Show Racism The Red Card - Tomorrow

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

If one voice speaks out and gets shouted down then good on that voice but if 20 voices say yes he is right then the many out shout the few and THEN you start to kick out racist.

Which is what is happening - it's just pre arranged

 

[dannypav]

I think we should get Zammo to sing 'Just Say No' before kick off.
Ok , different subject matter I know , but the sentiments the same and a cracking song too !

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

I don't like going on an away day and feeling like I'm in a foreign country. Doesn't make me a racist to speak out about it or have views on illegal immigration. I work with some great people of all cultures and get on great.

I still love the county and don't want to see it spoiled and abused.

I think the England chants were tongue in cheek.

The areas around grounds tend to be cheap property so that is where the most recent wave of immigrants head. Means you don't get a true idea of the ethnic mix of a town.

illegal immigration is minute in terms of numbers - your opinion on illegal immigration is probably the same as most peoples' - that it's illegal

 

[Rattus Norvegicus]

England should be (in my head anyway) a land with people with manners and courtesy and consideration. For all.

Let's kick out racism and, at the same time, be nice to each other. :thumbsup:

It's amazing what a bit of pleasantry can do.

 

[Silencer]

My opinions are my opinions and without starting off another thread for the PC brigade I would just add this - in my lifetime racism in my experience is a lot worse towards myself (A white Englishman in his early thirties) than I have dished out or seen/heard myself.

Until the age of 9 I attended a school in East London in a class of just three white kids, on a daily basis I was subjected to "Milky Bar kid", "Casper" and "White Honkey" jibes and I can assure you not once was anything ever raised.

I have played football at Semi Pro level for over a decade, represented Essex, East Anglia and East of England teams and I can assure you that at times I was left of groups in training and meals and made to feel ostracised because I didn't fit in with the black boys, at times this was even openly admitted.

I think everyone is far too precious in our country and the discrimination only seems to works one way, people live in fear of having an opinion and certainly expressing it, so much so that it breads this whole 'racism' outlook. For example, why can there be Asian football leagues, you have some areas where white folk cannot visit in fear of trouble. You then have the MOBO awards, how does that work. At one of the leading Banks where I work they have the "Rainbow Group" for homosexual and bisexual staff only. You could even go as far as saying Sheila's wheels which offered women cheaper car insurance - all these things discriminate against me but I don't feel the need to start campaigns and groups to ostracise myself from society.

All these organised groups like "Kick it out" are just brining up issues when it doesn't need to be addressed, you could even say fuel the so called racists with publicity. This is England and there will always be isolated incidents because of whatever reason, what help do these groups actually do. Maybe they should look closer to home with players like Rio Ferdinand calling his former England colleague Ashley Cole a "Choc Ice". If that was a white male like John Terry or Wayne Rooney, all hell would have broke out!!! #justsaying. Then you have the double standards, was it Jason Roberts and a few other black guys refused to where the "Kick it out t-shirts" in a form of protest, imagine a few white guys did that!!!!

The whole word racism is not something anyone would like to be associated with and rightly so, but making people live in fear of their innocent words and phrases being twisted and questioned is arguably just as much a form of bullying.

How about stop flagging up the issues by ramming these pointless events it down peoples throats and stop publicising issues that are hardly there.

 

[chapperzUK]

How about stop flagging up the issues by ramming these pointless events it down peoples throats and stop publicising issues that are hardly there.

Good post, but how about just 1 organisation called "Stop Discrimination". Not focusing on one group, but of all kinds of discrimination based on colour, age, gender, religion etc.

 

[Mick]

illegal immigration is minute in terms of numbers - your opinion on illegal immigration is probably the same as most peoples' - that it's illegal

Not an exact science, but best estimate of "irregular residents", or people without the right to remain in the country was 618,000 a few months ago. How big does this number have to get before it is no longer "minute" ?

 

[flapjack]

I don't like the way my local church keep putting leaflets through my door telling me about the church, I know its there and if I want to attend or if my Wife and daughter want to go then fair enough......but don't keep throwing things at me or through my door or stopping me on the street to talk about Jesus........same pricipal as this kick racism out of football

 

[shrimperjon]

My opinions are my opinions and without starting off another thread for the PC brigade I would just add this - in my lifetime racism in my experience is a lot worse towards myself (A white Englishman in his early thirties) than I have dished out or seen/heard myself.

