Fire in North Kensington.

[Mad Cyril]

To **** stir a bit more. Has already suggested a cover up. Must have a new album out.

Lilly Allen may be 100% altruistic in her intentions but by being there she takes some of the focus away from the victims.

 

[Floval Flyer]

But Jeremy Corbyn and The Queen did. Even Sadiq Khan faced an angry crowd.

She's been called out by politicians on both sides, including those in her own party. But don't let that deter you from your blind adoration of MayBot.

They lapped him up, but Corbyn was only there for political means, the man is a charlatan. I just fail to understand the adoration for him. So, he's shaken a few hands but he does not do or say anything of substance. The Labour Party however will use this tragedy to buy support and the lefties will all fall over themselves to lap it up.

The press are also stirring this up too! People are grieving, but the focus seems to have quickly shifted to accusations of racism and the government not caring for people in social housing. Seems to be an angry mob growing, I just hope this doesn't lead to trouble on the streets and another tragedy.

 

[MK Shrimper]

They lapped him up, but Corbyn was only there for political means, the man is a charlatan. I just fail to understand the adoration for him. So, he's shaken a few hands but he does not do or say anything of substance. The Labour Party however will use this tragedy to buy support and the lefties will all fall over themselves to lap it up.

The press are also stirring this up too! People are grieving, but the focus seems to have quickly shifted to accusations of racism and the government not caring for people in social housing. Seems to be an angry mob growing, I just hope this doesn't lead to trouble on the streets and another tragedy.

You keep telling yourself that. The mood in the country is that JC is a human being whilst May doesn't have a sympathetic bone in her body.

 

[Clinton Baptiste]

The left doing what they do best hijacking grief for political means. A bunch of thuggish yobs using this tragedy as a political football. That's the problem with the left they are anti everything. Amazing how quickly they produced those placards. I am no Theresa May fan but she does not have blood on her hands. Would these people still be protesting if Corbyn had won? Of course not. They always have to find someone to blame for everything. Bitter after the election defeat and it was a defeat let's not forget. The real victims are still buried in the rubble or coming to terms with their loses.

 

[Pubey]

I think if you're watching the reports of these protests and your conclusion is to criticise Lilly Allen, then your priorities are out of kilter.

 

[Floval Flyer]

You keep telling yourself that. The mood in the country is that JC is a human being whilst May doesn't have a sympathetic bone in her body.

I shall mate, good that we disagree on that

over time one of us will be proved right, wonder who it will be...

 

[Mad Cyril]

I think if you're watching the reports of these protests and your conclusion is to criticise Lilly Allen, then your priorities are out of kilter.

I explained my line of thought. This isn't a time for celebrities to muscle in. Maybe my criticism should be of the media who should have completely ignored her.

I completely understand the fury of the crowd but an angry mob has never solved anything. I am hopeful that there will be no cover ups for such a high profile incident and anyone culpable will be brought to justice.

 

[Floval Flyer]

Very moody mob gathering in London tonight, not good...



I predict a riot !

 

[Clinton Baptiste]

I explained my line of thought. This isn't a time for celebrities to muscle in. Maybe my criticism should be of the media who should have completely ignored her.

She must have a new album out. At least Adele tried to sneak in unnoticed. But then Lily Allen always has been a self-important ****.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

They lapped him up, but Corbyn was only there for political means, the man is a charlatan. I just fail to understand the adoration for him. So, he's shaken a few hands but he does not do or say anything of substance. The Labour Party however will use this tragedy to buy support and the lefties will all fall over themselves to lap it up.

The press are also stirring this up too! People are grieving, but the focus seems to have quickly shifted to accusations of racism and the government not caring for people in social housing. Seems to be an angry mob growing, I just hope this doesn't lead to trouble on the streets and another tragedy.

So May is criticised for not going and you are criticising Corbyn for going. What a predicament.
To be fair to him its not like he has no interest, just look at the 2015 Homes For Human Habitation Bill that was defeated in Parliament by landlord MPs and again as an amendment the the government's 2016 housing bill, again defeated by the larger party. No one is yet to form a government, its right that he would meet people that could be effected by such legislation in the future and as the area now has a Labour MP it is right that he would be there to support the new MP.

