Woohoo! He's Home at last

[steveo]

British resident Binyam Mohamed, who was held at Guantanamo Bay for more than four years, arrives back in the UK and says "For myself, the very worst moment came when I realised in Morocco that the people who were torturing me were receiving questions and materials from British intelligence."

So why come back then?

They interviewed his brother on 5live tonight.
Q) So you think he is innocent of all the charges?
A) Absolutely innocent of everything
Q) How about the claim that he was fighting alongside the Taliban?
A) I dont know anything about that
Q) Have you been in touch with him recently?
A) I last spoke to him in July 2000 or 2001, I cant remember.

 

[Desert Shrimper]

British resident Binyam Mohamed, who was held at Guantanamo Bay for more than four years, arrives back in the UK and says "For myself, the very worst moment came when I realised in Morocco that the people who were torturing me were receiving questions and materials from British intelligence."

So why come back then?

They interviewed his brother on 5live tonight.
Q) So you think he is innocent of all the charges?
A) Absolutely innocent of everything
Q) How about the claim that he was fighting alongside the Taliban?
A) I dont know anything about that
Q) Have you been in touch with him recently?
A) I last spoke to him in July 2000 or 2001, I cant remember.

An absolute disgrace. Binyam Mohamed is now free to post on Shrimperzone whenever he feels like it -A BASIC FREEDOM THAT BLUETONIC IS DENIED.

The Tonic has less rights in Brown's Britain than an alleged ex-Taliban freedom fighter. That is surely POLITICAL CORRECTNESS GONE MAD. :thumbdown:

 

[MK Shrimper]

An absolute disgrace. Binyam Mohamed is now free to post on Shrimperzone whenever he feels like it -A BASIC FREEDOM THAT BLUETONIC IS DENIED.

The Tonic has less rights in Brown's Britain than an alleged ex-Taliban freedom fighter. That is surely POLITICAL CORRECTNESS GONE MAD. :thumbdown:

Is Bluetonic on a nice holiday in Cuba then? lucky sod.

 

[steveo]

An absolute disgrace. Binyam Mohamed is now free to post on Shrimperzone whenever he feels like it -A BASIC FREEDOM THAT BLUETONIC IS DENIED.

Lets hope he pops in then and we can all show our appreciation for the good work he has done for "his Country" and show our joy that he has returned home.
I think he should be given a council house asap, and maybe his own mosque.

 

[Desert Shrimper]

Lets hope he pops in then and we can all show our appreciation for the good work he has done for "his Country" and show our joy that he has returned home.
I think he should be given a council house asap, and maybe his own mosque.

That would be nothing more than Tonic deserves.

 

[Firestorm]

So why come back then?

They interviewed his brother on 5live tonight.
Q) So you think he is innocent of all the charges?
A) Absolutely innocent of everything
Q) How about the claim that he was fighting alongside the Taliban?
A) I dont know anything about that
Q) Have you been in touch with him recently?
A) I last spoke to him in July 2000 or 2001, I cant remember.

Did they ask anyone the questions.
has he been charged with any thing ?
what evidence , sufficient to prosecute, do the authorities have?

 

[steveo]

Did they ask anyone the questions.
has he been charged with any thing ?
what evidence , sufficient to prosecute, do the authorities have?

Don't you think being arrested with a false passport following a recent visit to a country where British troops were fighting a war is sufficient reason for him to be a suspect?

 

[Perth Bambi]

And did he not sign a confession.

 

[J]

Did they ask anyone the questions.
has he been charged with any thing ?
what evidence , sufficient to prosecute, do the authorities have?

He was Muslim with an AK47, that ain't proof enough bro?































This is obviously in Jest

 

[Gremlin]

And did he not sign a confession.

Not sure. That's what people tend to prefer to do rather than face further torture though.

 

[Firestorm]

Don't you think being arrested with a false passport following a recent visit to a country where British troops were fighting a war is sufficient reason for him to be a suspect?

He was arrested in April 2002 , he visited Afghanistan in June 2001

The War in Afghanistan, which began on October 7, 2001 as the U.S. military operation Operation Enduring Freedom,

So it would appear that he visited Afghanistan before "British troops were fighting a war "

Next reason for him being a suspect ?

There are differing reports as to whether it was a visa violation or a false passport too.

However , if the Americans are unable to get sufficient evidence after 4 years of intense questioning (the current debate being as to the legaliities of some of the "questioning") I think that blanket "guilty" comments by anyone who has access to a tiny amount of the information (and no access to the scapels) does tend to indicate an element of a narrow minded alternative agenda.

