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We have to keep Phil Brown

When is the next tax bill due? Our main concern should be stabilising the finances of this football club.

Is Brown the man to do that? Can he operate on a shoe string budget? I’m dubious.

I'm dubious too. I can see PB going after players who all still feel they are still good enough to play in the FL and will hang on until the last minute for an offer from a league club. They won't come cheap. We can't afford to hang around and wait for players this time.....not for the majority of them anyway. I just hope Ron doesn't over stretch the finances again by putting together an attractive playing budget just to convince PB to stay.
It lit a fire in my belly the other week on the zoom call hearing Tilly talking about untapped Essex talent. Other than Ben Coker, I can't remember PB taking a chance on any other local talent during his last stint with us.
Many won't agree after Ron's last appointment, but I'd take Mark Bentley (with Tilly as assistant) any day of the week over Phil Brown.
He knows non league inside out and more importantly he knows the sort of players and characters you need in your squad to be successful at this level having played for The Daggers and managed at Canvey in recent seasons.
 
What happen to McQueen since he went back to Southampton?

A very sad tale. On 30 August 2018, McQueen signed for Middlesborough on a season-long loan. In October he suffered a serious knee injury in a game against Crystal Palace; a further infection of his knee reconstruction caused McQueen to be out of football for over two years.
In April 2021, Southampton manager Ralph Hasenhüttl said it would be a "miracle" if McQueen played again.
 
In my opinion it’s fairly clear cut for me and contingent on one non-negotiable element. The next manager has to know the club and be well aware of the working conditions in which they will be working. I was MM’s biggest advocate, I loved his philosophy and vision for how to move the club forward, but ultimately that decision has been made and that ship has sailed. With the club in free fall and going into uncharted waters, it needs someone who has experience of steadying a sinking ship. If we go with a rookie manager, such as Fagan for example, we end up in the same place as last season - a manager who may well have excellent ideas, philosophies and a vision, but an unstable environment to execute it. Furthermore, we need stability and have to hit the ground running - the natural process of new managers making mistakes isn’t conjusive to our current situation.

For me, we’ve got to go with a safe bet. Based on those two above parameters, the two obvious choices are Phil Brown and Steve Tilson. They are two different approaches, but both of which incorporate the remit mentioned and could both potentially unify the club in different ways.

Naturally, both have their obvious for and against arguments, but both have most certainly bought success a d stability to the club before.

In the case of Phil Brown, the sceptics may well point to budgets and his history of signing experienced players past their prime. With Tilson, it would be his time out of the game coupled with question marks over whether he would be as effective without Paul Brush alongside him (should he not join as well).

However, certainly there are strong arguments for both - Steve Tilson’s knowledge of local non-league talent could take the club in a new, exciting direction of building a squad of young talented local players blended with some experienced pros, much like his first tenure in some ways, which would could reduce the wage bill significantly whilst bringing some much needed excitement for the fans by bringing home one of their own at the helm. Tilson would certainly build togetherness through camaraderie and build trust/respect with the players through a more relaxed, laid back approach.

in terms of Phil Brown, there is no question he could generate the contacts necessary to reach players that would otherwise be out of our reach and probably of our radar. Our recent recruitment issues would no doubt improve significantly. He also has a galvanising effect on teams and will get teams fighting to win through creating a competitive environment.

I personally would be happy with either appointment - both approaches can work. My heart would love to see Tilson given another go. I think he has the skill set and loves the club. I’d love to see a project where we bring in the best non-league talent desperate to prove themselves and whom would see Southend as a big move. However, my head thinks it will be Brown, purely on the basis that Ron Martin trusts him and in all honesty he has demonstrated in the last 6 games that he can turn things around very quickly.

It will be very interesting to see what happens in the weeks following the Newport game on Saturday.
 
In what way does Phil brown have an ego ? Does anyone personally know him ? I think he is exactly what we need for our situation.

Quote from Phil on the BBC website after Saturday.

"I left the club knocking on the door of the Championship and now all of a sudden we're in the fifth tier, which is a sobering thought to say the least.”

When actually we were 18th , 2 points above the relegation zone, had lost 7 of the last 8 games and had a bunch of players who wouldn’t play for him anymore.

