Turkey:Part of Europe or the Middle East?

[stoy_redstar]

Hmmm. By that logic, England should be part of the Middle East. :hilarious:

That said a large amount of Serbians and Croatians are Muslim, so their religion should have no bearing. Clearly, it is both. That's geography for you. Russia is 30 miles or so from the USA, but is part of Europe..

Erm....are they? I can pretty much guarantee that 95% of Serbs are funnily enough Serb Orthodox. The only Serbian territory that has any significant Muslim population is Kosovo. And I think you will find Croatia is 95% Roman Catholic, the other 5% being Orthodox. Major Muslim population in the region is only found in Bosnia and Albania (saying that most Albanians seem to be in the UK after claiming they are Kosovan refugees)

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Having spent many holidays on the Greek island of Kos , which is a short boat crossing from Bodrum I have several times gone on day-trips to Turkey and have noticed the difference between the European Greece and the less civilised Turkey.

European ? No chance !

Ken,
You have the advantage over me here, in that I've never actually visited Turkey, even for a day-trip, though I intend to get to Istanbul at least,some day.
FWIW, I think Neil F is right on this one.I'm sure,like him, that Turkey will eventually be admitted into the EU, despite strong oppostion from Germany and France.However this is unlikely to happen anytime soon,IMO.
As for Turkey not being European, I can remember thinking how backwards Spain was compared to the rest of Europe, when I first came here to work in the late 70's.Since then, and especially after Spain's entry into the EU in 1986, Spain has tranformed itself into a modern European country with an infrastructure far better than that of the UK.

 

[McNasty]

Ken,
You have the advantage over me here, in that I've never actually visited Turkey, even for a day-trip, though I intend to get to Istanbul at least,some day.
FWIW, I think Neil F is right on this one.I'm sure,like him, that Turkey will eventually be admitted into the EU, despite strong oppostion from Germany and France.However this is unlikely to happen anytime soon,IMO.
As for Turkey not being European, I can remember thinking how backwards Spain was compared to the rest of Europe, when I first came here to work in the late 70's.Since then, and especially after Spain's entry into the EU in 1986, Spain has tranformed itself into a modern European country with an infrastructure far better than that of the UK.

BB, I might be biased as a) my Greek friends absolutely detest the Turks and b) on my first visit I went through the passport control "£10 please Meester English person" to see a guy whipping his camel very harshly. --- most un-impressed.

 

[MK Shrimper]

b) on my first visit I went through the passport control "£10 please Meester English person" to see a guy whipping his camel very harshly. --- most un-impressed.

You'd pay much more in certain bars in Amsterdam mate.......so I'm told....:unsure:

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

Having spent many holidays on the Greek island of Kos , which is a short boat crossing from Bodrum I have several times gone on day-trips to Turkey and have noticed the difference between the European Greece and the less civilised Turkey.

European ? No chance !

Having spent many years living in the holiday resort of Southend, I have several times gone on day-trips to Colchester and have noticed the difference between Southend and the less civilised Colchester.

FWIW Ephesus ***** all over Colchester as far as Roman towns go.

 

[Napster]

I've been to Turkey, worked with Turkish companies and people, and have absolutely no hesitation in saying I would welcome them to Europe wholeheartedly. They have better diplomatic links with Asia and the M.East; they have a better growing economy - and they beat up Leeds fans. all good in my book.

 

[EastStandBlue]

They have better diplomatic links with Asia and the M.East; they have a better growing economy - and they beat up Leeds fans. all good in my book.

Forgetting the growing economy, I think you've just described Bradford.

 

[MK Shrimper]

and they beat up Leeds fans. all good in my book.

Bit tactless seeing as two were stabbed to death.

 

[Rayleigh Weir]

Can Turkey not be a part of both? Turkey (and particularly Istanbul/Constantinople) is often viewed as the gateway/bridge to both regions. Surely geography is not an issue? With regards to membership of the EU, does Turkey meet the entry criteria in terms of economic viability and human rights? It's been a secular state for some time (20s or 30s), with laws in place to protect the religious freedom of it's people. Quite how this sits with the persecution of the Kurdish folk though I'm not sure - it seems similar to the double standards in many European countries of preaching religious freedom and then persecuting the various Gypsy groups - I guess that means they'll fit right in...

 

[Napster]

Bit tactless seeing as two were stabbed to death.

Only a bit? :smiles:

 

[canveyshrimper]

I've always had a certain antipathy towards Turks having been on holiday in Cyprus in 1974 when the ****ers invaded. I can tell you it's no fun having a swarthy Turkish paratrooper poke a Kalashnikov in your ribs in the mistaken belief I was Archbishop Makarios.

Turkey is both Europe & Asia, but also an integral part of NATO particularly given the current situation in Libya. It's a matter of time before Turkey will join the EU, and if Israel can be in the Eurovision Song Contest and various football competitions then why not Turkey in the EU.

 

[MK Shrimper]

Only a bit? :smiles:

Lol, you're forgiven :smile: Green rep will be restored when I can.

 

[chadded]

Erm....are they? I can pretty much guarantee that 95% of Serbs are funnily enough Serb Orthodox. The only Serbian territory that has any significant Muslim population is Kosovo. And I think you will find Croatia is 95% Roman Catholic, the other 5% being Orthodox. Major Muslim population in the region is only found in Bosnia and Albania (saying that most Albanians seem to be in the UK after claiming they are Kosovan refugees)

Close enough though :raspberry:

 

[sosman]

I haven't read the Koran, but a few people that have obviously found it to be a real blast. I don't suppose you have an encyclopaedic view of 'The Wealth of Nations' or The New Testament, but I'm sure it wouldn't stop you from adopting your sneering tone when discussing the free market or Christian beliefs.



