Post-Match Thread and Ratings Southend United 1-3 Bradford City

[southendkid]

There are loads of free agents who are better then what we have.

Name some. Free agents wouldn't be free agents several months after the season had started if anyone else wanted them, and that includes half of the National League clubs who right now are much more attractive prospects for a footballer than Southend are. All that's left are players that aren't suited to starting even for us like Halford and Walsh. The only exceptions will be free agents who have had contract offers but have rejected them because they feel they can get more money or a more prestigious role elsewhere and they have enough in the bank to hold out for something better, in which case they certainly won't be coming to us.

 

[kentblues]

Name some. Free agents wouldn't be free agents if anyone else wanted them, and that includes half of the National League clubs who right now are much more attractive prospects for a footballer than Southend are. The only exceptions will be free agents who have had contract offers but have rejected them because they feel they can get more money or a more prestigious role elsewhere and they have enough in the bank to hold out for something better, in which case they certainly won't be coming to us.

All leads to the same place. £££. Money where the mouth is. If we are prepared to pay player, agent, club we will get someone. Wont be cheap. Thats the situation we are in- hoping for a cheap loanee of free agent if that is the strategy is doomed to failure- they will always find a better option.

Someone out of contract since March is no good- by the time they are match fit we would be relegated.

Even Ricky Holmes is realistic- yes another winger and we would still need a CF- but he would be way better than we have in both goals and assists. No doubt he want £££- but its a choice right now- find the £££ are find it x times over to keep going in the NL.

 

[Shrimpet steve]

This could still become potentially what happens. Or something along similar lines. Before the recent purple patch MM was getting close to the edge, and I understood the feeling was that if MM got terminated his team would probably all follow him out the door of their own accord with little financial consequence to RM other than for MMs position. This then leaves the options pre MM as possibly what would see us stay up or sink.
For what it's worth id hang my hat on MM - for having improved us to the point of being in touch and With the knowledge gleaned. I don't see dithering over a new manager will be of benefit currently. Especially bearing in mind the time Ron takes dithering. Even if it was simply reverting to Fagan, who may still be a bit spikey from the last snubbing.
However, as I said in a post on one thread or another, MM must stop his dillusions of being pep and go with what works for our limited abilities and players. 4-1-4-1 or similar but not 3\5 at the back. Boss the midfield like we have shown we can. If needed being on a big lump with a long throw with 15 to go.
League 2 tactics for league 2 players. Aim for 3rd from bottom via ugly means of needed. Take yellows if needed but planned and spread throughout the team. Must win games need must win tactics

Forget about fagan! He has no senior football league management to speak of and MM is even more experienced then him! We need an experienced manager someone proven to keep teams up someone who can attract players and knows the league.

 

[in the know]

I'm not disagreeing with you shrimpet. Just pointing out what the situation was and could be. I happen to agree with your thoughts but you must have noticed how Ron works, it would take too long. We'd be doomed.
Plus, in the same way players refuse us, don't you think managers have networks too and know what managing sufc involves!?
Imagine your company boss deciding he won't pay you and you have to take legal action against him to force him to pay you what was agreed on your contract. Your immediate manager (pre MM) doesn't want to get involved or be contacted. And while that's going on the company boss is phoning you regularly chatting about the next game and trying to be your best bud as though none of it happens and promising it's all sorted but turns out it's not and it's more lies. Just a supposed example of course ?
Do you think players and managers out there don't talk about this stuff and queue up to play for the 92nd worst club in the league.
The players coming in are doing it either directly for MM , or because they are Young and naive and can't believe this possibly can happen , or because they are injured desperate or ancient or usually all 3!
We are lucky to have MM and his desire and decication. Very hard to do better in the state we are in. But yes, he can do better and probably will.

 

[southendkid]

All leads to the same place. £££. Money where the mouth is. If we are prepared to pay player, agent, club we will get someone. Wont be cheap. Thats the situation we are in- hoping for a cheap loanee of free agent if that is the strategy is doomed to failure- they will always find a better option.

