File sharing. What's your opinion?

[Bielzibubz]

With today's anouncement that subscribers to Virgins broardband service are to receive warning letters informing them of the possibility of legal action being taken against them for the downloading and sharing of files I'm intigued to know what you're opinions are.

Personally I think Virgin, and I'm sure that others will follow, have scored a major own goal here. Surely they realise that 'The Net' cannot be policed in this way. Sure, some individuals will get fined and/or their connection terminated but both Virgin and the BMI are deluding themselves if they think this will make the slightest difference to both the amount of files ilegally downloaded and shared and peoples attitudes towards the sharing of those files.

Depending on how far the ISP's are prepared to go along with the BMI's wishes I can see this turning into a major PR disaster for some just when they should be doing all they can to avoid alienating their customers.

Anyway, I'm sure it's been discussed before but it seems now the BMI, and in conjuction with some ISP's, are going to start wielding the proverbial big stick.

 

[seany t]

I get the feeling this is more of a move to appease the music companies who feel like they're being ripped off and which are currently threatening legal action.

But its a tricky one. I personally download the odd mp3 from blogs, and then if I like it largely go and buy the record as a lot of the music I prefer is not overly available on the net anyway, and I still prefer having the actual album as opposed to a set of files regardless.

But I do know of people with 1,000's of mp3s, films and TV shows that pay nowt, never go to gigs or support the artists in anyway at all.

I think that for the good of entertainment, something probably does need to be done to curtail the worst offenders, but that in this financially turbulent times, the issue is likely to only get worse.

 

[Bielzibubz]

I get the feeling this is more of a move to appease the music companies who feel like they're being ripped off and which are currently threatening legal action.

But its a tricky one. I personally download the odd mp3 from blogs, and then if I like it largely go and buy the record as a lot of the music I prefer is not overly available on the net anyway, and I still prefer having the actual album as opposed to a set of files regardless.

But I do know of people with 1,000's of mp3s, films and TV shows that pay nowt, never go to gigs or support the artists in anyway at all.

I think that for the good of entertainment, something probably does need to be done to curtail the worst offenders, but that in this financially turbulent times, the issue is likely to only get worse.

And that throws up another problem. Apparently the checks the BMI are conducting through the ISP's and Virgin in particular do not differentiate between the person that has downloaded one mp3 and the person with 3000 illegal tracks on his pc.

 

[Bob Cratchitt]

What would you say if every ISP in the UK carried out the same approach? Then of course it would be easy to police the Net this way as how would you be able to connect without an ISP?

I believe the reason Virgin has taken this stance is not primarily to do with the legality side of file sharing more a case of the impact of such users has on it's network. No company can advertise as a benefit the ability to download illegal files.

 

[loz]

I don't think it'll be stopped, and also moves like this have the problem of 'flattening out' the idea of file-sharing by treating all behaviour as the same. There's a big difference (as pointed out above) between someone who downloads 1 or 2 tracks from an album to see what it's like and someone who habitually downloads entire records, and there's also a big difference between people who use mp3 blogs (which are actually a great promotional space that record companies increasingly support) and file-sharing networks.

The industry needs to come with a more considered response, and accept that, actually, the notion of a the free-content web has actually proved surprisingly resillient and a space in which people can make money. Think for example of the failure of most attempts by newspapers to charge for content, and the way huge companies have ended up at least having to partially accomodate sites like YouTube. The web changes content delivery so much that the old models don't work anymore, and a lot of UK record companies are going to be left behind if they don't adapt to that. I'm not saying file-sharing is without a moral consequence, but getting music in the future looks like it's going to be free or incredibly cheap at the point of sale, one way or another. Cash is going to have to be made elsewhere, whether by merchandising/tours/targeted ads...

 

[MK Shrimper]

How is file sharing any different from taping stuff of the radio or recording albums on tape like I used to do in the 1980's? If I hear a track I like by a new artist then I'll spend my 79p on I-Tunes - however I "acquired" The Enemy's album via a recommendation on this website and in turn, spend £25 or so going to see them live.

My heart bleeds for the cocaine snorting record execs and bands like Coldplay and U2 with their private jets and supermodel girlfriends.

 

[Andyhsufc]

Virgin media have now released a statement saying that the threats to disconnect people were made in error and that they are only "educating" people. They have not, and will not, pass on names of people to the BPI. And yes it is a waste of time when 8 million people are downloading music worldwide at any one time!

 

[seany t]

I think the bigger culprits are film and media downloaders anyway. They take up GB's of space and require a computer to be running for hours to download a complete file.

And as Loz hints at, half of the major successes in recent years musically have used the net to get them famous (Ting tings, Joss Stone, Lily Allen, Fratellis etc) and done very well out of it when the rest of the country get wise a little later. Also, anyone noticed that gigs (and merchandise) are now double the cost they were a few years back? So I'm sure many of the artists are wise to this already and upping their prices accordingly.

