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Immigration

Maybe with a stronger mutual European network we could have had an effective way of doing so.

As I said before, an integrated approach by the EU to ensure these scumbags are not allowed free movement should have been the way forward, and I believe progress on that front is still being made, despite Brexit.

Lols, come on mate, let's be truthful here, Over the last 10-15 years, if anyone dared to even cast a doubt surrounding immigration & integration, they were apportioned the title of racists, xenophobes, bigots, fascists etc, by the liberal left. The liberal left simply didn't want to discuss it. Many still don't. They'd happily fling open the gates & usher everyone through, post-haste.

The fact is, because of that ignorance & blanket suffocation from the liberal left, it has unfortunately borne a feeling of resentment & segregation, which the far right have latched onto, and have been so successful with.


Immigrant bashing seems to have become the new norm in the UK (judging by SZ's post bag on politics, at least).

Shame.

IIRC, you've lived in Spain, longer than you've lived in England, yes?

Bloody immigrants, coming onto our shrimperzone's & criticising our politics bag



:whistling:
 
[ IIRC, you've lived in Spain, longer than you've lived in England, yes?

Bloody immigrants, coming onto our shrimperzone's & criticising our politics bag :whistling:

While that may be true, it hardly gainsays the fact that I still have a UK passport and was born and grew up locally.
 
The truth obviously hurts.:winking:

(Just for the record,I'm off for a blood test tomorrow,having got very close to daily insulin injections before Xmas).


Off topic but IMO keeping off drugs is always better than taking lazy. easy route to "health". I am told by my gp to take statins but won't .

As for immigration, simple;- too small a UK, too many people, too little infrastructure, too much marginal social issues WITHOUT there being more people "let in".
Foreign Aid is another topic............... :net::net:
 
Off topic but IMO keeping off drugs is always better than taking lazy. easy route to "health". I am told by my gp to take statins but won't .

As for immigration, simple;- too small a UK, too many people, too little infrastructure, too much marginal social issues WITHOUT there being more people "let in".
Foreign Aid is another topic............... :net::net:

As to your first point, any type two diabetic knows that regular exercise and watching what you eat and drink is the way to avoid insulin injections.

As to your second point you're profoundly wrong.

I'd agree that foreign aid is another topic, entirely.:winking:
 
As to your first point, any type two diabetic knows that regular exercise and watching what you eat and drink is the way to avoid insulin injections.

As to your second point you're profoundly wrong.

I'd agree that foreign aid is another topic, entirely.:winking:

And you wonder why we voted Brexit. No doubt you will also blame the "Right wing Tory press" when Labour have their record defeat in the next GE, instead of looking in the mirror.
 
And you wonder why we voted Brexit. No doubt you will also blame the "Right wing Tory press" when Labour have their record defeat in the next GE, instead of looking in the mirror.
more immigration comes from non EU countries than EU countries. Leaving the EU is unlikely to impact very much on the levels of immigration unless it tanks our economy and therefore there are less jobs that need filling
 
And you wonder why we voted Brexit. No doubt you will also blame the "Right wing Tory press" when Labour have their record defeat in the next GE, instead of looking in the mirror.

more immigration comes from non EU countries than EU countries. Leaving the EU is unlikely to impact very much on the levels of immigration unless it tanks our economy and therefore there are less jobs that need filling

*** is right you know.
 
Lols, come on mate, let's be truthful here, Over the last 10-15 years, if anyone dared to even cast a doubt surrounding immigration & integration, they were apportioned the title of racists, xenophobes, bigots, fascists etc, by the liberal left. The liberal left simply didn't want to discuss it. Many still don't. They'd happily fling open the gates & usher everyone through, post-haste.

The fact is, because of that ignorance & blanket suffocation from the liberal left, it has unfortunately borne a feeling of resentment & segregation, which the far right have latched onto, and have been so successful with.

:whistling:

It was never everyone - despite what the Daily Mail and alike would like to tell you. The vast majority of immigrants do critical jobs such as social care, cleaning and farm labour. A lot of jobs that a majority of the British population seemed to not want to do - and if we're slamming the door shut on this, who is going to look after our elderly, who is going to pick and sort our fruit & veg, who is going to clean our offices and streets, because due to zero hour contracts, **** poor wages, Victorian work practices established by people like Mike Ashley it sure won't be the British leaping to take up these roles - and quite rightly, because I wouldn't do it. Would you?

