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How long?

Thundersley Blue

Coach⭐
Joined
Sep 9, 2010
Messages
1,485
Location
Mendlesham Suffolk
You cannot build anything without proper foundations. For the first time in many years those foundations are in place and I believe rock solid.

Yes, we need to start building, but have a few years of poor recruitment to deal with along the way.
 

ColinMorrisWalksOnWater

Assistant Head Coach⭐
Joined
May 14, 2014
Messages
1,486
Location
On the beach
I think you've raised a fair question ORM. it's based on how you feel and everyone has their own feelings, which can be changed by more or less information, for better or worse.

So firstly I would hope you get enough information back to feel a little more positive than you currently do now from this thread as a whole.

To answer your question, by the start of January I would hope there will be signs of improvement and increase in points, accompanied with a slightly better league position, provided by tactical changes, training bringing improvements and better performances from a happier group of players than previously.

By the end of January, although we are not subject to a transfer window, some of our targets may be waiting until then to see what their options are, I would hope to definitely see some movement and change in squad personnel. Therefore I would think you should have some signs either way by mid-January, to see visible improvement and if not, the dark clouds continue to gather and the concerns you have will gather strength and have more substance to them.

I hope that the latter is obviously not the case and more than happy to continue the debate with you at any time.

UTB!
 
Last edited:
Joined
Jul 23, 2017
Messages
85
I like these sort of posts as it’s always good to see other people’s views - my reply to this is that I think some fans are expecting change to happen over night.

Stan and Co are trying to put a stop to 3 years of rot and neglect and then get us back up the league. He is building a team which in turn hopefully brings success, this won’t solve our issues instantly and I don’t think we will see results of Stans work for another couple of months / year.

Give them the time they need, we don’t want to rush this work or half solve our issues.
 

Barling Magna

President⭐
Joined
Dec 14, 2010
Messages
7,915
Ok nice post (apart from the first paragraph!)

What does how long mean though? Are you proposing people get sacked if we haven't turned it around by x days/weeks/months?

We might well end up in NLS - do you want everyone sacked because of that?

In my opinion we have
A CEO - that's a good step in the right direction...it moves Ron into the background
A good coaching team - Head, Assistant and First Team
A good scout - John Still
I'm also happy with the Stan role...

I hope whatever happens at the end of the season all these are still in place...I could hack the NLS - but not if it means these aren't there

I agree. Whilst it is the last thing I would want I don't think that relegation to the National League South would destroy us. It didn't destroy Torquay or Stockport.

However, let's not test that eh?
 

Crawliano

LADYCHARMER80
Joined
Aug 18, 2008
Messages
2,622
Location
Benfleet
For every person that says give it time I give you Darlington FC. What a fabulous new ground that was and solved all their problems.
Comparing Fossetts Farm to the Darlington Arena has become the niche Southend United version of Godwin's Law.

Southend, Rochford and Castle Point has a combined population of around 360,000
Darlington 105,000 with not a lot nearby except Middlesbrough and Stockton-on-Tees

25,000 seats with a local catchment of 105,000 is just a recipe for disaster and was bound to fall over from the get go.

I have a lot of reservations about this new ground and think it could be done far better, but the capacity is pretty much spot on if you're building something to be home for the next 50 years, not 50 months. Will it solve all the club's problems? Who knows. But the stadium isn't going to be the noose that hangs the club.

Now that said, surviving the next 50 weeks is priority number one and that's the real elephant in the room.
 

sufc4life21

Newbie⭐
Joined
Apr 20, 2009
Messages
1,559
Comparing Fossetts Farm to the Darlington Arena has become the niche Southend United version of Godwin's Law.

Southend, Rochford and Castle Point has a combined population of around 360,000
Darlington 105,000 with not a lot nearby except Middlesbrough and Stockton-on-Tees

25,000 seats with a local catchment of 105,000 is just a recipe for disaster and was bound to fall over from the get go.

I have a lot of reservations about this new ground and think it could be done far better, but the capacity is pretty much spot on if you're building something to be home for the next 50 years, not 50 months. Will it solve all the club's problems? Who knows. But the stadium isn't going to be the noose that hangs the club.

Now that said, surviving the next 50 weeks is priority number one and that's the real elephant in the room.
Potential there I agree but sufc need to be winning and be back in league 1 with the Potential to push for the championship and beyond to bring in games sufficient numbers on regular basis to FF. If we are stuck in the National league for some years, I can't really see us attracting no more than we get at roots hall.
 

