So IDS thinks he can live on £53/week?

[applelover]

I started a previous thread to set out my opposition to these cuts but IDS's comments deserve a mention.

Loving the petition

https://www.change.org/en-GB/petiti...-iain-duncan-smith-to-live-on-53-a-week#share

Please sign up :)

 

[steveo]

You missed the key part: "[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif] "If I had to, I would."[/FONT]

[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]He doesn't have to, so he won't.[/FONT]

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

I started a previous thread to set out my opposition to these cuts but IDS's comments deserve a mention.

Loving the petition

https://www.change.org/en-GB/petiti...-iain-duncan-smith-to-live-on-53-a-week#share

Please sign up :)

Done.:thumbsup:

 

[Pubey]

all MP's should earn £53pw, to prove that it's possible for people to survive on it and to prove that they have the poorest and most vulnerable at the heart of government.

 

[DTS]

The key point you seem to have missed is that he does not have to as he has worked hard and got a good job.

 

[A Century United]

The key point you seem to have missed is that he does not have to as he comes from a well-off RAF family, lied about his education, failed to get past the rank of Lieutenant in the Army, married the daughter of a wealthy Baron and lives in a house on her dad's Estate, and got given Norman Tebbit's safest of safe seats when The Chingford Skinhead retired.

Corrected for you. The key point you are missing, DTS, is that the "Benefit Claimant" who is left with £53 pw after housing costs is running not one but two self-employed businesses which he is struggling to get off the ground in the current economic climate, and has lost money from the latest round of benefit cuts and taxes, so not an idle loafer unprepared to lift a finger to help himself.

The idiocy of IDS's comment is underlined by the fact that there are now 300,000 signatures on the petition urging him to live on £53 pw for a year.

 

[DTS]

Corrected for you. The key point you are missing, DTS, is that the "Benefit Claimant" who is left with £53 pw after housing costs is running not one but two self-employed businesses which he is struggling to get off the ground in the current economic climate, and has lost money from the latest round of benefit cuts and taxes, so not an idle loafer unprepared to lift a finger to help himself.

The idiocy of IDS's comment is underlined by the fact that there are now 300,000 signatures on the petition urging him to live on £53 pw for a year.

If said person is running two business and still able to claim benefits then I think you have to question if they are really cut out for self employment. What about the thousands of people that don't work at all? Should we pity them too and support them.

I like the way naturally IDS is a complete waste of space who has been handed everything on a plate. It couldn't just be that he had a privileged back ground and yet he has still done well. But of course that would not be very British to congratulate him would it instead let's bash him for having money in his family.

You mention his failings person yet you fail to mention his after dinner speaking business which has netted him hundreds of thousands of pounds, You don't mention that he himself had to claim benefits after leaving the army yet he worked himself up despite a number of setbacks to a member of a board of a major publishing firm and he was part of the think tank that got rid of the need to retire at 65. Guess none of these suited your argument though as he is just a rich boy after all.

He is far from perfect but I hate the way anyone with money that does well is panned as they had money in the first place. Why not pan the people that have money and achieve nothing. Or even god forbid the people that choose not to work as a lifestyle choice.


The fact 300,000 people have signed this petition shows me little more than the number of people that are probably going to loose out on there fag money as a result of this cut.

 

[Davros]

You missed the key part: "[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif] "If I had to, I would."[/FONT]

Indeed

I don't see anything wrong with what he said. its a bit like asking someone... "if you were stranded on a desert island for a week, would you survive?". What else are you going to say if you fancy yourself as a bit of a survivalist? I'd rather an MP say he would try and hack it, rather than saying they couldn't.

I note in one of yesterdays papers that IDS was once unemployed for 3 months, and chose not to claim JSA, despite having, i would imagine, a sizeable mortgage... probably because he had savings etc... but then again, should he be frowned upon for having savings?

 

[superblue24]

Don't like £53 per week? Solution is simple.....I'll give you a few clues:

https://www.gov.uk/contact-jobcentre-plus
http://www.monster.co.uk/
http://www.jobserve.com/gb/en/Job-Search/
http://www.totaljobs.com/
http://www.fish4.co.uk/

No joy there and I'll send another 200 links.....

 

[Napster]

Indeed

I don't see anything wrong with what he said. its a bit like asking someone... "if you were stranded on a desert island for a week, would you survive?". What else are you going to say if you fancy yourself as a bit of a survivalist? I'd rather an MP say he would try and hack it, rather than saying they couldn't.