Until the age of 9 I attended a school in East London in a class of just three white kids, on a daily basis I was subjected to "Milky Bar kid", "Casper" and "White Honkey" jibes and I can assure you not once was anything ever raised.

I have played football at Semi Pro level for over a decade, represented Essex, East Anglia and East of England teams and I can assure you that at times I was left of groups in training and meals and made to feel ostracised because I didn't fit in with the black boys, at times this was even openly admitted.

I think everyone is far too precious in our country and the discrimination only seems to works one way, people live in fear of having an opinion and certainly expressing it, so much so that it breads this whole 'racism' outlook. For example, why can there be Asian football leagues, you have some areas where white folk cannot visit in fear of trouble. You then have the MOBO awards, how does that work. At one of the leading Banks where I work they have the "Rainbow Group" for homosexual and bisexual staff only. You could even go as far as saying Sheila's wheels which offered women cheaper car insurance - all these things discriminate against me but I don't feel the need to start campaigns and groups to ostracise myself from society.

All these organised groups like "Kick it out" are just brining up issues when it doesn't need to be addressed, you could even say fuel the so called racists with publicity. This is England and there will always be isolated incidents because of whatever reason, what help do these groups actually do. Maybe they should look closer to home with players like Rio Ferdinand calling his former England colleague Ashley Cole a "Choc Ice". If that was a white male like John Terry or Wayne Rooney, all hell would have broke out!!! #justsaying. Then you have the double standards, was it Jason Roberts and a few other black guys refused to where the "Kick it out t-shirts" in a form of protest, imagine a few white guys did that!!!!

The whole word racism is not something anyone would like to be associated with and rightly so, but making people live in fear of their innocent words and phrases being twisted and questioned is arguably just as much a form of bullying.

How about stop flagging up the issues by ramming these pointless events it down peoples throats and stop publicising issues that are hardly there.

Brilliant post and absolutely spot on. Some times there is a myth that racism is a one way street, which clearly at times it isnt. Much racial tension and trouble is often between groups of the same color, regardless of what color that may be.

Unfortunately in modern society it is ok for people from the same race to use certain terms, but as soon as some of a different race uses the phrase its deemed racist. The post that's mentions one group against discrimination is spot on. Its not about black on white or white on Asian, Asian on black. Racism and discrimination come in many different forms and its about time people woke up to this.

 

[shrimperjon]

I don't like the way my local church keep putting leaflets through my door telling me about the church, I know its there and if I want to attend or if my Wife and daughter want to go then fair enough......but don't keep throwing things at me or through my door or stopping me on the street to talk about Jesus........same pricipal as this kick racism out of football

How is it the same? If you are walking down the street and someone from your local churches approaches you and you say no thanks, do they abuse you, attack you, call you names? i doubt it, so i think you are wrong in trying to link what happens racially with religion, although religion can be a huge cause of trouble in so many ways.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

The areas around grounds tend to be cheap property so that is where the most recent wave of immigrants head. Means you don't get a true idea of the ethnic mix of a town.

illegal immigration is minute in terms of numbers - your opinion on illegal immigration is probably the same as most peoples' - that it's illegal

Not an exact science, but best estimate of "irregular residents", or people without the right to remain in the country was 618,000 a few months ago. How big does this number have to get before it is no longer "minute" ?

Mick,
Does the number of "irregular residents" in the UK (whether minute or not) make you feel threatened in any way?