Crawliano

LADYCHARMER80
Joined
Aug 18, 2008
Messages
2,622
Location
Benfleet
Potential there I agree but sufc need to be winning and be back in league 1 with the Potential to push for the championship and beyond to bring in games sufficient numbers on regular basis to FF. If we are stuck in the National league for some years, I can't really see us attracting no more than we get at roots hall.
Totally agree. We're basically playing long term harakiri with each season spent in non league.

Gates won't be hurt in the short term really, but considering I go back to the 90s and was laughed at for supporting a team who got to play against Fiorentina competitively and banking the equivalent today of £8m from selling just one player who went on to be an icon of the Premier League and that was playing in the second tier of English football.

My concern is the kids at somewhere like Thomas More who have to go through crap from their mates who support West Ham and get to talk about the Europa League while their retort is that they got to play in the FA Trophy. They'll end up saying I support XXX and Southend. We're going to have less one club fans and more floaters and that's going to take years to get back in shape.

Screw up the next few seasons and the knock on even back in the football league could last a generation or beyond.
 
Joined
Nov 20, 2016
Messages
1,728
I 100% agree with ORM. I feel like Stans big thing of wait and see what happens this week or whatever the wording was is more pointed at the John Still appointment rather than a new signing or two. We are so desperately in need of signings yet although we have all these people in different jobs it isnt clear what the structure is. If John Still is coming in with a good eye for players and Stan has this never ending contact list he can ring up and be laughed at on when he asks for help then is there any point of Anton Robinson? laughable that he is even still here! We need a full time physio too so why not replace Robinson with one of these.

There are some fans who say give them time blah blah yet how much time do we realistically have before it is too late. The same fans saying how lucky we are to have Stan but ultimately I will be judging this on what he does not what he says especially as he has never done a role remotely like what he is doing now and as it stands since he has joined all I can judge him on is his way of arguing with fans on here who dont agree with everything he says. With regards to the management team I want nothing more than them to succeed more so than normal as Maher is one of my favourite players but 1 win in 6 is really not good regardless of who we have played as most of the games have been toothless and we havent really been a threat most of the time.

I honestly want the club to succeed but we need fresh players in more than anything right now - look at the impact the Sheff Utd lads had. We need a bite in the middle of the park who will break up play - someone like Deegan.

Most of all - i want a team that each week i can be proud of watching walk off the pitch win, lose or draw and the vast majority of time it is painful and depressing.
Hate to burst your bubble,but other then us beating the worst side in the league what exactly have the Sheffield lads contributed? They are decent! But how have results gone for us other then us beating dover?
 

Chrisb

Forever Blue⭐
Joined
Dec 16, 2010
Messages
2,236
Location
Rayleigh
Totally agree. We're basically playing long term harakiri with each season spent in non league.

Gates won't be hurt in the short term really, but considering I go back to the 90s and was laughed at for supporting a team who got to play against Fiorentina competitively and banking the equivalent today of £8m from selling just one player who went on to be an icon of the Premier League and that was playing in the second tier of English football.

My concern is the kids at somewhere like Thomas More who have to go through crap from their mates who support West Ham and get to talk about the Europa League while their retort is that they got to play in the FA Trophy. They'll end up saying I support XXX and Southend. We're going to have less one club fans and more floaters and that's going to take years to get back in shape.

Screw up the next few seasons and the knock on even back in the football league could last a generation or beyond.

I agree, I am amazed at the size of the crowds we are currently getting and the loyalty of our fans. I think season tickets were sensibly priced and perhaps some thought they would be seeing a promotion chasing side this season but the club should not be complacent about the current level of support.
 
Joined
Jul 4, 2021
Messages
244
I would like to hope that with the structure we've put in place that next year we can mount a challenge for the play-offs atleast, I know seems a long way off but we have employed a lot of people thus turnaround should be quicker. This season is about avoiding a relegation dog fight but I'm not expecting results to start improving until Feb time not like this mess was going to be fixed in one month like some people seem to be expecting.
Yes it will give our January signings time to gel.
Conference South playoffs? I was hoping we would challenge for automatic promotion 😜
 

sufc4life21

Newbie⭐
Joined
Apr 20, 2009
Messages
1,559
Totally agree. We're basically playing long term harakiri with each season spent in non league.

Gates won't be hurt in the short term really, but considering I go back to the 90s and was laughed at for supporting a team who got to play against Fiorentina competitively and banking the equivalent today of £8m from selling just one player who went on to be an icon of the Premier League and that was playing in the second tier of English football.

