2017 General Election thread

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

Reading through the highlights of the Queens speech, it would appear that May and the Tories Manifesto has all but disappeared.

Considering some of the nonsense that was in it, that isn't such a bad thing.

If these were ordinary times then I would automatically agree that another election should be called, but they aren't especially as article 50 has now been invoked.

In short it's a **** sandwich.

but the people charged with cutting a deal with 27 nations of the EU haven't been able to cut a deal with the 10 MPs of the DUP. They announce they had a deal, then DUP denied it had been agreed. So rather than keep this government because of EU negotiations I'd say the opposite, re-elect before we are in too deep. That way you'd get a choice of Labour or Conservatives under a different leader. Whatever your political leanings either option must be an upgrade. Having negotiations headed by a leader that will still be there at the end of them is imperative. May had to pick up the crap that Cameron left behind, and someone else will end up doing the same for her. Start afresh with someone who is in for the long haul. Country before party.

 

[callan]

but the people charged with cutting a deal with 27 nations of the EU haven't been able to cut a deal with the 10 MPs of the DUP. They announce they had a deal, then DUP denied it had been agreed. So rather than keep this government because of EU negotiations I'd say the opposite, re-elect before we are in too deep. That way you'd get a choice of Labour or Conservatives under a different leader. Whatever your political leanings either option must be an upgrade. Having negotiations headed by a leader that will still be there at the end of them is imperative. May had to pick up the crap that Cameron left behind, and someone else will end up doing the same for her. Start afresh with someone who is in for the long haul. Country before party.

I agree with most of what you say...however the clock is now ticking with regards the negotiations and my take is that we are already in too deep, what the country needs is a strong cross party consensus for Brexit rather than another election....which could mean a minority Labour government rather than a fresh election which potentially may not lead us much further away from the position we are currently in.

 

[Pubey]

 

[GBJ]

What is anti-democratic about a protest?

Placards reading "bring down the government" are fairly anti-democratic, no?

 

[Pubey]

Placards reading "bring down the government" are fairly anti-democratic, no?

Not really, no.

 

[Pubey]

Remember the stick Diane Abbott got? Well Boris has car crashed big time:

 

[Benfleet A1]

Remember the stick Diane Abbott got? Well Boris has car crashed big time:

Maybe he could blame it on diabetes.

 

[rigsby]

Proving what us Brexitiers have known all along. If hundreds of thousands of Polish workers head for Britain then wages will go up in their country and be driven down in ours. Its always been the same since Roman times. They complained the Brits who worked on Hadrian's Wall charged to much.

 

[Another Surrey Shrimper]

Remember the stick Diane Abbott got? Well Boris has car crashed big time:

the thing was probably still being written this morning, I bet if May was quizzed on it she'd have the same 'I don't actually know' undercurrent in her answers. The government have declined the invitation to have a representative on Newsnight. They should be eager to explain and discuss this great new dawn, instead its policy on the hoof that lasts 2 years.

 

[callan]

the thing was probably still being written this morning, I bet if May was quizzed on it she'd have the same 'I don't actually know' undercurrent in her answers. The government have declined the invitation to have a representative on Newsnight. They should be eager to explain and discuss this great new dawn, instead its policy on the hoof that lasts 2 years.

My understanding was that it was still being written and amended until late last night so you aren't far out.

 

[Pubey]

Proving what us Brexitiers have known all along. If hundreds of thousands of Polish workers head for Britain then wages will go up in their country and be driven down in ours. Its always been the same since Roman times. They complained the Brits who worked on Hadrian's Wall charged to much.

Germany has a similar number of Polish migrants to the UK, so your argument doesn't really stack up.

 

[rigsby]

Germany has a similar number of Polish migrants to the UK, so your argument doesn't really stack up.

Are you seriously trying to claim that millions of unskilled EU and commonwealth workers do not have an effect on all the low paid jobs in Britain.

 

[Tangled up in Blue]

Proving what us Brexitiers have known all along. If hundreds of thousands of Polish workers head for Britain then wages will go up in their country and be driven down in ours. Its always been the same since Roman times. They complained the Brits who worked on Hadrian's Wall charged to much.

Germany has a similar number of Polish migrants to the UK, so your argument doesn't really stack up.

Are you seriously trying to claim that millions of unskilled EU and commonwealth workers do not have an effect on all the low paid jobs in Britain.

It's fairly well known that professionals in Spain earn sometning like 20% less than they could earn in the UK (or elsewhere in the EU).That doesn't stop them coming (or staying) here though.:smile:

It's something that even entry level workers (like our younger daughter) are keenly aware of.She's happy to be working for the company where she also did her internship but my guess is that she'll be off by the end of the year.

 

[Pubey]

Are you seriously trying to claim that millions of unskilled EU and commonwealth workers do not have an effect on all the low paid jobs in Britain.

No, but that's also not what I posted in the first place.

 

[maninasuitcase]

Proving what us Brexitiers have known all along. If hundreds of thousands of Polish workers head for Britain then wages will go up in their country and be driven down in ours. Its always been the same since Roman times. They complained the Brits who worked on Hadrian's Wall charged to much.

That is something you just made up isn't it?

The Migration Observatory, who actually did some research on the subject, suggest that migration has a minimum affect on wages.

 

[callan]

That is something you just made up isn't it?

The Migration Observatory, who actually did some research on the subject, suggest that migration has a minimum affect on wages.

The reason that wages have gone up in Poland is certainly the exodus of Polish workers into the EU.

The Migration watch research (not it's own) was quite clear that wages were more significantly impacted on lower skilled workers.

Full fact offer the following;

The Bank of England found that a 10% increase in the proportion of foreign born workers in lower paid service jobs was associated with a near 2% fall in average pay for those jobs, when focusing on particular regions.

Ultimately it isn't as simple as arguing one case or the other....as there are all sorts of elements that need to be considered not just inward migration.

 

[Sandbach Shrimper]

Why do so many Poles come to the UK then?

 

[Pubey]

Why do so many Poles come to the UK then?

Job market, earnings potential, lifestyle, quality of life etc etc etc.

 

[rigsby]

That is something you just made up isn't it?

The Migration Observatory, who actually did some research on the subject, suggest that migration has a minimum affect on wages.

Don't tell me you read it in the Guardian.

If you work in the building trade for example your wages are lower than they were 12 years ago. If your an emergency worker your wages are lower than they were 10 years ago (1% rise but lose an allowance is actually a pay cut).

If your a Banker, Landlord or human rights lawyer then your wages have increased. If your an MP your wages have increased (11% rise one year).

Maybe you should get out and about a bit more and speak to people you might be surprised to find that even reamainers aren't buying the "we can't survive without all the immigrants" propaganda.

Besides the Labour party want to end freedom of movement and JC is the man we can all trust and we absolutely know he won't let us down.

 

[southendkid]

Why do so many Poles come to the UK then?

Because 20% on top of €8000 is still a lot lower than what you can earn here.