Orange jacketed Supervisor, east stand!

Jai · Dec 19, 2020

SARF said:
Death toll this year is no bigger than any other year. . Something will get you.

Not just about the death toll though is it? There's a lot of uncertainty about the long-term effects. even if you're asymptomatic. Scientific evidence of permanent heart and lung damage, and of course the unique situation where you can spread the infection without showing symptoms.

The death toll is one measure, but there's plenty other factors to be considered.

Holy Joe · Dec 19, 2020

SARF said:
Death toll this year is no bigger than any other year. . Something will get you.

The first part isn't true. Around 60k excess deaths in UK.

In England there's around 20% more deaths so far this year

borientater · Dec 19, 2020

What you’ve got to remember is no one is forcing anyone to go to a football match , it’s meant to be an enjoyable experience therefore I won’t be going to watch any games whilst having to wear a mask. Fortunately I’ve got other things in my life other than SUFC which are far more important to me,if I can’t mix with my fellow fans and enjoy the day what’s the point ?

RHB · Dec 19, 2020

borientater said:
What you’ve got to remember is no one is forcing anyone to go to a football match , it’s meant to be an enjoyable experience therefore I won’t be going to watch any games whilst having to wear a mask. Fortunately I’ve got other things in my life other than SUFC which are far more important to me,if I can’t mix with my fellow fans and enjoy the day what’s the point ?

I respect your views on this totally, but Mrs Roots and I came out of Roots hall on Saturday and Tuesday and I felt as happy as a dog with two dickies, and whilst we can't now go to watch Col U, those two wins lifted us both with a dose of semi normality. So each to their own I guess. I still nodded to blokes that I've been nodding to for years as well. Maybe one day I'll talk to them as well!

Richard Hearn · Dec 19, 2020

MattE said:
The first part isn't true. Around 60k excess deaths in UK.

In England there's around 20% more deaths so far this year

View attachment 13714

Figures from Public Health England a body so inept and untrustworthy that even Matt Halfcock has axed it. Look at the figures from the Office of National Statistics and you might see a different story.

borientater · Dec 19, 2020

Rootshallbloke said:
I respect your views on this totally, but Mrs Roots and I came out of Roots hall on Saturday and Tuesday and I felt as happy as a dog with two dickies, and whilst we can't now go to watch Col U, those two wins lifted us both with a dose of semi normality. So each to their own I guess. I still nodded to blokes that I've been nodding to for years as well. Maybe one day I'll talk to them as well!

Totally understand what you say and mean , guess what I really meant is if you are still going then don’t moan about having to follow the rules because nobody is forcing you to go. Football for me has always been about the fans and the whole experience win or lose

RHB · Dec 19, 2020

borientater said:
Totally understand what you say and mean , guess what I really meant is if you are still going then don’t moan about having to follow the rules because nobody is forcing you to go. Football for me has always been about the fans and the whole experience win or lose

No Discussing from me mate, not at all, nobody would hear me with my mask fully on anyway.?

Holy Joe · Dec 19, 2020

seenyeva kryevyetka said:
Figures from Public Health England a body so inept and untrustworthy that even Matt Halfcock has axed it. Look at the figures from the Office of National Statistics and you might see a different story.

PHE are using data from ONS according to the footnote on the graph

Holy Joe · Dec 19, 2020

MattE said:
PHE are using data from ONS according to the footnote on the graph

seenyeva kryevyetka said:
Figures from Public Health England a body so inept and untrustworthy that even Matt Halfcock has axed it. Look at the figures from the Office of National Statistics and you might see a different story.

I've checked the ONS website - the data isn't as clear as the PHE, but it's clear that deaths are much higher than the 5 yr average for the majority of the periods this year - so I wouldn't conclude that the PHE data showing >60k excess deaths - or around 20% additional deaths is inaccurate

Sandbach Shrimper · Dec 20, 2020

hadenoughblue said:
And Covid, yummy...........

That's unlikely if you're outside and 'socially distanced'... Anyway, masks clearly aren't having much of an impact in stopping the spread. https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/do-masks-stop-the-spread-of-covid-19-

Yorkshire Blue · Dec 20, 2020

SARF said:
Death toll this year is no bigger than any other year.