Doesn’t fit his ego though.....
 
I think Rigsby exploded the myth that PB has to operate on a big budget to be successful

I pointed out the fact that our last promotion from L2 cost around the same as MM's budget this season. Just 6 years ago the maximum wage was £1500 per week. Thats why he couldn't sign the magical 2 strikers that all fans demanded. Goal scorers could pick up £2,000 in the NL South. The plan then became be hard to beat, even in penalty shoot outs :Winking:

The thing is with the rules on Covid still uncertain and no guarantees of fully open stadiums next season.....How can Ron or any other Chairman give any manger budget guarantees for next Season.

Lets not forget the footballing authorities have lumbered the NL with more debt than they expected and several EFL clubs are just about in business. It would fit the SUFC history that this could be the one summer diving in first would be the wrong thing to do.

If we have another wave, would anyone on here put their house on the NL finishing a complete season ?
 
I pointed out the fact that our last promotion from L2 cost around the same as MM's budget this season. Just 6 years ago the maximum wage was £1500 per week. Thats why he couldn't sign the magical 2 strikers that all fans demanded. Goal scorers could pick up £2,000 in the NL South. The plan then became be hard to beat, even in penalty shoot outs :Winking:

The thing is with the rules on Covid still uncertain and no guarantees of fully open stadiums next season.....How can Ron or any other Chairman give any manger budget guarantees for next Season.

Lets not forget the footballing authorities have lumbered the NL with more debt than they expected and several EFL clubs are just about in business. It would fit the SUFC history that this could be the one summer diving in first would be the wrong thing to do.

If we have another wave, would anyone on here put their house on the NL finishing a complete season ?

True but us and Grimsby have a distinct advantage over some of the other clubs as we have a parachute payment of 500k

We have seen the height of the pandemic this season and the national league is completing. I doubt anything will stop it going forward.

As for PB. He certainly wouldn't have been my first choice but the fact he got far better performances out the players than MM did in a very short space of time, makes me question whether any other candidate would be a better fit in such difficult conditions.
 
As for PB. He certainly wouldn't have been my first choice but the fact he got far better performances out the players than MM did in a very short space of time, makes me question whether any other candidate would be a better fit in such difficult conditions.

It's pushing it a bit to say that he got far better performances out of our players isn't it? We were as poor against Colchester under PB as we had been against Carlisle in our last defeat under MM. The Colchester game was much more important. I could accept defeat by a better team but not the abject performance that we put in, partly due to PB's poor tactics.

So fair enough to say that PB has got better performances out of some players in some games and I'm a PB supporter by the way, but let's not go overboard.
 
I think a lot of fans under-estimate PB's contact book. Loan players played a BIG part in our success under his previous regime. I would rate all the following players as ones who contributed to our L2 promotion campaign that he was able to bring to the club by virtue of his network of contacts;

Joe Pigott - on loan
Steve McLaughlin - on loan
Rob Kiernan (first time around when he was decent and fit) - on loan
Jerome Binnon-Williams - on loan
Shaq Coulthurst (scored a vital penalty in the 90th minute against someone) - on loan
Cian Bolger - on loan
Jake Cassidy (didn't score but linked up well w/ Pigott in latter half of season) - on loan

In L1 he brought in Steve McQueen who was excellent for us as well.

I'd like to know how many other managers in the NL or even L1/2 would be able to call upon mates at larger clubs in the same way. Just my opinion but we need all the help we can get in the NL.

His contacts can't have liked him if they recommended him Coulthirst, Binnom-Williams and Cassidy but well done for managing to find three players who wouldn't be able to get into the current side!

But even this season without a big contact book manager we've had loanees from Spurs, Portsmouth, Bournemouth, Arsenal, Barnsley and Gateshead. It's really no big deal and something pretty much every manager who has managed us has been able to do.
 
True but us and Grimsby have a distinct advantage over some of the other clubs as we have a parachute payment of 500k

We have seen the height of the pandemic this season and the national league is completing. I doubt anything will stop it going forward.

