reinforcements needed

[bas blue]

getting through to the two legger with brizzle rovers was great, but i think it really is time to bring in one or two loanees to boost a wafer thin squad. with so many important matches coming so quickly it could all go pear shaped in a very short space of time eg orient !

 

[rabbloke]

My pet subject. New faces this season or same old division next season. How does that equate with the financial arguments?.

 

[Thenewblue]

Who do you get in though? Got to be as good or better than we have, who'd let them go at this stage of the season? Anyway we got Drewe back!

 

[Southend Shrimp]

Quote[/b] (bas blue @ Jan. 26 2005,21:47)]it could all go pear shaped in a very short space of time eg orient !

The thing with Orient is that Martin Ling doesn't seem to be able to motivate his players.
When you read their reports it's always "The dressing rooms down at the moment"

We have talent right through the squad. Christmas time, loanees may have been required, but now players are coming back ie Jupp, Kightly, Gower (When he shakes off his illness).
If we bring people in now, it might unsettle the squad.

If it aint broke.....don't fix it.

 

[Shrimp in a Kilt]

Quote[/b] (Southend Shrimp @ Jan. 26 2005,23:24)]If we bring people in now, it might unsettle the squad.

If it aint broke.....don't fix it.

Yeah, but if you break down it's nice to have a decent selection of spare parts to hand.

I think Tilly has the right idea, sounding out Prem or Champ clubs and trying to bring in players of quality who aren't getting first team footie just now. Wouldn't hurt, and I don't think it would upset the squad, in fact it would show them that we are serious about going up.

 

[bas blue]

i agree, orient lost alexander and steele at the same time. who were doing the buisness for the club. ask any orient fan and they will tell you this is where their troubles began. up front were ok, defence not too bad. but its the midfield imho that will decide how we finish the season

 

[Guest]

The important factor is that prem clubs aren't going to let their prized gems out on loan to sit on the bench or play reserve games for a league 2 side. They usually only come on the proviso they are going to be guarranteed first team football. I certainly wouldn't want to demotivate any of our current squad by dropping them in favour of a 20 year old loanee who is here for a month. I think Tilson is spot on. We've only used about 19 players all season which is remarkable and I think it is no coincidence that we have done well with this policy. On the other hand, I'm sure Tilson and Brush have earmarked players that they would want if we need to bring someone in. Until then, or we have a huge slump in form, I think we need to keep the ship steady.

 

[sufcintheprem]

and there's always the chance that Slim Jim may be able to play again giving more midfield cover.

If you bear in mind that Kightly, Broughton and Corbett have hardly had a kick all year, yet all three have at least played a bit at this level before and impressed on occasion, I don't think we have massive problems. Good call by Tilly throwing the Luton/ West Ham games to avoid fixture congestion.

 

[* ORM *]

Quote[/b] (rabbloke @ Jan. 26 2005,22:07)]My pet subject. New faces this season or same old division next season. How does that equate with the financial arguments?.

The same old division next season would suit the club, and me, just fine. Assuming we can keep in the play-off zone and if we made the final at Cardiff again I think our (operating) financial position would be extremely healthy.

Brushy and Tilly could continue to build the squad (they haven't done such a bad job so far have they ? ) and we could launch our offensive for next season with all guns blazing.

Throwing any money at getting one or two new faces to get us promoted and probably struggle next season is not the way to approach this imho.

 

[shrimper magic]

I can understand the if it's not broke don't fix it arguement, but with any team at any level, u can always look to improve the team.

I for one would welcome a new face if he strengthens the side, and with the signings that tilly/brush have made so far i'm sure they would bring in a good player.

 

[Ron Manager]

We all want promotion, and we would all love to get promotion by spending whatever is neccesary. But we have to operate within a budget and we have to assume, financially, that we will be in this division again next year. That's not being defeatist but good business sense.

OK, we could throw League One money at the squad on the assumption that we will be in League One next year, but what if we don't? Where will that leave us? I'll tell you where, in the same situation we were in when we got relegated from the First Division, with players on First Division contracts but the club making Second and then Third Division money. That very nearly bankrupted us and we are only now beginning to show signs of recovering.

So I'm sorry, stick with our current prudent policy (which is working pretty well don't forget) and we will build something solid and financially stable. If we get promoted this year it's a bonus and we can re-asses the financial situation then but I wouldn't be happy at gambling the good work that has been done in a throw of the dice stab at promotion at all costs.

 

[Barry the dog]

Craig Bellemy is a bit stuck at the moment, perhaps we could bring him down to the Fortress Roots Hall.