Even if this was actually true, we’ve spent much of the year under restrictions which will have limited deaths - both COVID related and non-COVID related (eg fewer fatal car accidents).

blueblueblue · Dec 20, 2020

Yorkshire Blue said:
Even if this was true, we’ve spent much of the year under restrictions which will have limited deaths - both COVID related and non-COVID related (eg fewer fatal car accidents).

All of a sudden people are experts on death rates in the UK and have become scientist. All I know 500+ people are dying from this every day in the UK and that's enough for me, to take it serious.

Holy Joe · Dec 20, 2020

shrimpboy said:
That's unlikely if you're outside and 'socially distanced'... Anyway, masks clearly aren't having much of an impact in stopping the spread. https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/do-masks-stop-the-spread-of-covid-19-

That looks at masks protecting the wearer - is there any evidence they do not reduce the risk of transmission, ie, the wearer of the mask infecting others?

rigsby · Dec 21, 2020

Yorkshire Blue said:
Even if this was actually true, we’ve spent much of the year under restrictions which will have limited deaths - both COVID related and non-COVID related (eg fewer fatal car accidents).

Which will be balanced up by an increase in other deaths because of cancellations in the NHS, suicides or someone having a heart attack home alone instead of at work.

RHB · Dec 21, 2020

MattE said:
That looks at masks protecting the wearer - is there any evidence they do not reduce the risk of transmission, ie, the wearer of the mask infecting others?

There is plenty of evidence that wearing a mask can reduce the risk of the wearer infecting someone else (especially if the 'receiver' is also wearing a mask. As I posted earlier, John Hopkins Hospital in the states has published loads of credible evidence to that fact. However, there are some that refuse to change their position, regardless of evidence as it doesn't suit their argument, and therefore debate is probably a complete waste of time.

Napster · Dec 21, 2020

rigsby said:
Which will be balanced up by an increase in other deaths because of cancellations in the NHS, suicides or someone having a heart attack home alone instead of at work.

suicide: https://www.newscientist.com/articl...-when-talking-about-suicide-and-the-pandemic/

Holy Joe · Dec 21, 2020

Rootshallbloke said:
There is plenty of evidence that wearing a mask can reduce the risk of the wearer infecting someone else (especially if the 'receiver' is also wearing a mask. As I posted earlier, John Hopkins Hospital in the states has published loads of credible evidence to that fact. However, there are some that refuse to change their position, regardless of evidence as it doesn't suit their argument, and therefore debate is probably a complete waste of time.

Yep - saw this earlier - rings a few bells...

How should you talk to friends and relatives who believe conspiracy theories?

Advice from experts and those who used to believe conspiracy theories about how to avoid rows this festive season.

www.bbc.co.uk

Stuart W · Dec 21, 2020

i am still waiting each evening for the news to provide daily death figures for cancers, heart attacks, strokes, dementia and road deaths.

Lord Football · Dec 21, 2020

Stuart W said:
i am still waiting each evening for the news to provide daily death figures for cancers, heart attacks, strokes, dementia and road deaths.

Why? We've lived with all those for years. We can plan for them. What we've not lived with is a virus that kills and in doing so cripples the NHS. Not just here, but across the globe.

Globally we've not seen anything like this since the 1918 Spanish Flu.

Stuart W · Dec 21, 2020

Lord Football said:
Why? We've lived with all those for years. We can plan for them. What we've not lived with is a virus that kills and in doing so cripples the NHS. Not just here, but across the globe.

Globally we've not seen anything like this since the 1918 Spanish Flu.

Fundamentally missing my point.
BBC and Sky in particular seem to take great satisfaction in plastering statistics about Covid deaths (although they don't seem to understand the difference between deaths FROM Covid and deaths WITH Covid). Be that as it may, they also reel off the so-called Excess deaths over and above a five year average. This excess deaths will include a significant proportion of deaths from cancers and heart attacks indirectly attributed to lack of attention given by the NHS to these conditions since March.
That is also why I find your sentence "we can plan for them" puzzling. We absolutely can't.