• Welcome to the ShrimperZone forums.
    You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which only gives you limited access.

    Existing Users:.
    Please log-in using your existing username and password. If you have any problems, please see below.

    New Users:
    Join our free community now and gain access to post topics, communicate privately with other members, respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and free. Click here to join.

    Fans from other clubs
    We welcome and appreciate supporters from other clubs who wish to engage in sensible discussion. Please feel free to join as above but understand that this is a moderated site and those who cannot play nicely will be quickly removed.

    Assistance Required
    For help with the registration process or accessing your account, please send a note using the Contact us link in the footer, please include your account name. We can then provide you with a new password and verification to get you on the site.

Some questions on scouting.

harveyoe

Authorised rep of the small moronic minority
Joined
Nov 21, 2017
Messages
154
There has been a lot of recent talk about scouting and about beefing up our scouting network.

This has led me back to something which has bothered me on and off over the years. I have to confess to total ignorance of the scouting system and how it works.

Are scouts employees of the club?

Are they freelance, in which case how do they get paid?

Do they randomly just watch as many games as possible or are they asked/told to go and watch and report on a particular player.

As a fan I guess I have no need to know any of this, but I would be interested.

I'm hoping that there will be someone on here who knows exactly how it all works and can enlighten me.

For clarity, I'm talking about the sort of scouts who identify players rather than those who watch future opponents. I accept that some may do both.

For further clarity, I'm not talking about Boy Scouts, or these days I guess Girl Scouts. In fact I'm not even sure that girl scouts would be correct, perhaps scouts of the female persuasion. ( Scouts sans willys possibly). Anyway, I'm sure you will know what I mean.
 

Barry.C

Manager⭐
Joined
Jul 9, 2011
Messages
3,455
Location
Gillingham
I dont know how many informal scouts we have. or indeed our current full and complete structure, given recent events

However I understand that scouts can undertake a range of tasks from scouting players to scouting opposition.

One good place to start is the PFSA web site. The prof Football Association for scouting

The site is there to train scouts. You could become one

Here you can read about the 3 levels of training and all the various training elements, IUt offers good technical insight

Some clubs in this league use supporters to assist in the task !!
 

harveyoe

Authorised rep of the small moronic minority
Joined
Nov 21, 2017
Messages
154
Thanks, I will go and have a look at the site.

I think I'm too old to consider starting a new career as a scout, it was more a case of just idle curiosity.
 

harveyoe

Authorised rep of the small moronic minority
Joined
Nov 21, 2017
Messages
154
Try the Nowhere Men by Michael Calvin. Brilliant read about scouting - we even get a mention.
Thanks for the tip. I've just ordered a copy via Amazon. Sounds interesting.
 

Strykr

Manager
Joined
May 19, 2008
Messages
4,612
Location
Eastbored
Is it not the case that all the big clubs have massive dossiers of decent players from about 5 years old and up? I would have thought it impossible to just pop to a random game and discover a gem that nowone knows about.
 

harveyoe

Authorised rep of the small moronic minority
Joined
Nov 21, 2017
Messages
154
Is it not the case that all the big clubs have massive dossiers of decent players from about 5 years old and up? I would have thought it impossible to just pop to a random game and discover a gem that nowone knows about.
I suspect that you are correct. It wouldn't surprise me at all if big clubs kept such extensive dossiers.

When talking about hidden gems though, we have to realise our level. A player who could be a gem for us may be of no interest to the bigger cubs.
 

gatecrasher

Newbie
Joined
Aug 8, 2010
Messages
719
I've scouted for a league team in the past and was paid expenses but that was it. In the bigger clubs they will hire some full time and a head scout at a prem club can make some very tidy bunts
 

harveyoe

Authorised rep of the small moronic minority
Joined
Nov 21, 2017
Messages
154
I've scouted for a league team in the past and was paid expenses but that was it. In the bigger clubs they will hire some full time and a head scout at a prem club can make some very tidy bunts
So at our sort of level, scouts would probably not be paid, other than expenses as you say.
In that case then the only people likely to do it would be fans of the club concerned. Would that be right, or am I missing something?
 

gatecrasher

Newbie
Joined
Aug 8, 2010
Messages
719
So at our sort of level, scouts would probably not be paid, other than expenses as you say.
In that case then the only people likely to do it would be fans of the club concerned. Would that be right, or am I missing something?
Fans have been used, clubs prefer the person to usually have a qualification through which ever leagues governing body or have experience of doing so in the past- even if that has been at a local level
 

fredheim_holm

Where art thou Tes
Joined
Mar 3, 2006
Messages
8,149
Location
London
So at our sort of level, scouts would probably not be paid, other than expenses as you say.
In that case then the only people likely to do it would be fans of the club concerned. Would that be right, or am I missing something?
I'm intrigued how much we're paying John Still's network of scouts he's bringing along or if they're mostly expenses only and just follow him due to loyalty and reputation:

"I don’t know what has gone on before, but I can bring in selected scouts that have worked for me for years that will come and work for Southend. Scouts that have found me some unbelievable players. I hope they will find the same for Kev.”
 

Yorkshire Blue

Super Moderator⭐
Staff member
Joined
Oct 27, 2003
Messages
36,637
Location
London
So at our sort of level, scouts would probably not be paid, other than expenses as you say.
In that case then the only people likely to do it would be fans of the club concerned. Would that be right, or am I missing something?

