John Terry and the 'unacceptability of racism'

[OldBlueLady]

I'm sorry guys, I know what YB is saying about the bananas and that with the footballers, I saw Moussa being racially abused while warming up against Stoke back in the Championship and reported it. That was monkey chants and gestures, and I fully accept that that is abuse, I just don't get all this sensitivity about mentioning a person's skin colour. I've heard the term "you white mother ******" in films fairly frequently and the swearing bit offends me far more than the "white" bit!

Was "Love thy Neighbour" more offensive than Alf Garnett on one of his tirades? People will always insult each other when tempers get fraught, and it gets personal, that's how I see the inclusion of the word "black" in these circumstances....in exactly the same way as you might call someone a "fat *******" or a "ginger ******" or "Paddy something or another"...an observation of something that is personal to them.

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

I'm sorry guys, I know what YB is saying about the bananas and that with the footballers, I saw Moussa being racially abused while warming up against Stoke back in the Championship and reported it. That was monkey chants and gestures, and I fully accept that that is abuse, I just don't get all this sensitivity about mentioning a person's skin colour. I've heard the term "you white mother ******" in films fairly frequently and the swearing bit offends me far more than the "white" bit!

Yes, because white isn't a term denigrating you, relegating you to an inferior social status.

I take it you aren't a feminist.

Was "Love thy Neighbour" more offensive than Alf Garnett on one of his tirades? People will always insult each other when tempers get fraught, and it gets personal, that's how I see the inclusion of the word "black" in these circumstances....in exactly the same way as you might call someone a "fat *******" or a "ginger ******" or "Paddy something or another"...an observation of something that is personal to them.

I can't comment on Love thy Neighbour nor Alf Garnett, but I suspect both were cringeworthy.

 

[MK Shrimper]

Besides which, not all blacks have heritage back to Africa so would someone of Caribbean descent take the same kind of offence?

Erm, yes they do Kay. The slave trade populated the Caribbean with Africans slaves.

On the Tesco thing: It's a nonsense. Recently we saw a playpen on line in blue that was £20....but the pink was was £25. I was thinking about screaming "sexist" (to get a discount!).

 

[South Bank Hank]

I'm sorry guys, I know what YB is saying about the bananas and that with the footballers, I saw Moussa being racially abused while warming up against Stoke back in the Championship and reported it. That was monkey chants and gestures, and I fully accept that that is abuse, I just don't get all this sensitivity about mentioning a person's skin colour. I've heard the term "you white mother ******" in films fairly frequently and the swearing bit offends me far more than the "white" bit!

Was "Love thy Neighbour" more offensive than Alf Garnett on one of his tirades? People will always insult each other when tempers get fraught, and it gets personal, that's how I see the inclusion of the word "black" in these circumstances....in exactly the same way as you might call someone a "fat *******" or a "ginger ******" or "Paddy something or another"...an observation of something that is personal to them.

That's kind of where I was coming from with the original post and why I asked the question about trading one insult for another more emotive and taboo. It's a shame the thread quickly descended into the usual 'what's wrong with calling someone black?' question which any reasonable person can answer for themselves if they stop to think for even just a couple of seconds.

In more enlightened times, we probably will be non-fattist, non-racist, non-gingerist, non-Guardian-linkist, etc but arguably, current legislation (at least for equal opportunity) deals with some of that anyway, even if it doesn't tweak the public conscience in quite the same manner as racism.

As for blacks calling each other by the N-word, who cares? Ultimately, it all comes down to intent (or such negligence that it is pretty much intent anyway). They're hardly using the word as an insult and, again, whether people like it or not, any one who stopped to think about it for a few seconds would understand why that would be different to a racially motivated insult from a white person.

Anyway, some of my best friends are gingers, etc...

 

[Crabby Shrimper]

Recently we saw a playpen on line in blue that was £20....but the pink was was £25. I was thinking about screaming "sexist" (to get a discount!).

The pink one needs to have higher sides as females are far more likely to throw their toys out of the playpen?

 

[OldBlueLady]

Erm, yes they do Kay. The slave trade populated the Caribbean with Africans slaves.

On the Tesco thing: It's a nonsense. Recently we saw a playpen on line in blue that was £20....but the pink was was £25. I was thinking about screaming "sexist" (to get a discount!).

The pink one needs to have higher sides as females are far more likely to throw their toys out of the playpen?

That's down simply to economics. There are statistically more girl babies being born than boys so for parents wanting to have one or the other playpen, there should theoretically be more pink ones sold hence more profit.

 

[Pubey]

Erm, yes they do Kay. The slave trade populated the Caribbean with Africans slaves.