Someone out of contract since March is no good- by the time they are match fit we would be relegated.

Even Ricky Holmes is realistic- yes another winger and we would still need a CF- but he would be way better than we have in both goals and assists. No doubt he want £££- but its a choice right now- find the £££ are find it x times over to keep going in the NL.

Even if we had the finances available to us (which I'm very doubtful of) there's a limit to what we can spend. The league introduced a wage cap of £1.5m this season to try and stop another Bury happening. According to a Ron interview on 30th September we had a wage budget of £1.1 million. Since then Hutchinson and Kelman have left (plus Green had his loan cancelled) but ANG, Halford, Walsh and Hart have all joined us on contracts and if we're probably paying part of Hackett Fairchild and Cordner's wages too, so we must be getting close to the limit already and we ideally need at least 3 more players coming in.

 

[MisterStubbs]

Forget about fagan! He has no senior football league management to speak of and MM is even more experienced then him! We need an experienced manager someone proven to keep teams up someone who can attract players and knows the league.

Who? Tell me who you bring in with all this experience you speak off who will attract players despite the club being rock bottom of the football league and being in the **** for the last three years now.

 

[kentblues]

Even if we had the finances available to us (which I'm very doubtful of) there's a limit to what we can spend. The league introduced a wage cap of £1.5m this season to try and stop another Bury happening. According to a Ron interview on 30th September we had a wage budget of £1.1 million. Since then Hutchinson and Kelman have left (plus Green had his loan cancelled) but ANG, Halford, Walsh and Hart have all joined us on contracts and if we're probably paying part of Hackett Fairchild and Cordner's wages too, so we must be getting close to the limit already and we ideally need at least 3 more players coming in.

Given the cap bringing in endless wingers to use up the budget seems even more unwise. And any signing will only have 50% of a years salary towards the cap now which helps
My understanding if you exceed the cap then it is a financial penalty- loads of clubs will be outside the cap and penalised for it.
I suspect we still have 220k of cap available- equivalent of 440 full year wages (even if it’s half that = 220k FYI equivalent= 4K a week)
Whatever it is- no decent CF = run rate of 15 goals to end of season = non league football which will cost us much more. The sooner the fantasy that by continuing along the same path we will somehow get different results needs dispensing- we need to accept reality and take the necessary action

 

[jackj13]

This could still become potentially what happens. Or something along similar lines. Before the recent purple patch MM was getting close to the edge, and I understood the feeling was that if MM got terminated his team would probably all follow him out the door of their own accord with little financial consequence to RM other than for MMs position. This then leaves the options pre MM as possibly what would see us stay up or sink.
For what it's worth id hang my hat on MM - for having improved us to the point of being in touch and With the knowledge gleaned. I don't see dithering over a new manager will be of benefit currently. Especially bearing in mind the time Ron takes dithering. Even if it was simply reverting to Fagan, who may still be a bit spikey from the last snubbing.
However, as I said in a post on one thread or another, MM must stop his dillusions of being pep and go with what works for our limited abilities and players. 4-1-4-1 or similar but not 3\5 at the back. Boss the midfield like we have shown we can. If needed being on a big lump with a long throw with 15 to go.
League 2 tactics for league 2 players. Aim for 3rd from bottom via ugly means of needed. Take yellows if needed but planned and spread throughout the team. Must win games need must win tactics

Was this close to the edge with Ron or close to walking on his own accord?

 

[Shrimpet steve]

Who? Tell me who you bring in with all this experience you speak off who will attract players despite the club being rock bottom of the football league and being in the **** for the last three years now.

Any manager who's out of work in lower reaches of league 1 or 2 will come! Blimey henrik Larsson wanted to come sol cambell wanted to come do u realise how many applicants ron gets? As long as ron pays a good salary which I'm sure he does then we will have many ex pros and out of work managers wanted to be sufc manager.

 

[MisterStubbs]

Any manager who's out of work in lower reaches of league 1 or 2 will come! Blimey henrik Larsson wanted to come sol cambell wanted to come do u realise how many applicants ron gets? As long as ron pays a good salary which I'm sure he does then we will have many ex pros and out of work managers wanted to be sufc manager.