Its just painful to watch those bands caught in the middle getting nothing for all the critical acclaim and downloads, and I hope these up and coming musical acts don't suffer as a consequence.

I still have bigger gripes with artists selling their music exclusively through Starbucks or "donating" their record to the Daily Mail, but then you have to be pretty famous to do that eh?

 

[ozzy-shrimper]

I believe file sharing is fine and legal. MSN is legal and it allows music to be shared around so i see nothing wrong there..

 

[MK Shrimper]

Well it's certainly not legal Ozzy!

 

[MrB]

All these little leaks to the press about fines and legal action are just scaremongering tactics from the industry designed to make your average person have doubts about whether they should download/file share.

 

[Bob Cratchitt]

My heart bleeds for the cocaine snorting record execs and bands like Coldplay and U2 with their private jets and supermodel girlfriends.

So you are advocating stealing?

Then you should also agree with Kid Rock's you tube video telling people if they want to steal his music then go on and why stop there, if you want petrol fill on up and drive off as Petrochemical companies are not exactly short of cash, the same for designer clothes industry, or food from the giant supermarkets.

See a pattern here?

My initial post was that if every ISP in the UK decided to implement this strategy how would you circumvent it? you would have to rely on sneakernet rather than the internet. As it is impossible to track your physical movements involving sharing music as proved prior to the internet explosion to households across the uk. We were left to borrow CD/Albums from friends or the local Libraries and if you were really sad taping from the radio. Wereas the net brings a plethora of repositories previously unavailble. However the net also brings the ability to track usage.

 

[MK Shrimper]

So you are advocating stealing?

Then you should also agree with Kid Rock's you tube video telling people if they want to steal his music then go on and why stop there, if you want petrol fill on up and drive off as Petrochemical companies are not exactly short of cash, the same for designer clothes industry, or food from the giant supermarkets.

See a pattern here?

My initial post was that if every ISP in the UK decided to implement this strategy how would you circumvent it? you would have to rely on sneakernet rather than the internet. As it is impossible to track your physical movements involving sharing music as proved prior to the internet explosion to households across the uk. We were left to borrow CD/Albums from friends or the local Libraries and if you were really sad taping from the radio. Wereas the net brings a plethora of repositories previously unavailble. However the net also brings the ability to track usage.

Oy! As a child of the 1980's you had no option unless your pocket money covered £1.99 for a single which was a bit tricky when I got 50p a week!

I guess I am advocating stealing yes. I'm sure if we could get away with it, we'd all nick petrol, clothes and food from tescos. That's why there are laws to stop us doing it. I have no moral compunction in taking money from these multi-billion pound enterprises who have got their profits on the back of the working man and oppression in the third world, but then I'm an old lefty socialist, what do I know? (and it's completely off topic). Stealing from a corner shop is a different matter of course as is downloading from an artist who's just getting going.

I think the amount of users downloading tracks around the world is phenomenal and is untraceable IMHO - a few individuals will be made scapegoats, but I'm not bothered and I won't stop.

 

[Yer Blues]

file sharing is ilegal and wrong.

 

[Bob Cratchitt]

I think the amount of users downloading tracks around the world in phenomenal and is literally untraceable IMHO.

Do not believe that, we are not talking about a human trying to track the sharing activity. Most of the media industry want to primarily close down the repositories. So they are working on ways to ensure this occurs although at the same time groups of crackers are working to break anything new, it is rather a fascinating area at the moment and is amazing how the are all trying to push the boundaries.

 

[MK Shrimper]

file sharing is ilegal and wrong.

Can you honestly say, hand on heart, that every CD you own you've paid for.

 

[Bielzibubz]

If every IPS went down the route that Virgin have taken as you suggest how long do you think it would be before they realised that they would only be penalising the very people their advertising and marketing men are trying to capture and keep.

As has been said before, the BPI and the bods that run and regulate our music and movie industries have got to come up with a way in which they can keep the revenues coming in to their artists whilst also making the cost of each track/movie cheap enough so that the person who previously saw ilegal downloads as a way to get their music and movies has a viable alternative.

The t'internet will always be a market for those that want to download and share free music and movies and I think it's down to the powers that be to find a viable alternative to the route they seem to be going down, namely prosecution of the offender, regardless of the actual amount that's been downloaded ilegally.

 

[Yer Blues]

Can you honestly say, hand on heart, that every CD you own you've paid for.

yes mate i can

 

[Bob Cratchitt]

Stealing from a corner shop is a different matter of course as is downloading from an artist who's just getting going.

But that is the problem only because you think it is wrong does not mean the rest do, why should they worry if they can take from whoever?

In the end the people who suffer are the small independents as they cannot take such a hit as the big boys.

 

[ozzy-shrimper]

Well it's certainly not legal Ozzy!

Then is MSN legal? Shouldn't it be seen as a file sharing program?