The law of this country is innocent until proven guilty, the Americans have been unable to prove his guilt despite the length of detention and use of methods over and above that legally allowed in this country. So as far as this country is concerned he is innocent.

The debate raging at the moment is rather more difficult, should a country who has given an asylum seeker leave to remain , protect him in a similar fashion to one of their citizens ? Are excessive detention and torture legitimate evidence gathering methods ?
May be it could be covered by the Blanket question , Humanitarian empathy for all at the risk of an absolutly minute percentage exploiting it , or inhumane methods are acceptable even if the innocent are violated as it may protect in the future.

 

[Rusty Shackleford]

I've got no time to be debating the rights and wrongs of this today. I'd rather be waterboarding.

 

[steveo]

Are excessive detention and torture legitimate evidence gathering methods ?

Unless you are in possession of all the facts I am assuming this is only your opinion.

My main argument is that he had a chance to stay in this Country but decided not to take it. Why should we have him back now?

 

[Rusty Shackleford]

The debate raging at the moment is rather more difficult, should a country who has given an asylum seeker leave to remain , protect him in a similar fashion to one of their citizens ? Are excessive detention and torture legitimate evidence gathering methods ?

First Question: Absolutely Not
Second Question: Absolutely

As Colonel Saito once said: 'This is war! This is not a game of cricket!'

 

[Desert Shrimper]

My main argument is that he had a chance to stay in this Country but decided not to take it. Why should we have him back now?

I agree - all those expats coming back from Spain now the grass isn't so greener can go **** themselves!

 

[Desert Shrimper]

First Question: Absolutely Not
Second Question: Absolutely

As Colonel Saito once said: 'This is war! This is not a game of cricket!'

Depends on whether you think we as Brits we should hold ourselevs above the pack or not in terms of morality. Where I currently live he would be thrown back from whence he came in about 25 minutes. And they would not be a pleasant 25 minutes.

Not saying I necessarily agree with that but the UAE runs a good line in keeping the good and getting shot of the bad. Quite a contrast after living in the UK.

 

[Rusty Shackleford]

Depends on whether you think we as Brits we should hold ourselevs above the pack or not in terms of morality. Where I currently live he would be thrown back from whence he came in about 25 minutes. And they would not be a pleasant 25 minutes.

Not saying I necessarily agree with that but the UAE runs a good line in keeping the good and getting shot of the bad. Quite a contrast after living in the UK.

Good point DS, I really don't think 'morality' should enter into the equation when we are defending our citizens from potential terror threats. This 'morality' is perceived as weakness by our enemies.

 

[Desert Shrimper]

Good point DS, I really don't think 'morality' should enter into the equation when we are defending our citizens from potential terror threats. This 'morality' is perceived as weakness by our enemies.

To give you an example, there was a case recently where some pro-Taliban individuals were gathering to preach extremism outside a mosque in Abu Dhabi. They turned up for their meeting whereupon a welcome committee of police were waiting to greet them. They were loaded into vans by the police and it was next stop Islamabad - ask no questions, please-speak-to-the-back-of-my-hand-if-you-fancy-a-chat method of policing. Contrary to what some people like to believe on here, 99% of the Middle East think they're all ******s too......

 

[osymandus]

And as an example Pakistani , teh majority areas of Islam are Sufi (lovely lads and lasses)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/7896943.stm

If we decide to adhere to any morality we have to accept it must aply to our enimies as well as well as ourselfs , or its hypocrchie. You cannot fight "barbarians" claim you defend civilisation then use similar methods.

When you set out to battle monster be careful you yourself do not become one.

 

[Rusty Shackleford]

To give you an example, there was a case recently where some pro-Taliban individuals were gathering to preach extremism outside a mosque in Abu Dhabi. They turned up for their meeting whereupon a welcome committee of police were waiting to greet them. They were loaded into vans by the police and it was next stop Islamabad - ask no questions, please-speak-to-the-back-of-my-hand-if-you-fancy-a-chat method of policing. Contrary to what some people like to believe on here, 99% of the Middle East think they're all ******s too......

Fascinating insight DS, it's rare that we get to hear any of these stories in the mainstream media - I'm sure it would be far more valuable in getting horrible right wing *******s like me to regard Arabs with a lot more empathy. Do you think that your number of 99% would apply in Saudi Arabia? We have a perception that Saudi is a hot bed of extremism due to Osama and the many Saudis involved in 9/11, but is that really the case? It's interesting that predominantly Muslim states like the UAE have zero tolerance for this extremism whereas Western/Christian countries seem to let it go. I know which method I favour.