Sol worked out didn’t it.. you also contradict yourself when you say that MM has no experience at this level.. and then you throw Henrik Larsson out there.. have a word with yourself. You still haven’t told me who right now you’d replace MM with. Who is out there and available who will want to come and try and save a club from dropping out of the football league with half a season left?

 

[Holy Joe]

Any manager who's out of work in lower reaches of league 1 or 2 will come! Blimey henrik Larsson wanted to come sol cambell wanted to come do u realise how many applicants ron gets? As long as ron pays a good salary which I'm sure he does then we will have many ex pros and out of work managers wanted to be sufc manager.

Henrik and Sol aren't examples of experienced managers you desire though?

On the PE teacher slur, wasn't Gerard Houllier a teacher before turning his hand to football management?

 

[Napster]

Henrik and Sol aren't examples of experienced managers you desire though?

On the PE teacher slur, wasn't Gerard Houllier a teacher before turning his hand to football management?

so was Louis Van Gaal, Rinus Michels, Guus Hiddink, Roy Hodgson, Udo Lattek and Oscar Tabárez.

 

[Tommy2holes]

I'm very disappointed by the last 3 games.

We have a team and players that can win games. We have some individually strong players at this level.

What baffles me is the tactics being used. We aren't in the champions league.

These are lower league and u23 players.

When you have players and find a system that works for them, then stick with it.

The 3 at the back is just utter ****. Play players in the proper role. At the end of the day. MM wanted the new fella to start but didn't want to drop JW or SH. So he made a back 3 again. It doesn't work.

Go back to 4 4 2 or even 4 4 1 1 but ffs leave this wing back nonsense alone.

We put many balls into the box and none of the players have the belief to get themselves into the box or even gamble. Mansfield swarmed forward in numbers every time they broke.

I lost count how many times ANG had to hold his run or run toward his own goal to receive possession. Akinola always has his back to goal. That's not his game. Both players want balls in behind to run on to.

The pressing from us last night was criminal. So many times Mansfield had all the time in the world to pick a pass and put us under pressure, or turn with the ball.

We persist in this long ball to Akinola who works really hard but almost always looses possession in the air.

Go back to basics. Become hard to beat and well drilled with a system that gives us a chance of 3 points and play the ball in behind.

 

[rigsby]

I'm very disappointed by the last 3 games.

We have a team and players that can win games. We have some individually strong players at this level.

What baffles me is the tactics being used. We aren't in the champions league.

These are lower league and u23 players.

When you have players and find a system that works for them, then stick with it.

The 3 at the back is just utter ****. Play players in the proper role. At the end of the day. MM wanted the new fella to start but didn't want to drop JW or SH. So he made a back 3 again. It doesn't work.

Go back to 4 4 2 or even 4 4 1 1 but ffs leave this wing back nonsense alone.

We put many balls into the box and none of the players have the belief to get themselves into the box or even gamble. Mansfield swarmed forward in numbers every time they broke.

I lost count how many times ANG had to hold his run or run toward his own goal to receive possession. Akinola always has his back to goal. That's not his game. Both players want balls in behind to run on to.

The pressing from us last night was criminal. So many times Mansfield had all the time in the world to pick a pass and put us under pressure, or turn with the ball.

We persist in this long ball to Akinola who works really hard but almost always looses possession in the air.

Go back to basics. Become hard to beat and well drilled with a system that gives us a chance of 3 points and play the ball in behind.

Apart from the right back who scored the equaliser and should have put us 2-1 up before half time

He also had a good chance against v Barrow to put us 2-0 up before half time.

We missed several chances inside the 6yd box v Cambridge and who was it that missed that header to equalise v Mansfield... Dieng?

Seems to me like the system is working just the finish isn't. You don't scuff, blaze, fresh air or head like a girl who's never played football because of a system, tactics or wrong sub......You do all of those because your not the best ever players we have had and 92nd in L2 adds pressure and makes you nervous. Its always been that way since I was old enough to remember.