 

[Technician]

GK: Flahavan, Griemink(I), Holloway©, Morgan(L)

RB: Hunt, Jupp, Wilson
LB: Wilson, Nicolau
CB: Edwards(I), Prior, Barratt, Hunt

RM: Gower, Pettefer, Corbett(I), Husbands
LM: Gower, Nicolau, Bramble
CM: Maher, Bentley, Pettefer, Hunt, Smith(IS)

FW: Eastwood, Gray, Dudfield, Bramble, Broughton, Kightly

© = Cover For Griemink
(I) = Injury
(IS) = Out For Season
(L) = Out On Loan

Where a player's name is mentioned more than once, these are the positions he can play in, but then some of you may have already worked that out... for those that haven't

If we got rid of Broughton, Kightly and Husbands, who are unlikely to feature in our first team, we might be able to get in a decent utility player of the same standard as Hunt. This may relieve some of the problems in defence and midfield when we have an injury or suspension, but Tilson doesn't need to act as a matter of urgency with the cover we have already.

 

[rabbloke]

Quote[/b] (Ron Manager @ Jan. 27 2005,10:12)]We all want promotion, and we would all love to get promotion by spending whatever is neccesary. But we have to operate within a budget and we have to assume, financially, that we will be in this division again next year. That's not being defeatist but good business sense.

OK, we could throw League One money at the squad on the assumption that we will be in League One next year, but what if we don't? Where will that leave us? I'll tell you where, in the same situation we were in when we got relegated from the First Division, with players on First Division contracts but the club making Second and then Third Division money. That very nearly bankrupted us and we are only now beginning to show signs of recovering.

So I'm sorry, stick with our current prudent policy (which is working pretty well don't forget) and we will build something solid and financially stable. If we get promoted this year it's a bonus and we can re-asses the financial situation then but I wouldn't be happy at gambling the good work that has been done in a throw of the dice stab at promotion at all costs.

Cant agree with a word you said. Its not all about money or the spending of huge amounts. Why Premier$hite or championship loanees? Where did we get Gower or Bentley from and not to mention Holloway or are you suggesting any old keeper will do if needed? We have had a good season on and off the field. Better than most would have anticipated so there should be a couple of sheckles to strengthen on approval. Some have mentioned Broughton, Corbett, Kightly and Jupp. Well Broughton was not good enough to figure before, Tilly seems to hate Corbett, Kightly was surplus to requirements and Jupp had lost favour before his injury. So why should we make do with them now? Husbands is only a player by payroll number so we can discount him. Sorry to disagree but we need a couple of fit bodies to join the side now and there are loads out there capable of keeping the wheels on the promotion bandwagon at least until some of our more preferred players are fit. Come on Tilly! Come on RM! The financial reward of promotion far outwieghs the tuppence of getting us there.

 

[Joolz]

Am I missing something? I just don't get this attitude of 'promotion at all costs this year', in fact I don't get the obesession with promotion full stop.

Why do we follow Southend - fundamentally because we enjoy it. Do we really think that a season in League 1 will be any more entertaining than what we are getting now? OK, the opposition is of a slightly higher standard, but that doesn't necessarily mean the games are any better. Don't forget that we had some shocking seasons in our Division 1 days, and that was playing the likes of Wolves, Derby, etc...

Don't get me wrong - I would love it if we got promoted this season, but if we don't then it will bother me for about 5 minutes. It will still have been an exciting season.

The most important thing for me is that we have a club that is well run (which it now is), a club that has a good relationship with it's fans (which it now does), a club that tries to play attractive football (mostly yes), and most importantly that WE HAVE A CLUB (for now, yes).

 

[Technician]

Personally, I agree with the recent sentiments on here, as most are valid points. What I would like to say though, is that whilst we don't look like making the automatics this year, the squad we do have, is more than capable of such a feat and should secure a playoff spot.

There's three players we'll miss in this campaign through injury. Smith, who we may not see playing again because of his injuries, Griemink, who may be out throughout February and Edwards around the same amount of time as Griemink.

The fact we have cover for all of these players (whether they are of equal ability or not), means that we don't specifically need to bring in fresh players right now as a kneejerk reaction. Some people won't like that, but why bring players in who will sit on the bench and maybe get 5 or 10 minutes of football each week. We have to be realistic.

Personally, I will be hugely disappointed if we don't make the playoffs this season, but I have every confidence in Tilson & Brush getting us there with the squad we've got! so let's have a little faith in what they are doing for the club and stop worrying about whether we need an extra couple of players or not.

 

[Ron Manager]

Quote[/b] (rabbloke @ Jan. 27 2005,11:48)]

Quote[/b] (Ron Manager @ Jan. 27 2005,10:12)]We all want promotion, and we would all love to get promotion by spending whatever is neccesary. But we have to operate within a budget and we have to assume, financially, that we will be in this division again next year. That's not being defeatist but good business sense.

OK, we could throw League One money at the squad on the assumption that we will be in League One next year, but what if we don't? Where will that leave us? I'll tell you where, in the same situation we were in when we got relegated from the First Division, with players on First Division contracts but the club making Second and then Third Division money. That very nearly bankrupted us and we are only now beginning to show signs of recovering.

So I'm sorry, stick with our current prudent policy (which is working pretty well don't forget) and we will build something solid and financially stable. If we get promoted this year it's a bonus and we can re-asses the financial situation then but I wouldn't be happy at gambling the good work that has been done in a throw of the dice stab at promotion at all costs.