 

[flapjack]

How is it the same? If you are walking down the street and someone from your local churches approaches you and you say no thanks, do they abuse you, attack you, call you names? i doubt it, so i think you are wrong in trying to link what happens racially with religion, although religion can be a huge cause of trouble in so many ways.

you haven't been to my local church, a real rough lot and not to be trusted

 

[shrimperjon]

you haven't been to my local church, a real rough lot and not to be trusted

Lol, fair point

 

[flapjack]

Lol, fair point

its amazing though Shrimperjon how many people get so bent out of shape over Racism and Religion........quite sad to be honest

 

[Ricky Otto]

Great points made by a lot of posters. Chapperz gets it right IMO with the simple stop discrimination. These things are difficult to gage as peoples levels of offence are different and what is harmless banter between some may be interpreted differently by others, I have friends of various ethnicities and we joke about as friends do and we do make comments that enforce racial stereotypes. The important thing is that none of it comes from hate and I am happy to take the stick I get because I know it’s the way we are and it is not motivated by hate, in fact the opposite. Keeping to the subject in hand, which is in football, it shouldn’t be tolerated but it should be enforced with equality the guy who shouts “you ginger c***” should be chucked out with the guy who shouts “you black c***”. Players have a responsibility as role models on the pitch too, if they choose to muck about as mates outside of the game and say things that may offend some that is their life and not our business as long as it isn’t coming from hate and is directed between people who have an understanding I don’t see a problem.

 

[flapjack]

Great points made by a lot of posters. Chapperz gets it right IMO with the simple stop discrimination. These things are difficult to gage as peoples levels of offence are different and what is harmless banter between some may be interpreted differently by others, I have friends of various ethnicities and we joke about as friends do and we do make comments that enforce racial stereotypes. The important thing is that none of it comes from hate and I am happy to take the stick I get because I know it’s the way we are and it is not motivated by hate, in fact the opposite. Keeping to the subject in hand, which is in football, it shouldn’t be tolerated but it should be enforced with equality the guy who shouts “you ginger c***” should be chucked out with the guy who shouts “you black c***”. Players have a responsibility as role models on the pitch too, if they choose to muck about as mates outside of the game and say things that may offend some that is their life and not our business as long as it isn’t coming from hate and is directed between people who have an understanding I don’t see a problem.

Sorry I went of the subject for a few posts.......back on now, I was a ref for around 15 years at various levels and to be honest I never had one incident of abuse agaist colour of skin,religion,hair colour or anything else,so is it just isolated incidents that are being blown up

 

[KAB]

There seems to be a confusion, in some of the posts, between racism, discrimination and prejudice. We all have prejudice and if we act upon that prejudice, it becomes discrimination, irrespective of colour or creed but racism is something quite different, it is about power and the historical connotations linked to it. Could the black or asian population within this country rise and overthrow the the accepted system that prevails. The answer is obvious and it is not about numbers, it is about who controls the money that oversee the nations finances. Even in South Africa and Zimbabwe, where there are black majority governments, the white people who live there, have the money and expertise and have suffered little in comparison with their black counterparts. Positive discrimination may at times seem absurd or even offensive but if it redressess the balance then I am for it and I have been, to my cost, on the receiving end of such a policy. It is a contentious issue but one I agree with, that only white people can be racist, prejudice and discrimination are open to all.

 

[Berrichonne shrimper]

My opinions are my opinions and without starting off another thread for the PC brigade I would just add this - in my lifetime racism in my experience is a lot worse towards myself (A white Englishman in his early thirties) than I have dished out or seen/heard myself.

Until the age of 9 I attended a school in East London in a class of just three white kids, on a daily basis I was subjected to "Milky Bar kid", "Casper" and "White Honkey" jibes and I can assure you not once was anything ever raised.

I have played football at Semi Pro level for over a decade, represented Essex, East Anglia and East of England teams and I can assure you that at times I was left of groups in training and meals and made to feel ostracised because I didn't fit in with the black boys, at times this was even openly admitted.

I think everyone is far too precious in our country and the discrimination only seems to works one way, people live in fear of having an opinion and certainly expressing it, so much so that it breads this whole 'racism' outlook. For example, why can there be Asian football leagues, you have some areas where white folk cannot visit in fear of trouble. You then have the MOBO awards, how does that work. At one of the leading Banks where I work they have the "Rainbow Group" for homosexual and bisexual staff only. You could even go as far as saying Sheila's wheels which offered women cheaper car insurance - all these things discriminate against me but I don't feel the need to start campaigns and groups to ostracise myself from society.

