Brexit negotiations thread

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

Because she apparently supports Labours position on Brexit and she's a racist car crash of a politician, and more to the point should Labour actually succeed in derailing Brexit, getting the GE they want she would, God forbid, be the next Home Secretary.

Labour don't need to derail Brexit, Theresa May has a majority in Parliament due to the DUP but was 230 MP votes short of achieving a Brexit deal. Unless she pulls something spectacular out of the bag in a matter of days then Theresa May has derailed Brexit.

 

[yogi bear up the cagire]

She gets more abuse that all other female MPs combined and she was on TV a week ago. That's the short answer.

Then perhaps she merits a thread of her own................if she hasn't already got one.

 

[yogi bear up the cagire]

With the concentration on Abbott I still haven't got a response to the post and article (OK, it was the Guardian) I posted earlier concerning Barnier's comments today.
If his comments are taken at face value it would appear to fly in the face of the idea that parliament can stop a hard Brexit. It would also contradict the belief of Spaceman Spiff and Lord Football, that something can be changed on the backstop situation, thus fascilitating the passing of May's deal. Is it just bluffing?............ isn't getting a bit late for bluffing now???

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

Stop trying to misrepresent the facts. Her comment about white people was in 2012, a mere 7 years ago, not 30+.

Her comment on white nurses was 22 years ago & the IRA stuff was 35 years ago. The significance of that is, it’s clear her racist views towards white people haven’t changed for 30+ years.



That’s not an answer to my question. Please stop trying to avoid it. What is an appropriate reaction to her racist comments?

I’d have thought that condemnation would be a start. Would you care to publicly condemn them, here and now?



Agree Farage is irrelevant right now, but that’s not the point I was making, as you well know. I’m just highlighting the hypocrisy that you’d be oh so quick to condemn Farage if he’d made those kind of comments.

However, you can’t wriggle away from the fact that Dianne Abbott most definitely is relevant right now, as there’s a chance that she could become Home Secretary, in the very near future.

So, as a Labour supporter, do you feel comfortable with this version of the Labour Party having a Home Secretary who’s known & proven to have a history of racist outbursts?

Also, If we could have just straight answers to those questions, and not diverting or skirting around them, that’d be appreciated, thanks

You gave 3 quotes and as I said they were between 7 and 30+ years ago so I wasn't misrepresenting you. There was no mention of IRA in your post so I'm not sure where that comes into alleged racism.

Appropriate reaction? Check the context and the full accurate quotes and take that into consideration.

I fully back what BlueExile said on post 5050, well written and saves me having to repeat similar.

I've said many times on here that Abbott is low down on my list of favoured MPs so I don't fully endorse everything she says or does. But I respect her achievements starting from coming out of Cambridge with a 1st at a time when various factors were against her, foreseeing how various pieces of bad policy would turn out in the future, all the way through to 75% of the vote in 2017.

I'd rather she was not on the Labour front bench but I recognise her immense achievements and recognise that she has done that whilst receiving constant and vile forms of abuse.

 

[GBJ]

Can I just ask, how has a discussion about Brexit turned into a slanging match about Diane Abbott??

In a nutshell..

Someone posted a (fairly amusing) meme of Diane Abbott.

That post was then ridiculed by someone else, in defence of Diane Abbott.

I injected some reality into proceedings, by pointing out that she’s a ****.

This lead to several zoners ignoring, dismissing & even excusing her racist behaviour.

 

[GBJ]

She gets more abuse that all other female MPs combined and she was on TV a week ago. That's the short answer.

Because she’s a ****.

Not because she’s a woman. Not because she’s black. Not because she’s part of the Labour Party.

Because she’s a ****

 

[blues exile]

In a nutshell..

Someone posted a (fairly amusing) meme of Diane Abbott.

That post was then ridiculed by someone else, in defence of Diane Abbott.

I injected some reality into proceedings, by pointing out that she’s a ****.

This lead to several zoners ignoring, dismissing & even excusing her racist behaviour.

Rather a warped misrepresentation of reality.

 

[blues exile]

Because she’s a ****.

Not because she’s a woman. Not because she’s black. Not because she’s part of the Labour Party.

Because she’s a ****

If you took the trouble to acquaint yourself with the nature of the abusive tweets etc that she receives, you would know the overwhelming majority are racist. Fact.

 

[blues exile]

She receives more hate mail than any other MP and is regularly booed and laughed at on her very frequent appearances on QT - all over the country.

Most of the hate mail is specifically because she is black. She seems to be the lightning rod for racists , sadly for her.

 

[blues exile]

You come across as quite an angry person, perhaps tone it down a bit because you make people tune out just by your language. It must be a hard life over there in Latvia!

Not nearly as hard a life as it's going to be in the UK post Brexit! Who are the people who 'tune out' by the way, not the nearly 60% I mentioned earlier presumably.

 

[yogi bear up the cagire]

Another excellent if somewhat depressing article from the Guardian. It's rather ironic that many journalists can really hit the money when it comes explaining the mess we are in.

https://www.theguardian.com/comment...mpromise-brexit-good-friday-agreement-britain

Sadly there don't seem to be any who can offer a solution on how we escape our present predicament. Is the EU's attitude, what's the point of trying to help and accomodate the UK, when they can't even help themselves?

 

[GBJ]

You gave 3 quotes and as I said they were between 7 and 30+ years ago so I wasn't misrepresenting you. There was no mention of IRA in your post so I'm not sure where that comes into alleged racism.
Appropriate reaction?

Check the context and the full accurate quotes and take that into consideration.

