Question 50 years of hurt with England

[ozzie]

remember watching the game in Elm rd,Leigh...with my father...the last memory i had of him,together.as a child.
Italia 90 was good,but watched the game with my German wife,bought a barrel of "NATCH" cider and got stuck into it...when the Germans went one up,my wife cheered and i went for her!!!lucky for me my mother was over for a holiday and stopped me.After the game,cried.
Euro 96,living in Germany,did not go for the wife,i was older!!..but on site ..the Germans ,who expected to get beaten by us,were very,very quite before the game...but the next day...total C"""S...fell out with most of the site...after losing on pens,sat outside and cried again.

 

[ColinMorrisWalksOnWater]

Just stealing myself for our overpaid, pretentious national side to flop yet again.

Fell out of love with the national side once Graham Taylor was appointed as national manager and never been won back since.

Building a team around Wayne "Raoul Moat" Rooney now that he is anything but the "world class" striker he once was is pure fantasy.

I pity everyone who thinks this side will fair any better than any other team to wear the three lions shirt since '66!!!!

 

[Bobby dazzler]

Me thinks my neighbour has been round the block with England too many times before.
Either that or the beer was off last night !

Just stealing myself for our overpaid, pretious national side to flop yet again.

Fell out of love with the national side once Graham Taylor was appointed as national manager and never been won back since.

Building a team around Wayne "Raoul Moat" Rooney now that he is anything but the "world class" striker he once was is pure fantasy.

I pity everyone who thinks this side will fair any better than any other team to where the three lions shirt since '66!!!!

 

[RHB]

Just stealing myself for our overpaid, pretious national side to flop yet again.

Fell out of love with the national side once Graham Taylor was appointed as national manager and never been won back since.

Building a team around Wayne "Raoul Moat" Rooney now that he is anything but the "world class" striker he once was is pure fantasy.

I pity everyone who thinks this side will fair any better than any other team to where the three lions shirt since '66!!!!

I doubt anyone wants your pity. Hopefully you might think better of your national team after this tournament.

 

[davewebbsbrain]

Just stealing myself for our overpaid, pretious national side to flop yet again.

Fell out of love with the national side once Graham Taylor was appointed as national manager and never been won back since.

Building a team around Wayne "Raoul Moat" Rooney now that he is anything but the "world class" striker he once was is pure fantasy.

I pity everyone who thinks this side will fair any better than any other team to where the three lions shirt since '66!!!!

Semi final of the world isn't too shabby

 

[ColinMorrisWalksOnWater]

Semi final of the world isn't too shabby

That was 26 years ago and with all the money floating around in the English Premier league compared to say the German, Argentinian or Dutch is a truely pathetic record.

 

[davewebbsbrain]

That was 26 years ago and with all the money floating around in the English Premier league compared to say the Geman, Argentinian or Dutch is a truely pathetic recourd.

Does it matter that it was 26 years ago? Your statement was any other team to wear the Three lions shirt. Stop moving the goalposts

 

[ColinMorrisWalksOnWater]

WOOh SORRY!! so that's 1 semi final in 12 tournaments and that's a good enough record to make what point exactly apart from abject failure to compete time after time in the final stages of the games major tournament, if we've got there at all that is.

It absolutely does matter that it was 26 years ago, considering every year the expectation levels of the country and the finance behind the FA in this country to organise a national game, deserve so much better.

over the same period since '66, that puts us on a par with that hotbed of International football South Korea.....Marvellous.

And it is not moving the goalposts whatsoever, to use examples that contribute to my original statement, that fall into the period originally referred to.

 

[marlow17101032]

remember watching the game in Elm rd,Leigh...with my father...the last memory i had of him,together.as a child.
Italia 90 was good,but watched the game with my German wife,bought a barrel of "NATCH" cider and got stuck into it...when the Germans went one up,my wife cheered and i went for her!!!lucky for me my mother was over for a holiday and stopped me.After the game,cried.
Euro 96,living in Germany,did not go for the wife,i was older!!..but on site ..the Germans ,who expected to get beaten by us,were very,very quite before the game...but the next day...total C"""S...fell out with most of the site...after losing on pens,sat outside and cried again.

I was working in Germany at the time as well *******s kept me up all night with bloody car horns all night

 

[davewebbsbrain]

WOOh SORRY!! so that's 1 semi final in 12 tournements and that's a good enough record to make what point exactly apart from abject failure to compete time after time in the final stages of the games major tournament, if we've got there at all that is.

It absolutely does matter that it was 26 years ago, considering every year the expectation levels of the country and the finance behind the FA in this country to organise a national game, deserve so much better.

over the same period since '66, that puts us on a par with that hotbed of International football South Korea.....Marvellous.

And it is not moving the goalposts whatsoever, to use examples that contribute to my original statement, that fall into the period originally referred to.

World Cups
8th in 1970 QF
6th in 1982 Second group stage
8th in 1986 QF
4th 1990 SF
6th 2002 QF
7th 2006 QF

Euros
3rd 1968 SF
3rd 1996 SF
5th 2004 QF
5th 2012 QF

As I say, not too shabby. Half the problem is England players are stifled by the influx of foreign players

 

[ColinMorrisWalksOnWater]

World Cups over the period since '66:

50% knocked out before 1/4 finals or not qualified at all.