Have you never thought that during the referendum, those who wanted OUT were multi-millionaires, like BoJo, Gove and Farage and put to the general population as something that would be beneficial to the British people. You think these millionaires give a flying **** about a single mum on Canvey who's barely scraping together enough money to feed their kids?
 
*** is right you know.

Nope he's totally wrong.

Brexit will see a huge drop in numbers. In fact numbers are already dropping because we have voted to leave. If we need to lower non EU immigration then we will vote for a party that will. So that rules out Labour as JC believes we should increase immigration.
 
Nope he's totally wrong.

Brexit will see a huge drop in numbers. In fact numbers are already dropping because we have voted to leave. If we need to lower non EU immigration then we will vote for a party that will. So that rules out Labour as JC believes we should increase immigration.

Who's "we" exactly? The BNP?

No mainstream party will even consider it. This country would collapse without it.
 
It was never everyone - despite what the Daily Mail and alike would like to tell you. The vast majority of immigrants do critical jobs such as social care, cleaning and farm labour. A lot of jobs that a majority of the British population seemed to not want to do - and if we're slamming the door shut on this, who is going to look after our elderly, who is going to pick and sort our fruit & veg, who is going to clean our offices and streets, because due to zero hour contracts, **** poor wages, Victorian work practices established by people like Mike Ashley it sure won't be the British leaping to take up these roles - and quite rightly, because I wouldn't do it. Would you?

Have you never thought that during the referendum, those who wanted OUT were multi-millionaires, like BoJo, Gove and Farage and put to the general population as something that would be beneficial to the British people. You think these millionaires give a flying **** about a single mum on Canvey who's barely scraping together enough money to feed their kids?

Mike Ashley can only get away with what he does because of the unlimited supply of cheap and desperate labour. Workers gained huge rights during the 50's and 60's simply because the employers had to offer better conditions and pay in order to get people to work for them.

I love this myth put out by the wealthy that we need lots of cheap labour otherwise the country will grind to a halt. The fact that nobody wants to be a nurse anymore should be seen as a national disgrace. If the pay and conditions were anywhere near what they should be then we would have no trouble in recruiting enough staff for the NHS.

The real shame is that the very people who should be protecting the workers, meaning the Labour party and its debate hogging supporters, have swallowed the great globalisation lie. Which just makes life much tougher for the people who are still working class in this country.

By the way when my mum was struggling back in the 70's she did what most of the mums did back then. They went and picked fruit and veg at the local farm. Something all us young kids enjoyed doing as well.
 
Have you never thought that during the referendum, those who wanted OUT were multi-millionaires, like BoJo, Gove and Farage and put to the general population as something that would be beneficial to the British people. You think these millionaires give a flying **** about a single mum on Canvey who's barely scraping together enough money to feed their kids?
In the interests of balance it's worth noting that there was no shortage of extremely wealthy people who supported the remain campaign purely to suit their own ends as well. There was selfish ***** on both sides of the vote.
 
Mike Ashley can only get away with what he does because of the unlimited supply of cheap and desperate labour. Workers gained huge rights during the 50's and 60's simply because the employers had to offer better conditions and pay in order to get people to work for them.

I love this myth put out by the wealthy that we need lots of cheap labour otherwise the country will grind to a halt. The fact that nobody wants to be a nurse anymore should be seen as a national disgrace. If the pay and conditions were anywhere near what they should be then we would have no trouble in recruiting enough staff for the NHS.

The real shame is that the very people who should be protecting the workers, meaning the Labour party and its debate hogging supporters, have swallowed the great globalisation lie. Which just makes life much tougher for the people who are still working class in this country.

By the way when my mum was struggling back in the 70's she did what most of the mums did back then. They went and picked fruit and veg at the local farm. Something all us young kids enjoyed doing as well.

Isn't the bit I highlighted exactly the argument I gave?

BTW, you'll be hard to find a local farm where everything is not mechanised and mass produced these days, apart from the ones that act as a day out for kids.
 
Isn't the bit I highlighted exactly the argument I gave?

BTW, you'll be hard to find a local farm where everything is not mechanised and mass produced these days, apart from the ones that act as a day out for kids.

No its not. Its mas immigration that has allowed employers including the government to reduce pay and condition's.

Capitalism is quite a simple formula. If you have 11 people chasing 10 jobs then the employer has all the cards. If there are only 9 people to fill the same 10 jobs, then the 9 people hold all the cards.
 