I note in one of yesterdays papers that IDS was once unemployed for 3 months, and chose not to claim JSA, despite having, i would imagine, a sizeable mortgage... probably because he had savings etc... but then again, should he be frowned upon for having savings?

I've been unemployed and had to rely on the dole when I graduated. But I just rolled my sleeves up and got on with it.

ps I've also had to live on very little and it is possible, even with a family of 4.

 

[A Century United]

If said person is running two business and still able to claim benefits then I think you have to question if they are really cut out for self employment. What about the thousands of people that don't work at all? Should we pity them too and support them.

I like the way naturally IDS is a complete waste of space who has been handed everything on a plate. It couldn't just be that he had a privileged back ground and yet he has still done well. But of course that would not be very British to congratulate him would it instead let's bash him for having money in his family.

You mention his failings person yet you fail to mention his after dinner speaking business which has netted him hundreds of thousands of pounds, You don't mention that he himself had to claim benefits after leaving the army yet he worked himself up despite a number of setbacks to a member of a board of a major publishing firm and he was part of the think tank that got rid of the need to retire at 65. Guess none of these suited your argument though as he is just a rich boy after all.

He is far from perfect but I hate the way anyone with money that does well is panned as they had money in the first place. Why not pan the people that have money and achieve nothing. Or even god forbid the people that choose not to work as a lifestyle choice.


The fact 300,000 people have signed this petition shows me little more than the number of people that are probably going to loose out on there fag money as a result of this cut.

Unfortunately any debate on Wefare/Benefits rapidly descends into an exchange of clichéd arguments. Your response to the point made was the assumption that the claimant in question was some sort of work shy scrounger winging about his lot (which he is not - like 9 out of 10 people receiving some sort of Benefit he is working) so I responded with the Traditional "IDS Silver Spoon Rich Dad in Law Privileged Toff" retort.

Actually, as John Bird the founder of the Big Issue magazine was pointing out in the Times yesterday: "...we are now stuck in a myopic debate about whether (IDS) can get by on £53." His article is well worth reading, and does what is badly needed - moves away from sterile taunts into discussion of how this situation has arisen, and what to do about it.

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/opinion/columnists/article3729400.ece

Unfortunately you need to subscribe to read the full article, but if anyone is interested in his point of view, PM me and I will do my best to précis it for you.

 

[Neil_F]

It makes it that much harder when someone doesn't even know how much money they have to live on:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/pol...et-trader-who-challenged-IDS-on-benefits.html

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

all MP's should earn £53pw, to prove that it's possible for people to survive on it and to prove that they have the poorest and most vulnerable at the heart of government.

I'm all for performance related pay, but this is something so flawed I'd expect Barna to have come up with it.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

I'm all for performance related pay, but this is something so flawed I'd expect Barna to have come up with it.

On the contrary it's a good example of Pubey's economic illiteracy.

 

[steveo]

Done.:thumbsup:

Will you be withdrawing that then?

 

[Pubey]

I'm all for performance related pay, but this is something so flawed I'd expect Barna to have come up with it.

It was a drunken and throwaway comment.

On the contrary it's a good example of Pubey's economic illiteracy.

Coming from you, I'll take that as a complement. Seeing as I'm an academic economist at a decent university I'd argue I'm pretty literate when it comes to economics - I'd happily admit I'm not a macroeconomist and not particularly interested in politics. I'm also more than happy to admit when I'm wrong or when I don't know something... perhaps you should be willing to do the same?

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

It was a drunken and throwaway comment.


Coming from you, I'll take that as a complement. Seeing as I'm an academic economist at a decent university I'd argue I'm pretty literate when it comes to economics - I'd happily admit I'm not a macroeconomist and not particularly interested in politics. I'm also more than happy to admit when I'm wrong or when I don't know something... perhaps you should be willing to do the same?

I'm happy to admit that I'm not an academic economist but I do take a keen interest in current political and economic affairs.

I've also learned (to my cost) not to make knee-jerk,throwaway comments on SZ.

(Like you) "I'm also happy to admit when I'm wrong or when I don't know something."

Can't say I've seen much evidence of this in your particular case though.

 

[steveo]

I've also learned (to my cost) not to make knee-jerk,throwaway comment on SZ.

But not to make knee jerk signatures to petitions that are not quite what they appear to be then?

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

But not to make knee jerk signatures to petitions that are not quite what they appear to be then?

On the contary,I'd already looked online to find the petition link yesterday but couldn't see it anywhere.

 

[steveo]

Done.

That's odd then. So you signed something you couldnt find?