 

[* ORM *]

We laugh at American politics then I read some of the utter bilge on this thread. Here's the problem and it is very simple. Ask anyone in the country whether we should fund our armed forces, police, fire, nurses, doctors, lifeboats and the answer is an unequivocal yes. Ask people at a general election whether they want the low tax Tories or the higher tax Labour (who don't, by the way, do anything other than borrow to try to fund election promises) and democracy speaks. When democracy speaks those on the losing side don't like it.

IF there are lessons learned it will come out of an enquiry not out of idle speculation and point scoring.

On a beautiful note what a lovely gesture by our club to donate part of season ticket and match day revenue to the appeal. I can't post a link but they've not been judgemental, just practical.

 

[Gt Yarmouth Shrimper]

I shall mate, good that we disagree on that

over time one of us will be proved right, wonder who it will be...

Now that Murdoch has turned on her, I feel she's finished.

 

[rigsby]

Sadly for all the victims this disaster it is now going to be hijacked by rent-a-mob. Who cares about May over Corbyn in a faux concerned about victims photo opportunity. If either of them had been that concerned why did we have this fire in the first place.

Of course May will go but right now this week she is in charge and speaking to the LFB and deciding on a public enquiry is exactly the thing she should be doing rather than wasting her time confronting an angry mob most of which aren't even from that part of London.

All ready the Police Officer in charge was quick to rule out arson which is pandering to the mob. Yes there are quick indicators, eye witness, explosimeters and sniffer dogs. But until all the samples are tested forensically you can't be certain.

This reminds me of the New Cross fire in about 1983. Facts became facts before they were checked. When the evidence didn't back up what the mob wanted to believe it became a problem for years. With accusations of cover ups and collusion between the racist police and Fire Brigade the families were left feeling cheated.

I really do hope that we don't end up with that situation but with champagne white socialists popping along for afternoon of ****-stirring followed by dinner back in Crouch End, I can see this whole sad saga taking a real nasty turn.

 

[Massimo Giovanni]

Some very valid points have been raised on this thread.
And sadly, just like from our politicians, some not worthy point scoring and hind sight genius, disharmonious ones.
The inquiry MUST get started ASAP.
There must be some fast answer to the cladding issue & then some checking on who, why and how, allowed and okay'ed what.
Past fire checks need swift examination; as do reports on rubbish, blocked exits, open fire doors, sprinklers, alarms etc: & then swift, binding regulations enforced on similar properties and the persons living there - the listed tenants correctly and sort out the illegal sub-tenant stuff.
Many of the reports suggest this was a disaster waiting to happen and that warnings were given (and ignored) - that needs more action.
The inquires have got to get sorted fast and the victims need assistance faster.

 

[THE SEVENTIES NORTH BANK]

The British public response as usual has been overwhelming. The only trouble is that most people in that building died. That's the shocking reality. The ones that got out and are O.K. have taken the stuff they need. There are less than 30 still in hospital. I'm sure we all give them our very best wishes to recover the best that they can. What I'm getting at is there is enough food, drink, clothes and provisions for about 5000 people according to a helper. Many people are turning up each day to sort this stuff out. More stuff is arriving each day, even tho they have asked people to stop sending. The Council or Government should be taking control of all this as the stockpile is getting bigger, and apart from a little bit that goes to those still in hospital, the rest is not going to the tragic victims of that fire. What should be done with all the food, drink, clothes and provisions that are left over?

 

[Benfleet A1]

The British public response as usual has been overwhelming. The only trouble is that most people in that building died. That's the shocking reality. The ones that got out and are O.K. have taken the stuff they need. There are less than 30 still in hospital. I'm sure we all give them our very best wishes to recover the best that they can. What I'm getting at is there is enough food, drink, clothes and provisions for about 5000 people according to a helper. Many people are turning up each day to sort this stuff out. More stuff is arriving each day, even tho they have asked people to stop sending. The Council or Government should be taking control of all this as the stockpile is getting bigger, and apart from a little bit that goes to those still in hospital, the rest is not going to the tragic victims of that fire. What should be done with all the food, drink, clothes and provisions that are left over?

Warehouse it and use it as and when the next terrible thing happens.

 

[MK Shrimper]

Plenty of homeless & desperately poor people out there.