I fully back what BlueExile said on post 5050, well written and saves me having to repeat similar.

I've said many times on here that Abbott is low down on my list of favoured MPs so I don't fully endorse everything she says or does. But I respect her achievements starting from coming out of Cambridge with a 1st at a time when various factors were against her, foreseeing how various pieces of bad policy would turn out in the future, all the way through to 75% of the vote in 2017.

I'd rather she was not on the Labour front bench but I recognise her immense achievements and recognise that she has done that whilst receiving constant and vile forms of abuse.

So just so I’m totally sure, for future reference, you don’t think that her comments were racially offensive, prejudiced & downright irresponsible from an MP?

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

So just so I’m totally sure, for future reference, you don’t think that her comments were racially offensive, prejudiced & downright irresponsible from an MP?

Future reference - yes I can well imagine what Abbott said years ago will be brought up on a regular basis.

The quotes you gave were different to the versions Exile used and his had full background and context so I'm inclined to think his are more accurate.

As a white, middle aged male I assume I am the victim here? I don't feel victimised. I would say she should choose her words more carefully, and as they were between 7 and 35 years ago I'd say she probably is doing so (yes I'm aware she had a numbers meltdown on a radio show).

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46968726

Singapore here we come.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Did you read the BBC article at the link I posted?

Yes.

Meanwhile I suggest you read this.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/jan/23/james-dyson-brexiteer-elite-brexit-rees-mogg

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

Because she’s a ****.

Not because she’s a woman. Not because she’s black. Not because she’s part of the Labour Party.

Because she’s a ****

The content of much of the abuse she gets references her ethnicity and gender.

Many MPs are ****s. Many of them are a lot more ****ish than she is, yet she receives so much more abuse than any of them. Strange that.

 

[GBJ]

Rather a warped misrepresentation of reality.

You’ve been defending the indefensible, yet it’s me who’s got a warped sense of misrepresentation?

Remember, a few days ago, you accused @Bielzibubz of talking xenophobic nonsense, because he criticised a few other European states. And today you’ve argued that the phrases such as “they’ve probably never even seen a black person, let alone touched one”, isn’t racist & is perfectly Ok,

Oh the irony.

If you took the trouble to acquaint yourself with the nature of the abusive tweets etc that she receives, you would know the overwhelming majority are racist. Fact.

I don’t doubt it. Twitter isn’t a nice place at times. But that doesn’t excuse her behaviour of the past (well not in my opinion anyway).

Most of the hate mail is specifically because she is black. She seems to be the lightning rod for racists , sadly for her.

So, it’s somewhat similar to those Scandinavian nurses, who weren’t good enough to do their job, because of their specific nationality.

 

[yogi bear up the cagire]

Can I just ask, how has a discussion about Brexit turned into a slanging match about Diane Abbott??

That's me done for the night.............I give up! I don't know what all the argument is about, if they don't like Abbott perhaps they should settle for IPA? Wouldn't dare suggest 'Old Speckled Hen' .......................that could set up another ten pages of abusive posts.

 

[GBJ]

Many MPs are ****s. Many of them are a lot more ****ish than she is, yet she receives so much more abuse than any of them. Strange that.

Unfortunatley for her, she’s a prominent figure in politics, who’s also prone to incredible gaffes. She’s got a long list of them.

Future reference - yes I can well imagine what Abbott said years ago will be brought up on a regular basis.

The quotes you gave were different to the versions Exile used and his had full background and context so I'm inclined to think his are more accurate.

As a white, middle aged male I assume I am the victim here? I don't feel victimised. I would say she should choose her words more carefully, and as they were between 7 and 35 years ago I'd say she probably is doing so (yes I'm aware she had a numbers meltdown on a radio show).

Actually, the future reference part that I’m referring to, is the next time yourself, or one of the other usual faces claim racism/xenophobia etc, I’ll be there ready to compare & contrast it from today’s exchanges.

Oh, if it’s full background you need, they’re easy to look up. Just as I did. Take the nurses one for example, I copy & pasted the full article to SZ, only I reworded it. I took Abbott’s name out & replaced it with another prominent MP, and simply swapped a few of the key words around. It still read as a prejudiced piece.

No, I’m not saying you, nor I, are victims.

Just pointing out the hypocrisy that exists on this place from time to time. We all know you’d have lambasted the comments if they’d have come from a Tory/UKIP mouth.

Edit: as you didn’t answer my question - again - whether or not you thought the comments were racially offensive, prejudiced and downright irresponsible of an MP, I’m going to be forced to believe that you do not think that they are racially offensive, prejudiced and downright irresponsible of an MP. Please feel free to correct me if I’m wrong, and I’ll happily retract & apologise.

 

[Bielzibubz]

Not nearly as hard a life as it's going to be in the UK post Brexit! Who are the people who 'tune out' by the way, not the nearly 60% I mentioned earlier presumably.

£100.00 to Shrimperzone says the UK will not experience any where near the kind of hardship you predict and hope for. Come on, put up or shut up.

For some things will be tough, not doubt about that, me included. There will be losers as well. Conversely, there will be winners. There will be those that don't feel a great change. What there won't be however is a complete and utter breakdown in the financial markets. The housing market won't crash (although that may not be a bad thing). You won't see thousands and thousands of businesses going to the wall. You won't see families starving on the streets and little children begging for more.

Life will go on. The UK as a world leader and innovator in so many fields will go on. I know you and others like you with your hardcore Marxist Socialist ideals would relish the thought of this capitalistic country of ours falling on it's knees but you know what, it's just not going to happen.