Speeding on the M180 in to Grimsby

[Matt the Shrimp]

Quote[/b] (Technician @ May 13 2005,14:56)]Why is everyone trying to justify their illegal actions? The national speed limit on a motorway is 70mph! the fact that the law doesn't bat an eye-lid if you are doing 75-80mph (however briefly), is irrespective.

Argh, Techy.  Please read my e-mail properly.

I'm not trying to justify an illegal act.  I'm asking the far more basic question: why are these acts illegal?

Please read my posts before responding!!

Incidentally, from a law-makers' perspective, the fact that everyone ignores a law and a blind eye is turned is absolutely key.

Laws are designed for the protection of society.  If a society no longer believes that they need to be protected in a particular way, then that law has become outmoded and outdated.  It therefore needs to be changed.

In 1914, it was decided that pubs should shut at 11pm because it was contrary to the War effort.  Society needed pubs to close at that time.  Now, they don't.  In fact, society wants pubs to stay open longer.  So the rules have been bent - places showing live music can stay open longer.  Restaurants don't technically have licenced hours.  And eventually, neither will pubs.

Equally, a great deal of people drive at above 70 mph on motorways.  More than half, I'd wager.  That means that society is saying "we want this law to be changed."  So the fact that it is ignored by so many people makes it far more compelling that parliament is in the wrong for having failed to update the law, rather than millions of otherwise law-abiding citizens being wrong for failing to adhere to a speeding limit which is clearly past its sell-by date.

I agree, we don't have to go bananas.  Few, if any, would support a top motorway speed of much above 80-85mph.  So, make it (say) 85 mph, and then hammer people who break the law - rather than the current "grey area" (ooh, 10% for the inaccuracy of my speedo, 10% for the inaccuracy of the police's radar).  Make it 85 mph, and give 6 points to anyone found going over 90, and bans to anyone going over 100.

Oh, and finally, institute variable speed limits during rush hours - so that round the M25, M42, M1, M6, M4, M3, M27, M60, M62 and M.8 at rush-hour, you can drop the speed limit to 50 mph if traffic demands it.

That would be a lot clearer, a lot fairer and probably a lot safer (fewer people slamming on brakes whenever you see OB).

Here endeth the MtS party political broadcast.

 

[shrimperman]

superb. when the next election again?!

 

[Interpol Shrimper]

One of the reasons that 70mph will stay the limit on dual carriageways & motorways is that the police secretly are fairly OK with people doing say 80-85mph (whilst the conditions allow it).

However if the limit was raised to say 80, it's human nature that drivers would push so that travelling at 90+ became the norm. This would then cause problems as they would have to revisit their 10% error margins.

I do worry though, that we will end up in a society where the tax disc is chipped & this will trigger sensors at whatever junction you enter & exit a motorway so that they can then nick you for travelling 100 miles in 1hr 15 mins or whatever!

 

[Firestorm]

Quote[/b] (Shrimp in a Kilt @ May 13 2005,15:09)]

Quote[/b] ]Oops 2.45 hours not 2 hours 45 minutes damn calculator.

I applied the stop to the only journey which took longer that 2 hours as  the recomendations are a stop every 2 hours and it was tongue in cheek............

From my bike riding days, over 80 mph was tongue half way down my windpipe, not in my cheek...  

Quote[/b] ]Peronally, I dislike the emphasis on speed being the killer.
It is poor driving which kills.
What is to blame for someone going round a corner too fast? The speed or the incompetance of the driver who chooses to take the cornewr too fast for his or his cars ability.
Speed doesn't kill ...ar****les who can't drive fast sensibly do.

Yes and no. The problem is that everyone who drives fast thinks that they are a safe driver, and therefore it is acceptable to speed because of their superior skill. The trouble is that they routinely overestimate the extent of that skill, and get into a habit of driving fast. And it is when they involve other people in the results of this misjudgement that it becomes unacceptable. 85% of drivers feel that they are in the top 10% of drivers on the road. Almost all of them are wrong.*










Except me, of course!  

>>From my bike riding days, over 80 mph was tongue half way down my windpipe, not in my cheek...

<<

Blimey I need to get above 80 just to take the strain off my wrists

I do not think of myself as a particularly good car driver , combined with a 1.2 motor means that I don't get alot over 70-75 very often, and if I do its is always on three lanes roads.
I am however more comfortable on a bike, but as I generally have the wife on the back (which does upset the set up a little bit) I don't go too mental .
Me , on my own on the firestorm....hmmm thats another topic.

 

[General Easterly]

As someone who lives in Richard Brunstrom territory, I am obliged to say that speed kills and all drivers are evil

However, I fully agree that the speed limit of 70 on motorways when there&#39;s no traffic (see M40 past J5 most afternoons) is ridiculous. I would fully support variable speed limits, having travelled round the M25 on numerous occassions in the past, the VSL section always tends to keep moving even in heavy traffic, because people aren&#39;t braking as much, which incidentally, is the reason why we get traffic jams for no reason other than sheer weight of traffic.