No its not. Its mas immigration that has allowed employers including the government to reduce pay and condition's.

Capitalism is quite a simple formula. If you have 11 people chasing 10 jobs then the employer has all the cards. If there are only 9 people to fill the same 10 jobs, then the 9 people hold all the cards.
that is why safeguarding workers rights - whenever there is unemployment, for whatever reason, that situation will be exploited by unscrupulous employers if the law allows it
 
It was never everyone - despite what the Daily Mail and alike would like to tell you. The vast majority of immigrants do critical jobs such as social care, cleaning and farm labour. A lot of jobs that a majority of the British population seemed to not want to do - and if we're slamming the door shut on this, who is going to look after our elderly, who is going to pick and sort our fruit & veg, who is going to clean our offices and streets, because due to zero hour contracts, **** poor wages, Victorian work practices established by people like Mike Ashley it sure won't be the British leaping to take up these roles - and quite rightly, because I wouldn't do it. Would you?

When I used the term everyone, I was referring to those who currently want to come here. Those who are the other side of the metaphorical gate, waiting for it to open. I'm not suggesting everyone on the planet.

And I fully welcome immigration of skilled labour. But it's the unskilled labour where the problem lies, and TBH it's all down to one vicious cycle. You're saying that the indigenous folk don't want to do the crap jobs, which I Agree with, but that's because of the low wages. Hence immigrants come in & do those jobs, for a pittance, which is fine for them, because it's a lot better than their countries of origin. That method helps the immigrants & it helps those who are already sitting at the top of the money pyramid, but It does nothing to break the cycle, and nothing to help future growth. How does that help the mum from Canvey, whose cost of living is already WAY beyond her income streams?

It's ingenious if you think about it. Shift all the focus onto foreigners, so The right wing are focused on hating the foreigners, the left wing are focused on saving the foreigners, and all the while, the fat cats carry on rolling around in cash, and your kids future gets bleaker & bleaker.

An impossible solution would be to stop unskilled labour, and then force the fat cats to spread the wealth, creating a better society for us & future generations.

Now back to my origional point which was, over the past 10-15 years, if I'd have made a statement such as... Due to the greed of the rich, The influx of the the immigrant workforce is severely harming the prospects of the current indeginous population... I'd have probably been called racist, before I'd even finished the sentence. And that would have been followed with the standard diatribe nonsense... "Ooh you just don't like brown people", "ooh is Hitler your hero", "ooh white supremacist".

That is just one of the reasons why we witnessed a monumental & shocking 2016. Over the last 2 decades, The left have tried to batter & belittle anyone who mentioned immigration. And all that did, was kill any reasonable debate, which is odd, because in the origional post I quoted of yours, you were calling for.... Reasonable debate regarding immigration.

Have you never thought that during the referendum, those who wanted OUT were multi-millionaires, like BoJo, Gove and Farage and put to the general population as something that would be beneficial to the British people. You think these millionaires give a flying **** about a single mum on Canvey who's barely scraping together enough money to feed their kids?

Maybe so. But on the flip side, the leader of the remain campaign, the Prime Minister, according to EU law, could have applied much tougher legislation on immigration. Which was reported by the liberals hero, James O'Brien. Cameron always had the power to quell this public upsurge, but for one reason-or-another, decided not to. You're telling me HE cared about us? Oh and whilst we're on the subject, *enter stage right* Tony Blair. Now, if you needed any other reason not to trust the remain campaign, it was that grinning piece of ****.
 
Mike Ashley can only get away with what he does because of the unlimited supply of cheap and desperate labour. Workers gained huge rights during the 50's and 60's simply because the employers had to offer better conditions and pay in order to get people to work for them.

I love this myth put out by the wealthy that we need lots of cheap labour otherwise the country will grind to a halt. The fact that nobody wants to be a nurse anymore should be seen as a national disgrace. If the pay and conditions were anywhere near what they should be then we would have no trouble in recruiting enough staff for the NHS.

The real shame is that the very people who should be protecting the workers, meaning the Labour party and its debate hogging supporters, have swallowed the great globalisation lie. Which just makes life much tougher for the people who are still working class in this country.

By the way when my mum was struggling back in the 70's she did what most of the mums did back then. They went and picked fruit and veg at the local farm. Something all us young kids enjoyed doing as well.


Excellent post.

The rich stay rich & the poor stay poor... If you allow it
 
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