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Look I get it SAM, you don't like Corbyn and think he's some kind of traitor in shaking hands with Gerry Adams - I don't....he another others could see that the only way to end the killings was to talk. Something John Major realised once Thatcher was out of the way.

You have to admit it's getting it bit boring and heavy on here - SZ should be a place to waste time during the monotony of work.

Agree to disagree? Peace?
 
The IRA killed Mountbatten and The Queen and Charles can still laugh and joke with GA and MM. Us lefties get accused of living in the past, you right wingers may want to take some of your own medicine.

The war with the IRA is over and it ended by talking.

Fine, adopt that method this time round. Your latest hero wants a political solution so perhaps he should try for one. He could start with a foreign policy for starters, which he clearly hasn't got. Oh well, never mind, perhaps he should just get to the hub of the matter, political dialect with terrorists who don't talk any sort of dialect with anyone.

But no matter, I'm sure he will get on famously with people that stone to death women who have been raped, I'm sure negotiation will go swimmingly with people who sex traffic children, throw homosexuals from tall buildings, cage burn people, drag corpses behind Land Cruisers, should I go on? Opps, silly me, I almost forgot beheading aid workers, tanker drivers, captured soldiers ( when they aren't cage burning them of course) and my particular favorite, Muslim converts who hoping against hope, thought it might save their lives. I'm sure JC will be back slapping and laughing along with them in no time.

Hey, maybe he could suggest meaningful discussion in one of the Palace of Westminster's tea rooms. Ask politely if their supporters might stop bombing and executing people in cities like Paris, London, Madrid and where ever the next one will be. Perhaps he could give them their coveted caliphate, wouldn't that be nice for them, their own little part of the world where they could slaughter the slightest dissent in the most heinous way they can imagine in the name of their perverted ideas of Islam and Allah. Of course, its all the Wests fault, foreign policy, Blair, Bush, Cameron, nicking the oil, Saudi's and disaffected Muslem youth, blah blah blah, change the ****ing record. ( Sorry, add the Tories and rich to that list but not Alan Sugar as he's on The Apprentice)

Lets all put our faith in a man who just two weeks ago said he expected his party to back his stance then changes his mind and gives a free vote because his party is far from united and his leadership is hanging by a thread. Lets put our faith in a man who still acts like a Art Collage lecturer rather than a statesman of the opposition. Lets put our faith in a man who opposes but hasn't got an alternative policy, idea or suggestion that is in anyway viable. And why? Because you can't talk to people who don't want a political settlement or solution.

His pacifist stance wont stop another attack on innocent people out for the evening, going to work or just getting on with their lives and nor will it impress the vast majority of the British public, the voters, not the converted but the unconverted who haven't joined the Labour Party but might consider voting for them at some time.

So if you 'lefties' (the first time I have used that pathetic line) want the moral high ground then have it, hope it keeps you warm at night. I prefer some backbone and putting these scumbags back into the Stone Age and killing as many as possible along the way. Send the filth to paradise in tiny little bits along with every ****er that has any support for them. Put the fear of every God into the ***** and make them crawl back under whatever rock whence they came..........And then hunt them down again and again and again until there are none but a historical memory left.

Bollocks to talking, we are past that.

Remember Paris.
 
But the bombing isn't and won't work. Terrorism experts (not just us on Internet forums) have gone on record to say it will make the situation far, far worse and Cameron and co and leading us into that future.
 
So for 3 quid you too can change the world? do me a favour.

You are talking about the sign up to the Labour leadership election I take it? That was to encourage new members (many of whom have become full members).
Right now we are talking about Labour MPs having a free vote and how that apparently makes Corbyn weak, and Cameron needing those Labour MPs in order to win the vote because some of his MPs are not voting with the government because he is........weak?
 
Look at his little face!
Benn looks and sounds like a statesman - a round of applause greeted the end of his speech.

2F00A1CC00000578-3342813-image-m-24_1449098009440.jpg
 
Are we talking about Cameron or Corbyn here? The reason Cameron can't just push it through with his majority is that there are Tory MPs who will not vote for airstrikes.