Cant agree with a word you said. Its not all about money or the spending of huge amounts. Why Premier$hite or championship loanees? Where did we get Gower or Bentley from and not to mention Holloway or are you suggesting any old keeper will do if needed? We have had a good season on and off the field. Better than most would have anticipated so there should be a couple of sheckles to strengthen on approval. Some have mentioned Broughton, Corbett, Kightly and Jupp. Well Broughton was not good enough to figure before, Tilly seems to hate Corbett, Kightly was surplus to requirements and Jupp had lost favour before his injury. So why should we make do with them now? Husbands is only a player by payroll number so we can discount him. Sorry to disagree but we need a couple of fit bodies to join the side now and there are loads out there capable of keeping the wheels on the promotion bandwagon at least until some of our more preferred players are fit. Come on Tilly! Come on RM! The financial reward of promotion far outwieghs the tuppence of getting us there.

You can't agree with a word I said? Really?

So you don't think we should operate within a budget and plan financially for being in this division next year?

You disagree that having players on contracts we couldn't afford nearly bankrupted us?

You believe we should gamble our very future on an all or nothing push for promotion?

Just checking.

 

[neil]

Quote[/b] (rabbloke @ Jan. 27 2005,11:48)]Tilly seems to hate Corbett

I'm not sure about that. He's either injured or not match fit, so he plays in the reserves and then gets injured again. The same goes for Husbands. There's not really much Tilson can do.

The problem is that his hands are tied because he has three players entirely surplus to requirements (Broughton, Corbett and Husbands) with only the possibility of loans for Broughton.

If we are going to spend moeny on bringing someone in then they had better be good. If no one is available then there is no point bringing in anyone.

Personally I think that Darlington is a massive game. Tilson has shown in the past that he brings someone in when he feels the squad is flat (Eastwood after the 4-0 at Darlington for instance). If we win it will remain the same, but if we lose then he may look to bring someone in.

 

[Technician]

Quote[/b] (neil @ Jan. 27 2005,13:49)]Personally I think that Darlington is a massive game. Tilson has shown in the past that he brings someone in when he feels the squad is flat (Eastwood after the 4-0 at Darlington for instance). If we win it will remain the same, but if we lose then he may look to bring someone in.

Darlington will be a difficult game, but let's face it... Tilson doesn't need to get new faces in!!!

Unless we have any more injuries or suspensions, there won't be any players coming in on loan or permanent deals, so it won't matter if we win, lose or draw on Saturday... a win will be nice, but it won't be the end of the world or the football club if we don't.

This is getting nearly as bad as the <ahem> GK debate!  

 

[Hooly]

Quote[/b] (rabbloke @ Jan. 27 2005,11:48)]Cant agree with a word you said.  Its not all about money or the spending of huge amounts. Why Premier$hite or championship loanees? Where did we get Gower or Bentley from and not to mention Holloway or are you suggesting any old keeper will do if needed? We have had a good season on and off the field. Better than most would have anticipated so there should be a couple of sheckles to strengthen on approval. Some have mentioned Broughton, Corbett, Kightly and Jupp. Well Broughton was not good enough to figure before, Tilly seems to hate Corbett, Kightly was surplus to requirements and Jupp had lost favour before his injury. So why should we make do with them now? Husbands is only a player by payroll number so we can discount him. Sorry to disagree but we need a couple of fit bodies to join the side now and there are loads out there capable of keeping the wheels on the promotion bandwagon at least until some of our more preferred players are fit. Come on Tilly! Come on RM! The financial reward of promotion far outwieghs the tuppence of getting us there.

Don't really understand where your "fit bodies" are supposed to fit in.  At the moment one thing we've got going for us is consistency.  Who are we going to drop to accomodate a loanee & what are the couple on the sick list going to do when they return?

Also if we're going to keep the momentum going it would be tough to bring in a player from non-league at this stage of the season as if they're good enough for us their club is likely to be hunting a Trophy, Vase or League title, so unlikely to let them go until these are settled.  Also, although many are full time, most of the non league recruits we've had recently say that they'll be better players after a full pre-season to get fit.

So as Ronald say's the loanee's would really have to be from leagues above us so they can hit the ground running & be better than what we've got, so that's going to cost.  Don't forget when Gower got injured Tilly looked for loanee wingers, but none would come, so he put Nicky in, who as we all know has been sh*t since then.  sh*t hot!

Personally the only place I can see an opening to bring anyone in at this moment is at left back.  But Cheese has been much better recently with Nicky helping him out, and this proves what people like me have said before that some of Che's defensive problems are down to the lack of cover that Mark Gower gives him.  The LDV final is a classic example, yes Bullock was good but a half fit Gower gave Cheese no help at all.

So, unless the injury list gets worse, we've got to rely on what we've got with the internal cover the squad gives us.  Don't forget the bench on Tuesday was Fredy, Tes, Gower, Kightly & Holloway.  With Eagle & Bart to come back these are decent players for a bench at our level.  So splashing the cash at your peril.

Piers St John