As we seem to be about to go metric

this would serve as the perfect time to adjust our speed limits accordingly, perhaps along the lines of the French system where you lower the speed limit automatically in bad weather.

Also with a removal of the police cash points, sorry road safety cameras, along the M4 and at places where they are blatently acting as a cash generator, the A127 just as you enter and leave Southend (I assume there still there), and a stricter enforcement of the the revised limits with REAL policemen, not cameras.

Here endeth the sermon.

 

[* ORM *]

Quote[/b] (General Easterly @ May 13 2005,17:46)]Also with a removal of the police cash points, sorry road safety cameras, along the M4 and at places where they are blatently acting as a cash generator, the A127 just as you enter and leave Southend (I assume there still there), and a stricter enforcement of the the revised limits with REAL policemen, not cameras.

I&#39;m pretty confident in saying that most of the speed cameras eastbound on the A127 are around proven accident blackspots, with enough fatalities in recent years to fully justify them; namely those just before the Progress Road, Kent Elms and Bell junctions. Remember many people are entering the borough of Southend after tens, possibly hundreds of miles on M-Ways and dual carriageways.

The camera westbound on the A127 about 100 metres before the National Speed Limit is a bit off though.

 

[Technician]

Quote[/b] (glasgowsufc @ May 13 2005,15:43)]However if the limit was raised to say 80, it&#39;s human nature that drivers would push so that travelling at 90+ became the norm. This would then cause problems as they would have to revisit their 10% error margins.

Good point.

The fact remains that 70mph is more than adequate for a motorway and a dual carriagway, so why do people (well over half, I would say) feel the need to exceed this? what do they achieve? it&#39;s not big&#33; it&#39;s not clever&#33; and there are undoubtedly loads of graveyards full of people who would possibly still be alive but for someone elses belief that they are in control when using excessive speed.

My pet hate, is those people who come up behind you at a rate of knots, flash you up and expect you to get out of the way... If they have no respect for my driving, why should I have any respect for theirs?

 

[Clickety Clique]

Well I guess you would be driving to the Highway code which would mean you would be in the inside lane rather than in the middle lane or outside lane which are meant only for overtaking. And surely these people would be able to use this to go past you. Unless of course you are telling me that you are not sticking to the highway code.

Quote[/b] ]238: You should drive in the left-hand lane if the road ahead is clear. If you are overtaking a number of slower moving vehicles it may be safer to remain in the centre or outer lanes until the manoeuvre is completed rather than continually changing lanes. Return to the left-hand lane once you have overtaken all the vehicles or if you are delaying traffic behind you. Slow moving or speed restricted vehicles should always remain in the left-hand lane of the carriageway unless overtaking. You MUST NOT drive on the hard shoulder except in an emergency or if directed to do so by signs.

 

[chadded]

Do the simple thing and get a pedal bike. I&#39;d be fairly confident of *** whooping anyone around South East Essex on my mountain bike, against a car, and thats speaking from experience.

And you can&#39;t get done for speeding (by fixed cameras anyway

)

 

[Guest]

&quot;The camera westbound on the A127 about 100 metres before the National Speed Limit is a bit off though&quot;

ORM - This camera was only put up after a couple of people were killed a few years ago. A car heading west at night went straight over the crash barrier and into an oncoming car.

Heading out of Southend this morning going past this camera, realised I was going at about 44mph so had to brake sharpish...

 

[Perth Bambi]

How can people moan about not getting warnings about when mobile cameras are coming up.
Mobile cameras aren&#39;t there as a general rule to stop you speeding on that part of the road just for you to burn it off after you have gone past.
Maybe the police do make money out of them but if drivers keep to the law everywhere rather then just when they see a mobile camera they wont have to moan when they get fined.
If you play with fire you are going to get burned.
Don&#39;t speed anywhere and you wont get fined anywhere.

 

[Taunton_Shrimp]

I was on the M180 about 12:30 and i saw the mobile van, i noticed it when i was doing about 80mph trying to keep up following another shrimper as i didnt have any directions to the ground. I havent had a ticket yet but i am bricking it as i already have 9 points. The worst bit is 6 point come off my licencse on the 30th may so i may end up with 12 points for about 2 weeks which could mean a ban, lucky its happened at the end of the season.

 

[southend4ever]

appropriate pic for it

 

[* ORM *]

Quote[/b] (Guest @ May 14 2005,18:38)]&quot;The camera westbound on the A127 about 100 metres before the National Speed Limit is a bit off though&quot;

ORM - This camera was only put up after a couple of people were killed a few years ago. A car heading west at night went straight over the crash barrier and into an oncoming car.

Heading out of Southend this morning going past this camera, realised I was going at about 44mph so had to brake sharpish...

Excellent cheers.

I didn&#39;t know about this but there have been enough at Kent Elms and Progress Road to make the cameras there no brainers and the Bell has had a number of pedestrian fatalities over the years. .

As I said in my first post I have no argument with cameras in accident blackspots.