won the game , so any thing said will not change that. So why not discuss the game in an honest way. I am GLAD the keeper was not sent off. I am GLAD the ball was adjudged to have cross the line. I am GLAD Hall scored. Does not mean that we can't talk about it surley.


'We won 3-2, have gone third and every single question of yours is designed to somehow try and undermine that achievement and pretend it didn't happen. It sounds as though you feel as though Harris's goal shouldn't have counted, Belford should have walked and Hall should have passed. Would you have been happier if we had lost 2-1 then? '

If we had lost 2-1 I would have been gutted, same as you . This is a forum to discuss events on and off the field. Why cant you allow discussion without making ridiculous allegations.

 

[dannypav]

To posts 2 , 7 and 8 : The guy starting this thread is just raising some points for debate , which is the whole point a forum.
Your total negative reactions are completely unnecessary.
If you don't want to contribute to the guys thread , don't !
It's easy , try it sometimes instead of just boosting your posts for no apparent reason

 

[dannypav]

sorry but this does come under the don't bother category.

'why are we questioning whether a player who scored should have passed !?'

i know what your saying. I am just interested in general terms if hall gets his head up and looks whats around him. He shot and sort of scuffed it but went right in the corner , so all is good. I only have i player hi lights. So can't pick out other instances where he should have passed.

'i can't help wondering why on earth you have had such a good look at the match and come up with this lot, most of which i might have expected to see on a hereford forum, not on here.'

we have won the game , so any thing said will not change that. So why not discuss the game in an honest way. I am glad the keeper was not sent off. I am glad the ball was adjudged to have cross the line. I am glad hall scored. Does not mean that we can't talk about it surley.


'we won 3-2, have gone third and every single question of yours is designed to somehow try and undermine that achievement and pretend it didn't happen. It sounds as though you feel as though harris's goal shouldn't have counted, belford should have walked and hall should have passed. Would you have been happier if we had lost 2-1 then? '

if we had lost 2-1 i would have been gutted, same as you . This is a forum to discuss events on and off the field. Why cant you allow discussion without making ridiculous allegations.

well said sir

 

[Gremlin]

I am just interested in general terms if Hall gets his head up and looks whats around him.

Doesn't Hall have one of the best record for assists in the division?

 

[southchurch]

Derek Bellotti and it was Gillingham 1971/72. :smile:

Keith Mercer went in goal when John Keeley obligingly got sent off, and filled the goal a lot more than Keeley did.

I was at the game when Tilson went in goal but it was so long ago that I can't remember the game. However what I will never forget is Tilson was drop kicking his clearances and they were flying amazingly high but with not much distance. The north bank were all chanting- 'Tilly kicks it high. Tilly! Tilly! kicks it high' It was really funny but I think he kept a clean sheet.

 

[Mick]

Derek Bellotti and it was Gillingham 1971/72. :smile:

Keith Mercer went in goal when John Keeley obligingly got sent off, and filled the goal a lot more than Keeley did.

At Peterborough, when Lawrie Leslie broke something for the umpteenth time, I think it was Tony Bentley who went in goal ?

 

[OldBlueLady]

Didn't Collis come on for Mildy in one game? My memory for facts like this is awful but I'm sure someone will remember!

 

[southchurch]

Doesn't Hall have one of the best record for assists in the division?

Yes. It seems Hall does look up. Or scores.

http://www.football-league.co.uk/latestnews/20110401/stat-attack-assists_2293301_2328463