On the Tesco thing: It's a nonsense. Recently we saw a playpen on line in blue that was £20....but the pink was was £25. I was thinking about screaming "sexist" (to get a discount!).

This might grind your gears.
http://www.thealphaparent.com/2012/04/sexism-and-early-learning-centre.html

 

[OldBlueLady]

This might grind your gears.
http://www.thealphaparent.com/2012/04/sexism-and-early-learning-centre.html

Oh my goodness, that's shocking!

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

They'll divide on a gender basis to discourage hand me-downs. If the eldest is a girl, you can't then give her pink toys to her younger brother etc.

 

[MK Shrimper]

This might grind your gears.
http://www.thealphaparent.com/2012/04/sexism-and-early-learning-centre.html

Opened my eyes a bit as I'm guilty of buying pink stuff.

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

Opened my eyes a bit as I'm guilty of buying pink stuff.

Shame on you sir, that cherry voltage kit was awful.

 

[Napster]

That's down simply to economics. There are statistically more girl babies being born than boys so for parents wanting to have one or the other playpen, there should theoretically be more pink ones sold hence more profit.

I thought I'd check this out. And you're wrong. According to the ONS, this is the data on births

In 2008, 708,000 babies were born. 362,000 were boys, 345,000 were girls.

This is the same trend for the previous 10 years, so statistically, more boys are born than girls.

The link is http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/vsob1/birth-statistics--england-and-wales--series-fm1-/no--37--2008/index.html

I hate to disprove a "fact".

 

[OldBlueLady]

I thought I'd check this out. And you're wrong. According to the ONS, this is the data on births

In 2008, 708,000 babies were born. 362,000 were boys, 345,000 were girls.

This is the same trend for the previous 10 years, so statistically, more boys are born than girls.

The link is http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/vsob1...nd-wales--series-fm1-/no--37--2008/index.html

I hate to disprove a "fact".

That is only a check on UK figures, I think, if you do a world wide check, you might find that's not the case. I admit that it's not something I know myself as being a fact, but it's something that I've heard many times from various different sources, and this would seem to bear it out in the US..
http://www.redorbit.com/news/science/1412472/declining_male_birth_rate_baffles_scientists/

 

[Napster]

That is only a check on UK figures, I think, if you do a world wide check, you might find that's not the case. I admit that it's not something I know myself as being a fact, but it's something that I've heard many times from various different sources, and this would seem to bear it out in the US..
http://www.redorbit.com/news/science/1412472/declining_male_birth_rate_baffles_scientists/

http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/anecdotal

 

[Napster]

That is only a check on UK figures, I think, if you do a world wide check, you might find that's not the case. I admit that it's not something I know myself as being a fact, but it's something that I've heard many times from various different sources, and this would seem to bear it out in the US..
http://www.redorbit.com/news/science/1412472/declining_male_birth_rate_baffles_scientists/

Oh, here's the global stuff.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_ratio

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_sex_ratio

:winking:

 

[Rusty Shackleford]

John Terry is innocent of any crime because he played well in the Euros. Anton Ferdinand wasn't even a possibility for selection so he can go and **** himself.

 

[Napster]

That is only a check on UK figures, I think, if you do a world wide check, you might find that's not the case. I admit that it's not something I know myself as being a fact, but it's something that I've heard many times from various different sources, and this would seem to bear it out in the US..
http://www.redorbit.com/news/science/1412472/declining_male_birth_rate_baffles_scientists/

I hate destroying arguments.

But your whole argument was based on a UK store selling to the UK population, so the UK data is relevant.

 

[davewebbsbrain]

John Terry is innocent of any crime because he played well in the Euros. Anton Ferdinand wasn't even a possibility for selection so he can go and **** himself.

Thats debatable


He loves a bit of glory tho

 

[OldBlueLady]

I hate destroying arguments.

But your whole argument was based on a UK store selling to the UK population, so the UK data is relevant.

This is totally irrelevant to the thread, but I'm so pleased you've been able to prove your point. I was only saying, anecdotally, you're quite correct, what I understood to be the case, and which, incidentally, seems to have been the case in every one of the three different educational establishment I've worked in.

The link to the US article seemed to back my theory up, and to my mind, makes quite a good deal of sense.

 

[Pubey]

This is totally irrelevant to the thread, but I'm so pleased you've been able to prove your point. I was only saying, anecdotally, you're quite correct, what I understood to be the case, and which, incidentally, seems to have been the case in every one of the three different educational establishment I've worked in.

The link to the US article seemed to back my theory up, and to my mind, makes quite a good deal of sense.

Don't misuse the word fact then. As a teacher (kind of) I thought you'd know better