My concern is the kids at somewhere like Thomas More who have to go through crap from their mates who support West Ham and get to talk about the Europa League while their retort is that they got to play in the FA Trophy. They'll end up saying I support XXX and Southend. We're going to have less one club fans and more floaters and that's going to take years to get back in shape.

Screw up the next few seasons and the knock on even back in the football league could last a generation or beyond.
Mid 90s when I started going to watch sufc back in Division 1. crazy to think sufc were 1 league of the Premier League, sufc did have some half decent players back in those days to.

I found it funny when Ron said in regards to FF stadium..... "build it and they will come" fans won't just go due to new stadium. There needs to be successful team, ambition shown and being back in the efl preferably in league 1 to attract potential new fans.
 
Joined
Jul 4, 2021
Messages
244
Totally agree. We're basically playing long term harakiri with each season spent in non league.

Gates won't be hurt in the short term really, but considering I go back to the 90s and was laughed at for supporting a team who got to play against Fiorentina competitively and banking the equivalent today of £8m from selling just one player who went on to be an icon of the Premier League and that was playing in the second tier of English football.

My concern is the kids at somewhere like Thomas More who have to go through crap from their mates who support West Ham and get to talk about the Europa League while their retort is that they got to play in the FA Trophy. They'll end up saying I support XXX and Southend. We're going to have less one club fans and more floaters and that's going to take years to get back in shape.

Screw up the next few seasons and the knock on even back in the football league could last a generation or beyond.
Loving your profile pic
 

Crawliano

LADYCHARMER80
Joined
Aug 18, 2008
Messages
2,622
Location
Benfleet
Mid 90s when I started going to watch sufc back in Division 1. crazy to think sufc were 1 league of the Premier League, sufc did have some half decent players back in those days to.

I found it funny when Ron said in regards to FF stadium..... "build it and they will come" fans won't just go due to new stadium. There needs to be successful team, ambition shown and being back in the efl preferably in league 1 to attract potential new fans.
If he means "Build it and businesses, weddings and exhibitions will come" he's probably got a point. If he means anything beyond a bump in year one through shiny new toy interest and struggling in the Conference or L2 with GA or Hospitality, we're screwed.

Loving your profile pic

That picture of Tosh with his legion of mini Tosh's lives in my mind rent free.
 

CanveyCastle

Striker
Joined
Feb 4, 2021
Messages
254
If he means "Build it and businesses, weddings and exhibitions will come" he's probably got a point. If he means anything beyond a bump in year one through shiny new toy interest and struggling in the Conference or L2 with GA or Hospitality, we're screwed.



That picture of Tosh with his legion of mini Tosh's lives in my mind rent free.
Wasn't one of his relations a keeper for us ?
 

WestyReturns

Striker
Joined
Mar 27, 2021
Messages
139
Your inflammatory language suggests that you're not willing to have a constructive conversation and you're just posting because of whatever axe you have to grind.

This is an utterly pointless thread.

I suggest the pointless post is from you. You offered nothing constructive to the thread.

The original post has plenty of legitimate topics to discuss. How long are people happy to wait for the new setup to work is a fair question, no?

What problems will the new stadium really solve? If it ever gets built which is a fair comment.

How many players can we bring in now we have a expansive backroom team? Is the balance right? I'd question that too.
 

BoyWonder2

Life President⭐
Joined
Oct 25, 2003
Messages
8,327
Location
Cold Norton, Essex
Yes I’m starting a divisive thread. As a fan for 48 years (but it doesn’t actually matter if it is 48 minutes) I feel entitled enough to post some opinions that many of those currently fawning over what’s happening off the field and blowing smoke up Stan’s backside/massaging his fragile ego, call it what you will.

I want the current infrastructure to succeed I really do. Kevin Maher is my favourite SUFC player of all time bar none. We have an off the field structure that many of the teams in League One and Two can only dream of. We also have a wage bill that I’m guessing many would be jealous of.

For every person that says give it time I give you Darlington FC. What a fabulous new ground that was and solved all their problems.

For everyone that says we’re too good to go down (not many by now I’m sure) I give you Stockport (who are now back), York and a number of others.

Status means nothing. Points mean everything. It is abundantly clear to everyone that the current squad is not good enough and that’s with two exceptionally good loan players.

So the serious question is how long do we stay patient and wait for the new team to work their magic? The longer we stay in our current position the harder it will be to get out of it whatever squad we end up with. The history of this division backs that up sharply.