If these were cultural issues, then why don't Hindus, Christians, Jews and Buddhists go around decapitating infants in the name of their religion?

I’ll leave the sneering to you. You’re very good at it.

What you’re not so good at is talking about things on the basis of knowledge. The post I’ve quoted contains an admission that you don’t know have any basis for your opinion. It’s not alone. For example your comment that you’re “sure” that I would make pronouncements on things notwithstanding that I haven’t read up on things. Given that you don’t know me, that can only be based on certain posts I’ve made in the past, none of which give rise to that view, as I don’t give views on things that I’m wholly ignorant about. I haven’t agreed or disgreed with what you’ve said – merely queried it.

Incidentally, your poster thing about 9/11 teaching about Islam illustrates the point. It doesn’t teach you a thing about Islam. It’s a bit like saying “I learnt everything I need to know about the Catholic church from the crimes of paedophile priests.” In reality, their actions tell you nothing about Catholicism, just like 9/11 and Islam.

I’m not saying that people can’t have opinions unless their world experts on things. However, opinions based on prejudice and ignorance should be treated with the appropriate respect.

Not sure what you mean about decapitating babies btw.

 

[Rusty Shackleford]

I’ll leave the sneering to you. You’re very good at it.

What you’re not so good at is talking about things on the basis of knowledge. The post I’ve quoted contains an admission that you don’t know have any basis for your opinion. It’s not alone. For example your comment that you’re “sure” that I would make pronouncements on things notwithstanding that I haven’t read up on things. Given that you don’t know me, that can only be based on certain posts I’ve made in the past, none of which give rise to that view, as I don’t give views on things that I’m wholly ignorant about. I haven’t agreed or disgreed with what you’ve said – merely queried it.

Incidentally, your poster thing about 9/11 teaching about Islam illustrates the point. It doesn’t teach you a thing about Islam. It’s a bit like saying “I learnt everything I need to know about the Catholic church from the crimes of paedophile priests.” In reality, their actions tell you nothing about Catholicism, just like 9/11 and Islam.

I’m not saying that people can’t have opinions unless their world experts on things. However, opinions based on prejudice and ignorance should be treated with the appropriate respect.

Not sure what you mean about decapitating babies btw.

Your comparison of 9/11 with paedo priests is utterly risible. I didn't see people dancing on the streets in Ireland and Italy to celebrate another altar boy taking it up the pipe. You're very keen on using expressions like 'In reality', when you actually mean 'In my (wholly worthless) opinion', but that's in keeping with the usual self-aggrandising left-wing viewpoint that you've got a better handle of the facts because you're devoid of any moral centre.

As for decapitating babies, I would suggest that you read something about the Itamar massacre, where a three month old Israeli girl was beheaded by Palestinian 'freedom fighters', whose actions were subsequently celebrated by the passing out of sweets. You obviously didn't spot this in the ballet section of The Guardian.

 

[Crawliano]

Try walking through Nicosia, not even a boat trip there, one side of the green line boutique stores, happy tourists. The other side, snide goods, filthy food, run down motors, stray dogs, misery all round. It was horrible and made me wonder just what the Turks ever really got out of taking half the island. The south, although poor due to the economic downturn was still showing signs of prosperity, the north was just like someone shat consumerism out and they pieced it together to make something that looked "nice".

Screw 'em. Keep the raiding *******s out the EU till they give Cyprus back.

 

[Swiss Tony]

Try walking through Nicosia, not even a boat trip there, one side of the green line boutique stores, happy tourists. The other side, snide goods, filthy food, run down motors, stray dogs, misery all round. It was horrible and made me wonder just what the Turks ever really got out of taking half the island. The south, although poor due to the economic downturn was still showing signs of prosperity, the north was just like someone shat consumerism out and they pieced it together to make something that looked "nice".

Screw 'em. Keep the raiding *******s out the EU till they give Cyprus back.

Agreed screw the Turks,they have nothing we want,a bit like Spain really.

 

[Dick Bate's Protege]

Agreed screw the Turks,they have nothing we want,a bit like Spain really.

Spain has long since been a haven for failed Brits.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Spain has long since been a haven for failed Brits.

Are you talking about the criminal fraternity on the Costa del Sol or are you trying to make an unsubtle point?:unsure:
In any case I think you need to define failure.Or perhaps you'd agree with Bob Dylan that "there's no success like failure.
And failure's no success at all".Bob was trying to be enigmatic ,I think.
Green btw for the first person who can tell me which Dylan song that comes from.

 

[Dick Bate's Protege]

Are you talking about the criminal fraternity on the Costa del Sol or are you trying to make an unsubtle point?:unsure:
In any case I think you need to define failure.Or perhaps you'd agree with Bob Dylan that "there's no success like failure.
And failure's no success at all".Bob was trying to be enigmatic ,I think.
Green btw for the first person who can tell me which Dylan song that comes from.

Love Minus Zero/No Limit, one of the weaker tracks on Bringing it all Back Home IMO. Make mine a grey, it suits me better than green. Ta muchly.