There are plenty of people who like to watch live football in their spare time. Scouting for a club may mean they get free admission and their petrol money paid for something they may well have gone to anyway.
 

Whispering Bob

Striker
Joined
Nov 17, 2020
Messages
558
As far as the younger age groups are concerned I felt Southend United were always a tad lazy. A few years back they would ask certain clubs to attend show-case tournaments/friendlies at their bases in Chelmsford or the Chase. It galled me when I saw so much talent in my local area (East London/Metropolitan Essex borders) get hoovered up by the likes of Norwich, Ipswich and Peterborough.
 

rigsby

Life President⭐
Joined
Oct 12, 2014
Messages
14,597
As far as the younger age groups are concerned I felt Southend United were always a tad lazy. A few years back they would ask certain clubs to attend show-case tournaments/friendlies at their bases in Chelmsford or the Chase. It galled me when I saw so much talent in my local area (East London/Metropolitan Essex borders) get hoovered up by the likes of Norwich, Ipswich and Peterborough.
In around 1994 I was off work waiting for an operation and ended up helping out at Greensward school with PE as I was friends with local legend Tony Maskell.

Obviously things have improved, I hope but at the time Maidstone were in contact with him but not Southend. I was asked to look after Year 9? for after school football. In the first game a lad from Greensward stood out as a young Ryan Leonard type. No obvious tricks but good reading, energy and a real happy kid. Needless to say when I mention him to Tony he said Southend were aware but don't seem interested.

In the second game a lad from the opposition, one of the Benfleet schools, was even better. Looked like a young Nigel Clough. Not great pace but his awareness and selection of passing was outstanding. He mostly like to play his forwards in with well weighted passes that were almost to good for the lads in front of him.

At the end i asked their PE teacher about him and by chance his dad was one of only about 2 parents at the game. I had a good chat with the dad and asked if it was ok if I contacted Southend.....He Said " Thanks but your to late, Norwich looked at him last week and he signed at the weekend "
 

Napster

The Horse with no Name⭐
Joined
Oct 27, 2003
Messages
35,624
Location
The wilds of Kent
In around 1994 I was off work waiting for an operation and ended up helping out at Greensward school with PE as I was friends with local legend Tony Maskell.

Obviously things have improved, I hope but at the time Maidstone were in contact with him but not Southend. I was asked to look after Year 9? for after school football. In the first game a lad from Greensward stood out as a young Ryan Leonard type. No obvious tricks but good reading, energy and a real happy kid. Needless to say when I mention him to Tony he said Southend were aware but don't seem interested.

In the second game a lad from the opposition, one of the Benfleet schools, was even better. Looked like a young Nigel Clough. Not great pace but his awareness and selection of passing was outstanding. He mostly like to play his forwards in with well weighted passes that were almost to good for the lads in front of him.

At the end i asked their PE teacher about him and by chance his dad was one of only about 2 parents at the game. I had a good chat with the dad and asked if it was ok if I contacted Southend.....He Said " Thanks but your to late, Norwich looked at him last week and he signed at the weekend "
In 1994 we were in Tier 2 by the way. Two anecdotal examples are not exactly proof of us missing out on superstars.

ps around this time we did actually recruit decent youth, such as Spencer Prior.
 

MattE

Manager⭐
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
2,914
In around 1994 I was off work waiting for an operation and ended up helping out at Greensward school with PE as I was friends with local legend Tony Maskell.

Obviously things have improved, I hope but at the time Maidstone were in contact with him but not Southend. I was asked to look after Year 9? for after school football. In the first game a lad from Greensward stood out as a young Ryan Leonard type. No obvious tricks but good reading, energy and a real happy kid. Needless to say when I mention him to Tony he said Southend were aware but don't seem interested.

In the second game a lad from the opposition, one of the Benfleet schools, was even better. Looked like a young Nigel Clough. Not great pace but his awareness and selection of passing was outstanding. He mostly like to play his forwards in with well weighted passes that were almost to good for the lads in front of him.

At the end i asked their PE teacher about him and by chance his dad was one of only about 2 parents at the game. I had a good chat with the dad and asked if it was ok if I contacted Southend.....He Said " Thanks but your to late, Norwich looked at him last week and he signed at the weekend "
Who were the players? Did they go on to have a career in the game?
 

united we stand

Life President⭐
Joined
Dec 4, 2008
Messages
7,144
Location
Wickford
Not sure Individual examples prove a lot.
My son went to beauchamps in wickford. In his year two lads plaid for West Ham, one was their captain (u16’s).
Neither were caught by Southend , HOWEVER neither went on to have a career in football.
At the same time Southend academy have had a fair few lads from beauchamps in recent years come through the academy and go on to play for the first team.
Dan bentley
Harry phillips
Charlie sawyers
And I might be missing another

so based on that ridiculously small sample we are better at this than a premiership club.
 

MattE

Manager⭐
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
2,914
Not sure Individual examples prove a lot.
My son went to beauchamps in wickford. In his year two lads plaid for West Ham, one was their captain (u16’s).
Neither were caught by Southend , HOWEVER neither went on to have a career in football.
At the same time Southend academy have had a fair few lads from beauchamps in recent years come through the academy and go on to play for the first team.
Dan bentley
Harry phillips
Charlie sawyers
And I might be missing another

so based on that ridiculously small sample we are better at this than a premiership club.
Kenny Coker

And the other Wickford secondary, Bromfords, had Kelman and I'm sure some others
 
Top