These figures look pretty compelling to me. True to say that Benns speech tipped a fair few MPs, but the vote would have been carried even if all of the Labour MPs would have voted "No"

2015-12-03_11-37-01.jpg

Another Corduroy failure.... And wasn't his face a picture as his Shadow Foreign Secretary proceeded to hit the final nail in the coffin...
 
Look at his little face!
Benn looks and sounds like a statesman - a round of applause greeted the end of his speech.

2F00A1CC00000578-3342813-image-m-24_1449098009440.jpg


Competition time,what is Jezza thinking ?


You have a girl's name and your not sitting next to me u complete and utter bar steward .
 
These figures look pretty compelling to me. True to say that Benns speech tipped a fair few MPs, but the vote would have been carried even if all of the Labour MPs would have voted "No"

View attachment 3821

Another Corduroy failure.... And wasn't his face a picture as his Shadow Foreign Secretary proceeded to hit the final nail in the coffin...

Not a failure for Corbyn - he became leader of a party in opposition so he wouldn't expect to win against a government motion. Benn spoke very well and Corbyn knew his opinion in advance. Labour MPs had a free vote so the outcome is the outcome.
 
These figures look pretty compelling to me. True to say that Benns speech tipped a fair few MPs, but the vote would have been carried even if all of the Labour MPs would have voted "No"

View attachment 3821

Another Corduroy failure.... And wasn't his face a picture as his Shadow Foreign Secretary proceeded to hit the final nail in the coffin...


Absolute bollox, its why it was called a free vote, in order to voice an opinion

Sadly if you think the speech was the turning point ,in which those who were against bombing turned to a yes vote, then they must be very sad that they could not make up their own minds or even worse listen to those they represent

UTS
 
The 66 Labour MPs who voted to bomb have been receiving threats including death from the far left of the party!

Wow.
 
Absolute bollox, its why it was called a free vote, in order to voice an opinion

Sadly if you think the speech was the turning point ,in which those who were against bombing turned to a yes vote, then they must be very sad that they could not make up their own minds or even worse listen to those they represent

UTS

No one knocked on my door asking which way the local MP should vote, and why should they? We elect MP's to make the tough decisions not to go running for cover whenever it gets a bit sticky.
 
[h=3]Labour wins Oldham West and Royton by-election[/h]
10,800 majority. With a lower turn out than in May it is the equivalent of Meacher's majority - and he was one of the party's biggest achievers vote wise. Encouraging figures.
 
It seems to me that the biggest side product of Jeremy Corbyn becoming leader of the PLP is that the media are so intent on Corbyn watching that the current Government are able to get away with various very weak bits and pieces of parliamentary business without being overly challenged by the same media.
 
It seems to me that the biggest side product of Jeremy Corbyn becoming leader of the PLP is that the media are so intent on Corbyn watching that the current Government are able to get away with various very weak bits and pieces of parliamentary business without being overly challenged by the same media.

Agree with you totally. The country needs a proper active opposition where the story isn't about their dodgy mates and even more dodgy past.
This simply won't last much longer. I listened to Alan Johnson speak last night, he is very highly thought of in the labour party. He sounds like he's had a gutfull.
 
No one knocked on my door asking which way the local MP should vote, and why should they? We elect MP's to make the tough decisions not to go running for cover whenever it gets a bit sticky.

No we vote a political party, we believe have the best interest of the people they represent.
The MP is merely a middle man, between the voter and government

Whether we agree or not with our standing MP is the problem when free votes are open, which in my opinion is the correct way, but they should listen to those who put them in position to vote

For those who believe bombing is the correct way forward, I wonder how many are young enough and willing to join up and put them selves in the firing line or ask one of their kids to join up and fight front line
Problem is very easy to say go and fight, when (a) Behind a key board and (b) making bullets for others to fire from a safe distance (c) and having no real knowledge of the situation

Next person who believes it correct, please let me know you have given up your job behind a safe desk job, sitting in a lay by waiting to unload, taken your last tip for dropping off a far end I will personally wish you the best for following your beliefs as you go to the front line to support the troops


UTS
 
People do vote for the party but they're not supposed to. The whole FPTP system has always been built around voting for the individual MP who will then vote on your behalf.
 
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