You might think I’m a doom monger but I remember seeing a glossy picture of a new stadium on the inside cover of match programmes as far back as 1981. Yes 40 years ago. Admittedly there wasn’t much substance and certainly no planning or funding apart from the threats of moving to Basildon.

Until the first digger moves in to FF quite frankly I’ll believe it when I see it. Untold years of FF poo attests to that fact. Quite frankly our current infrastructure would not be supported in National League South. Chester City anyone.

Am I hitting the panic button? Too ****ing right I am. I’m sick of people being closed down for offering contrary views. This is not China (give that another 50 years or so).

To answer my own question I’m prepared not to post another comment here on signings and structure until a couple of weeks into January by which time we still need to be in touching distance of 4th and 5th from bottom which is very possible even with just one win and a draw.

Points mean prizes, what do we points mean?

It’s far, far too early to be pressing the panic button on things in my opinion.

Don’t forget, our football restructure was only completed a couple of days ago with the appointment of John Still, which has been rumbling on in the background for a week or so.

Take FF out of the equation, that has very little to do with things at present. I believe it will happen, however I can see why some people are still so cynical of that.

Let’s focus on other things. The off the field stuff first. We have a CEO, who puts in more hours than anyone we’ve previously had in this position. For some, it was a typical 9-5 job, but not for TL. He was wanted still by Gills, but choose to come to a non-league side. RM has passed a lot onto him, probably more than anyone expects, but RM is now a background figure more than he has been since he took over.

We have Stan. I know he divides opinions. It seems you can’t support him, without being accused of being up his arse, and you can’t be against him without being abused either. Personally, I fully support him. He is clearly passionate about our Club, he loved his spell here more than anywhere else. He spoke so passionately during his zoom calls, his interviews and his SZ posts. Some want him to fail regardless, and that’s the wrong attitude to go into things. People accuse him of running at the first sign of discouragement from fans in the summer, and that couldn’t be further from the truth. He has been in the background, and been in touch with RM. Stan has spent 100s of hours on meetings, phone calls, emails, WhatsApp’s etc, and covered 1000s of miles to watch games, meet Clubs, and watch certain

Our coaching set up. Surely we can all get behind them. Kev is a legend, a back-to-back promotion winning captain. Currie, in my opinion, should have got the job ahead of MM, and a lot of people would have picked him to be in charge this time around. Benno, another excellent ex-pro. MM used to work round the clock for the Club, however the work these three have put in puts MM to shame. So days, some haven’t left the Club/training ground. They’ve covered 1000s of miles watching games etc.

John Still brings a wealth of knowledge, and working knowledge at that having still been involved with Daggers until we came in. Whereas TL left a Club to join the Club he supports, Still has left a Club he supports to join us and that speaks volumes. He has a tidy little number, with almost no pressure at Daggers because what he achieve to join a “sinking ship” where he could be out of a job come the summer if we fail. He brings a list of talent spotters, opposition scouts, and fresh set of eyes. We previously had, apart from the management set up and Stan, around 8-12 people watching matches for us, we now have closer to 30.

Everything off the field is the sort of structure that we have been crying out for for years. And if it fails, and Maher departs, we won’t need to tear up everyone’s contract like we did with Powell, Campbell, MM & Brown. The structure is in place. The idea is to decide on a style that is played through the academy up to the first team. Let’s use 4-4-2 as an example. And say we want one genuine get to the by line and cross wide man, one tuck in winger, two attacking full backs, a big man little man front combo. We will recruit players to fit those roles, not a number 10, who we have to build a side around, like we had with Jack Payne. Of if we decide wing backs is the future, we’ll sign wing backs. So when Kev leaves, whether it’s through success or failure, we won’t have a new manager come in and change our ethos. He won’t be a 4-2-3-1 man, when we are built for 4-4-2 or 3-5-2 or whatever. We’ll have criteria for future head coaches.

On the pitch does need to improve, and new signings are coming. The Grimsby boss pointed out the situation National League Clubs are in. We need to recruit the right players, not any old players. They need to fit a style, fit a structure, fit an ethos. We’ve turned down players, and some have turned us down. We have some lined up with real possibility of joining us January. We have some lined up to join us when their Club’s get their replacement in, and all different scenarios.

Things are looking positive behind the scenes. I know that all the majority of us care about is 3pm on a Saturday or 7:45pm on a Tuesday or whenever we play, and those results will improve, of that I’m certain.
 
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