All these organised groups like "Kick it out" are just brining up issues when it doesn't need to be addressed, you could even say fuel the so called racists with publicity. This is England and there will always be isolated incidents because of whatever reason, what help do these groups actually do. Maybe they should look closer to home with players like Rio Ferdinand calling his former England colleague Ashley Cole a "Choc Ice". If that was a white male like John Terry or Wayne Rooney, all hell would have broke out!!! #justsaying. Then you have the double standards, was it Jason Roberts and a few other black guys refused to where the "Kick it out t-shirts" in a form of protest, imagine a few white guys did that!!!!

The whole word racism is not something anyone would like to be associated with and rightly so, but making people live in fear of their innocent words and phrases being twisted and questioned is arguably just as much a form of bullying.

How about stop flagging up the issues by ramming these pointless events it down peoples throats and stop publicising issues that are hardly there.

brilliant post you honky,can not green you again but I will put it in the bank for you.

 

[Blues 'n twos]

My opinions are my opinions and without starting off another thread for the PC brigade I would just add this - in my lifetime racism in my experience is a lot worse towards myself (A white Englishman in his early thirties) than I have dished out or seen/heard myself.

Until the age of 9 I attended a school in East London in a class of just three white kids, on a daily basis I was subjected to "Milky Bar kid", "Casper" and "White Honkey" jibes and I can assure you not once was anything ever raised.

I have played football at Semi Pro level for over a decade, represented Essex, East Anglia and East of England teams and I can assure you that at times I was left of groups in training and meals and made to feel ostracised because I didn't fit in with the black boys, at times this was even openly admitted.

I think everyone is far too precious in our country and the discrimination only seems to works one way, people live in fear of having an opinion and certainly expressing it, so much so that it breads this whole 'racism' outlook. For example, why can there be Asian football leagues, you have some areas where white folk cannot visit in fear of trouble. You then have the MOBO awards, how does that work. At one of the leading Banks where I work they have the "Rainbow Group" for homosexual and bisexual staff only. You could even go as far as saying Sheila's wheels which offered women cheaper car insurance - all these things discriminate against me but I don't feel the need to start campaigns and groups to ostracise myself from society.

All these organised groups like "Kick it out" are just brining up issues when it doesn't need to be addressed, you could even say fuel the so called racists with publicity. This is England and there will always be isolated incidents because of whatever reason, what help do these groups actually do. Maybe they should look closer to home with players like Rio Ferdinand calling his former England colleague Ashley Cole a "Choc Ice". If that was a white male like John Terry or Wayne Rooney, all hell would have broke out!!! #justsaying. Then you have the double standards, was it Jason Roberts and a few other black guys refused to where the "Kick it out t-shirts" in a form of protest, imagine a few white guys did that!!!!

The whole word racism is not something anyone would like to be associated with and rightly so, but making people live in fear of their innocent words and phrases being twisted and questioned is arguably just as much a form of bullying.

How about stop flagging up the issues by ramming these pointless events it down peoples throats and stop publicising issues that are hardly there.

Great post, couldn't agree more, too many double standards! :thumbsup:

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

Great post, couldn't agree more, too many double standards! :thumbsup:

I'll reply using this rather than Silencer's as it'll take up less space.

There doesn't have to be double standards, it can easily be one standard - treat people fairly. If he has experienced racism against him then he should easily understand a collective wanting to speak out against it. Kick it out is against prejudice - in this country that will mostly be anti black or Asian but it is also homophobia and in Glasgow or Liverpool it maybe sectarian and it some cases anti white. The demographic of football grounds means you won't find a lot of anti white stuff being expressed.

Ferdinand does get slated for his tweets and I think has been in trouble with the FA. Roberts also got slatted but his reasoning was a bit more complicated.

People in a minority often set up smaller groups - it's reassuring if you are used to being out numbered. When that minority becomes bigger it can seem a bit divisive but the reasoning in the first place is valid.

the fact you haven't witnessed racism first hand at a football match doesn't mean it doesn't exist. '**** off back to Asia' was what I heard at Luton and I was nowhere near the others who have reported similar. If you go back to the 70's and 80's racism and violence was rife and in Eastern Europe it still is. The reason the amount we have has reduced by so much is because it is collectively stated that it is unacceptable. Get complacent and it will increase.

Racism is not welcome - some may not see the point in stating the obvious but in never ceases to amaze me how often you have to do just that.