 

[kentblues]

Apart from the right back who scored the equaliser and should have put us 2-1 up before half time

He also had a good chance against v Barrow to put us 2-0 up before half time.

We missed several chances inside the 6yd box v Cambridge and who was it that missed that header to equalise v Mansfield... Dieng?

Seems to me like the system is working just the finish isn't. You don't scuff, blaze, fresh air or head like a girl who's never played football because of a system, tactics or wrong sub......You do all of those because your not the best ever players we have had and 92nd in L2 adds pressure and makes you nervous. Its always been that way since I was old enough to remember.

It's because we have no finishers, and all the forwards are wingers who chip in with goals. Poor Elvis has spent his career to date as a full back rarely stepping foot in the opposition penalty area, so when we push him up the pitch and it turns out his finishing is not up to scratch the surprise would be if we were surprised..

Of course pressure does nothing to make those players any better.

 

[in the know]

Was this close to the edge with Ron or close to walking on his own accord?

It wasn't in MMs thinking.....I think he's stayed resolutely focused on his objectives to be fair to him. There were realizations that we couldn't carry on keep losing week after week after week. How much weight the December purple patch carries is unknown!

 

[Leigh_Seasider]

I wonder how many games this losing streak will be allowed to go this time? I think before because of the embargo Ron was right to give MM time. This time it will be different though. I think he needs to gets some results going in next few games or Ron wont have any choice but throw the dice and make a change.

Or .. Ron could back his manager and look at the longer term. He’s absolutely got a choice, he’s not going to pull the trigger just because a few fans start panicking. I’d quite like to see a manager trusted to succeed. Of all the things Ron might look back and regret I’d hope one was getting shot of SCP and bringing in Bond. Powell had unbelievable luck with injuries, MM has had to deal with an embargo and a club with its’ reputation in the gutter.

 

[in the know]

I hope that too Leigh_Seasider, i think it would be fair and sensible and practical. At least now RM has seen MM has capability and with the right players available can get wins and play well. Before December RM did not have that evidence, so I'm guessing he will now get more time for sure.
I'm sure that with our players networking with other clubs players at least we have a manager that might attract players and it's just the rumbling on club structure and pay issues that are cause hesitancy when considering coming.

 

[Chrisb]

This could still become potentially what happens. Or something along similar lines. Before the recent purple patch MM was getting close to the edge, and I understood the feeling was that if MM got terminated his team would probably all follow him out the door of their own accord with little financial consequence to RM other than for MMs position. This then leaves the options pre MM as possibly what would see us stay up or sink.
For what it's worth id hang my hat on MM - for having improved us to the point of being in touch and With the knowledge gleaned. I don't see dithering over a new manager will be of benefit currently. Especially bearing in mind the time Ron takes dithering. Even if it was simply reverting to Fagan, who may still be a bit spikey from the last snubbing.
However, as I said in a post on one thread or another, MM must stop his dillusions of being pep and go with what works for our limited abilities and players. 4-1-4-1 or similar but not 3\5 at the back. Boss the midfield like we have shown we can. If needed being on a big lump with a long throw with 15 to go.
League 2 tactics for league 2 players. Aim for 3rd from bottom via ugly means of needed. Take yellows if needed but planned and spread throughout the team. Must win games need must win tactics

Thanks for that insight, interesting post.

 

[Chrisb]

Or .. Ron could back his manager and look at the longer term. He’s absolutely got a choice, he’s not going to pull the trigger just because a few fans start panicking. I’d quite like to see a manager trusted to succeed. Of all the things Ron might look back and regret I’d hope one was getting shot of SCP and bringing in Bond. Powell had unbelievable luck with injuries, MM has had to deal with an embargo and a club with its’ reputation in the gutter.

To be honest I have never been sure that RM did 'get shot' of SCP. I think Chris was a broken man in his last few matches in charge and decided it was best for all, at the time, to walk away from the club he loves. As for bringing in Bond, well that's a whole different matter ...