 

[Sentinel]

A very revealing reply on the Shrewsbury Town message board. I reproduce it here in its entirety:

This is my patch. I could write a book on the last few days. It's been chaotic, desperately sad, baking hot. It's felt like half of the country has either sent a chunck of their property across or turned up or done both. We've been bombarded by Amazon, DHL, Monsoon, M&S, EE, TalkTalk as well as thousands of well wishers etc. We have official rest centres crammed with donations, two town halls rammed and donations flowing out of pop up community centres. The council has literally ground to a halt to processes donations, support with logistics, support housing colleagues, volunteer at rest centres. It has also drawn upon the support of colleagues in Westminster and Hammersmith & Fulham LA.

This part of North Ken and in and around the Town Hall looks and feels like a warzone, residents are devastated and staff are likewise devastated.

There have been failures and are plenty of lessons to be learnt- but contrary to what the press will tell you the council has focused on council specific rest centres. Centres that have Housing officers, LAS, Dr's, nurses, adult and children's social workers, clothing, food, the red cross, police input and mental health practitioners. We have tried directing residents to these centres and using them as hubs. Unfortunately the one downside of such an overwhelming community response is that Mosques, churches, sports halls and all manner of places have popped up as refuge centres and somewhat confused the messaging. The council has either been too slow to respond to these centres and ineffectively coordinated with them, not had the resources (staff) to put in all of these pop up centres, made the strategic decision to try and work through an official hub base or all of the above.

I have been to the Westway (gym with 300 places to sleep that the Queen visited) and have helped coordinate another rest centre on the first day. I can assure you that there have been plentiful of council volunteers present trying to support residents. The Borough Emergency Centre is in operation 24 hours a day trying to manage and coordinate .

Unfortunately we lack two things information about missing people and the permission/support of senior police officials to help us manage the expectation and comms with residents on the ground.

I can fully understand why residents are so ****ed off and I accept the logic that they need to make noise and create momentum before the world loses interest in this story.

I also accept criticism of the chaotic nature of the council's response. I would however say that any local authority would struggle to deal with a 36 hour blaze in the heart of the community that incinerated 120 flats, displaced/killed upto 600 residents as well as having to evacuate hundreds of other residents from neighbouring blocks.

I accept that blame will be apportioned and it will likely fall on elected officials within the LA, senior managers at the TMO and likely impact upon the government, with the buck finishing at the Royal Borough of Kensington and Chelsea.

I've mixed with young eloquent women demanding answers that I can't give about their missing family. I've been told I am lying and part of a government conspiracy by a teenager who has lost 5 members of his family. I've been shouted at by a resident who accused me of plotting to break up the community. I've coordinated with senior managers at acute trusts to discharge patients who's children are intensive care or who's family have died and who's house has burnt down.

I've protected old ladies from outbreaks of violence between residents and police and used my body as a shield to prevent a women having seizures getting crushed as a crowd surged the rest centre. I've carried people to medical attention and like my colleagues tried to support our community. But in this environment this is not enough. Nothing we do will be enough and I get that, I understand, but please know we are doing the best we can to help, to support, to comfort, to house and to give answers and link family members.

And all of this time, despite having a home and a family to go back to I have felt empty, like my colleagues I feel there is more that I should be doing. I look at the evening standard and I have to withhold the tears, I find myself silently crying as I watch newsnight. RBKC, TMO and the community of North ken will never be the same again. No amount of hard work, sorrow or support will make these residents feel any better. They need recognition and respect, they demand answers and they want blood, but most importantly, the one thing we can't provide atm they want information about the 100+ people to charred to identify in Grenfell and dare I presuppose the numerous unofficial residents who were crashing on sofa's or unofficially living with tenants.

Sorry for the ramble

Read more: http://blueandamber.proboards.com/thread/94839/london-fire?page=3#ixzz4kIUsePjq

 

[THE SEVENTIES NORTH BANK]

A very revealing reply on the Shrewsbury Town message board. I reproduce it here in its entirety:

Wow. That is quite an insight from a different perspective than the one we are seeing on the news and in the newspapers. Superbly written as well.

 

[RobM]

Plenty of homeless & desperately poor people out there.

There are indeed, however this is obviously an exceptional circumstance. Many people were safe after escaping but with only the clothes they stood up in. No car keys, debit card, medications, passport, driving licence, along with the obvious things. It must seem that their life ended moments before the fire and they have been re-incarnated with a completely new identity forced upon them.