Have a worse record than:

Argentina, Brazil, Italy, Germany, France, Netherlands, Uruguay and Poland.

and are on a par with:

Belgium, Bulgaria, Sweden, Croatia (And they've only been around as a smaller nation, than the unified Yugoslavia, for 5 world cups and caught us already), South Korea, Turkey and Portugal.


European Championships:

Never reached the final,

Failed to qualify in '72, '76, '84 and '08 - (31%) - Hardly stifled by foreign players as the influx had only got underway some 4 years max, before and we've qualified every time since with the exception of '08!

Have a worse record than:

Germany, France, Spain, Soviet Union, Italy, Czech Republic, Denmark, Netherlands, Yugoslavia, Portugal and Belgium.

As a results based business, game, sport, whever term you prefer it is not impressive for a Nation with our size, finance and player base compared to a lot of those better or with the same record as us. Simply not good enough!

As a non scientific, crude simile I would suggest we are the Newcastle United of International football.

A fan base desperate for success, with a boardroom (FA), that repeatedly screws it up and a team or teams that over the years have repeatedly flattered to deceive.

Football is a passionate sport with many opinions, to which everyone is entitled, but mine is not one where England are a mighty force to be reckoned with beyond all doubt, and despite many differing scenario's of poor selection, bad luck and cheating have failed to perform repeatedly, when at the business end of the major tournaments, demand players to step up to the plate and deliver for the nation's success starved fans. flattering to deceive in qualifying groups that have repeatedly been made easier, by the growing number of nations entering the two major international competitions, does not qualify as success. winning trophies reaching finals and seeing capital cities full of fans celebrating a trophy, with national flags in abundance and any attempt to talk being drowned out by car horns does and it hasn't happened for 50 years and with the greedy self perpetuating management of the FA and the big clubs in the premier leagues insular drive for self enriching fulfillment, probably, I fear it never will, as much as I and every other down to earth "ordinary" football fan wills it to happen.

That your honor is the case for the prosecution

 

[Barling Magna]

They played well yesterday and were unfortunate to draw, but they made many good chances from open play and couldn't score one of them so I guess they only have themselves to blame. Nonetheless, an encouraging performance.

The woodentops fighting in the streets are depressing though......

 

[londonblue]

World Cups
8th in 1970 QF
6th in 1982 Second group stage
8th in 1986 QF
4th 1990 SF
6th 2002 QF
7th 2006 QF

Euros
3rd 1968 SF
3rd 1996 SF
5th 2004 QF
5th 2012 QF

As I say, not too shabby. Half the problem is England players are stifled by the influx of foreign players

The other half is unrealistic expectations. I saw a study somewhere that pretty much shows that England punch almost exactly their weight in international tournaments.

 

[ColinMorrisWalksOnWater]

Sorry, I ommited for the teams with a better European Championship record than us, Greece........Greece!

 

[Jay_SUFC]

They played well yesterday and were unfortunate to draw, but they made many good chances from open play and couldn't score one of them so I guess they only have themselves to blame. Nonetheless, an encouraging performance.

The woodentops fighting in the streets are depressing though......

Yes they did play well and I would blame Hodgson for the result - he took off our quickest player and brings on James 'slower than a cart horse' Milner, that gave us no outlet - still can't work out how he's managed to get 61 caps!!

 

[londonblue]

Yes they did play well and I would blame Hodgson for the result - he took off our quickest player and brings on James 'slower than a cart horse' Milner, that gave us no outlet - still can't work out how he's managed to get 61 caps!!

Not to mention the 423 first team appearances, or the fact that he's played for England U16, U17, U19, U20 and U21 teams. Maybe people in football know more than you do?

 

[jaffa1]

I will defend Jay here. I have always appreciated Mr Milner but he seems to have aged 10 years recently. His last two performances at Wembley were shocking and in the build up to Sevilla's 2nd in the Europa Cup final they passed the ball around him at will. He was off the pace (twice) in the lead up to their corner, from which the guy who provided the assist ghosted past him with ease.

 

[Jay_SUFC]

Not to mention the 423 first team appearances, or the fact that he's played for England U16, U17, U19, U20 and U21 teams. Maybe people in football know more than you do?

I'm sure there are people that know more than me, but Milner is just not good enough and can't understand why is in the squad, let alone how he keeps getting games.

What has club or U12 caps got to do with it? Never said he was a bad player, but just don't think he's good enough now or has been worthy of that many caps at FULL level

 

[londonblue]

I'm sure there are people that know more than me, but Milner is just not good enough and can't understand why is in the squad, let alone how he keeps getting games.

What has club or U12 caps got to do with it? Never said he was a bad player, but just don't think he's good enough now or has been worthy of that many caps at FULL level

I rest my case.

 

[Jay_SUFC]

I rest my case.

Sorry, I'm not allowed to have an opinion then because some people may know more than me

Next time I want to post something I'll check with you first to make sure it's OK and thanks for your valuable feedback