As for PB. He certainly wouldn't have been my first choice but the fact he got far better performances out the players than MM did in a very short space of time, makes me question whether any other candidate would be a better fit in such difficult conditions.
We upped our tempo a bit but still failed to score in our first three games under Brown and I'm not sure we increased the number of chances we created either. And that third game against Colchester was IMO our worst performance of the season.
His contacts can't have liked him if they recommended him Coulthirst, Binnom-Williams and Cassidy but well done for managing to find three players who wouldn't be able to get into the current side!

But even this season without a big contact book manager we've had loanees from Spurs, Portsmouth, Bournemouth, Arsenal, Barnsley and Gateshead. It's really no big deal and something pretty much every manager who has managed us has been able to do.
Yep, some on here bang on about more experienced managers having more/better contacts
but for me the manager who used his contacts on loan best was Tilly, who signed Robson Kanu (Welsh international), Charlie Mulgrew (Scottish international), Junior Stanislas (Premier League regular), George Friend and Scott Malone (Championship regulars), etc. We didn't see the best of them obviously because they were very raw (especially the much-maligned Malone) but Tilly clearly had a good eye for emerging talent at bigger clubs.
 
We upped our tempo a bit but still failed to score in our first three games under Brown and I'm not sure we increased the number of chances we created either. And that third game against Colchester was IMO our worst performance of the season.

Yep, some on here bang on about more experienced managers having more/better contacts
but for me the manager who used his contacts on loan best was Tilly, who signed Robson Kanu (Welsh international), Charlie Mulgrew (Scottish international), Junior Stanislas (Premier League regular), George Friend and Scott Malone (Championship regulars), etc. We didn't see the best of them obviously because they were very raw (especially the much-maligned Malone) but Tilly clearly had a good eye for emerging talent at bigger clubs.


I would suggest that may have been more of Paul Brush than Tilly... ...
 
His contacts can't have liked him if they recommended him Coulthirst, Binnom-Williams and Cassidy but well done for managing to find three players who wouldn't be able to get into the current side!

But even this season without a big contact book manager we've had loanees from Spurs, Portsmouth, Bournemouth, Arsenal, Barnsley and Gateshead. It's really no big deal and something pretty much every manager who has managed us has been able to do.

Binnon-Williams had two outstanding games away at Oxford and Pompey where we picked up 6 points and finished with 10 men in both games. Those games set us off for the promotion run in so he did play a small but important part but was not going to be picked over Coker before his serious injuries.

B-W was an emergency CB and played a lot better than he did at LB. PB tried to convert him to a CB but he refused. Perhaps he should have listened.

As for contacts. John Egan's agent contacted PB when he was a Gillingham because he wanted to come back this side. PB would obviously have taken him but for what ever reason it didn't happen. By the end of the season Egan was in the L1 team of the year and on his way to Brentford for a lot money + sell on.
 
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Yes I know. I can’t believe I’m saying it either

But I cannot deny that PB has got more out of the same players Molesley had.

He wouldn’t have been my choice. But the past is the past. We simply cannot afford yet more upheaval in the summer with another new manager coming in. Brown has had this time to assess who he would want to keep (I honestly can’t imagine there’s many) and areas we need to bring the players in.

We have sleepwalked into absolute oblivion. We can’t have another slow start to summer proceedings.

Every manager who’s had a crack at this since Brown’s initial departure has bemoaned the lack of fitness of the previous regime. One thing you could never accuse a Phil Brown team of was being unfit.

He’s said it himself (Brown), the budget will dictate what he wants to do. But I really feel we have to give it to him. It’s another mark of how far we have fallen, Phil Brown might be our best hope of getting back within a respectable time frame. What is a respectable timeframe.... 3 years? 5 years?

The promotion year in 2015 we had, in my opinion, the best squad in League 2. We haven’t had any squad depth remotely close to that since.

Ughhh. Such a good take but not one that sits well with me. But I do begrudgingly agree. I don't expect bounce back promotion at the first attempt but even if PB can start to build something and we finish 12th, that's fine with me. But I'm not sure that's his mantra. He will want / demand promotion and will probably upset the apple cart in the process. In summary; who knows. Its just a s h 1 t situation lets be honest!
 
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