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Coronavirus (Non-Politics)

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Can anyone offer an insight into how local hospital admission levels have been over the last few months compared to a normal year?

Is it significantly worse than most years when we are told the NHS is stretched to breaking point or is this a whole new level?

Not just talking about Covid but numbers in general.

Thanks
 
Can anyone offer an insight into how local hospital admission levels have been over the last few months compared to a normal year?

Is it significantly worse than most years when we are told the NHS is stretched to breaking point or is this a whole new level?

Not just talking about Covid but numbers in general.

Thanks
There are challenges with understanding the data and it’s not something I’ve looked into extensively.

anecdotally, Southend and Basildon are extremely busy at present, according to family members who work there. My Dad works at Fair Havens and they’re very busy too.
 
There are challenges with understanding the data and it’s not something I’ve looked into extensively.

anecdotally, Southend and Basildon are extremely busy at present, according to family members who work there. My Dad works at Fair Havens and they’re very busy too.

Thank you, this is the trouble that the data is either hard to compare of it's not being shared at all.

No one seems to be having the discussion on whether things are way worse than the usual Autumn/Winter influx of hospitialisations because everything is just Covid, Covid.

Until this clear transparent reporting and dicussion happens then people will just question the accuracy of data being reported selectively or claim the reason it isn't shown is because it's not there.

Covid is clearly having a big impact but is it alongside other long standing issues or in addition.

I also hate the way anyone who wants to discuss the bigger picture and have a sensible debate about it is labelled a Covidiot or some such nonsense.

The world is close to imploding on itself
 
Thank you, this is the trouble that the data is either hard to compare of it's not being shared at all.

No one seems to be having the discussion on whether things are way worse than the usual Autumn/Winter influx of hospitialisations because everything is just Covid, Covid.

Until this clear transparent reporting and dicussion happens then people will just question the accuracy of data being reported selectively or claim the reason it isn't shown is because it's not there.

Covid is clearly having a big impact but is it alongside other long standing issues or in addition.

I also hate the way anyone who wants to discuss the bigger picture and have a sensible debate about it is labelled a Covidiot or some such nonsense.

The world is close to imploding on itself
I imagine that customised reports are being made and used at senior level but there's a number of things that are unprecedented that makes the data difficult:

- the traditional dashboards of NHS capacity/occupancy don't tend to split admissions by their type. So you don't get a clear understanding about the impact of flu or cancer or whatever is causing the NHS/intensive care to be busy. We know that capacity and occupancy are affected by seasonality (the flu season and cold weather means there are more hospitalizations during the winter). The NHS plans for this and makes provisions to ensure they have ICU beds availability as much as possible. So there hasn't been a reason to really break apart occupancy by reason of admission. All of the data is retrospective as well, so we don't get detailed realtime data, it takes a few weeks to trickle through and be processed and understood.

- data processing/analysis has only become interesting in the last 9 months. There are lots of reports and dashboards that are generated because the NHS is large and complex, but the NHS budget has been cut in real terms for several years and 'information analysts' and other 'admin/managerial' roles are the first to be slashed. People go on about bureaucracy in the NHS, but it's not doctors and nurses who process all this data and generate reports, and they are important for planning.

- I do think the government have been reasonably open with their sharing of data. However, we've had a lot of 'twitter experts' deciding to interrogate graphs and put their own biases on things. And it's the media as well, last week Robert Peston was asking moronic questions about vaccines on Twitter to his 1m followers that add fuel for vaccine-hesitancy. He should know better and actually speak to experts, rather than just sounding off and causing even more issues.

- When COVID hit, a number of things were done to the NHS which was dramatic, and perhaps with the benefit of hindsight overly cautious. Wards were cleared, non-urgent operations were cancelled, screening and treatments were paused. These actions will have caused harm to those who needed the NHS but it wasn't then available to them. Answering the question of "was it worth it" is important, but we didn't have the information 9 months ago that we had now. We didn't know the main ways in which the virus spread - remember people were really concerned about fomite/surface transmission, and not about airborne particles, but in fact, we got that complete the wrong way around. People were concerned about general mixing and the R-number being something applicable to everyone, but in fact, it seems that the virus is spread through 'super spreaders' and there is plenty of evidence that people can share a bed for weeks and not infect a partner, which means that testing was much more important and we gave up on track and trace very quickly. The bottom line is that we didn't have time to wait and we had to make decisions based on the information available at the time. I'm not an apologist for the decisions that were made by any means, but we do know that 10,000s have died due to COVID, many could have been saved if we moved more quickly, which would have enabled us to get back to normal in terms of the NHS more quickly. If we'd have done nothing then the death toll would have been many times higher. Remember Boris bragging about going into hospitals and shaking hands with people, 1 month later he was in intensive care. This is why people are angry with the response, because if we'd have got a grip on COVID more quickly, then it would have had a positive impact on wider health, the economy, jobs etc. Instead, we've been stuck in a limbo for months. Even now, we're seeing rising cases a couple of weeks after the government suggested relaxing things for Christmas. London should be in tier 3 with mass testing, but it's in tier 2 currently with talk of mass testing, but greater manchester has been in tier 3 for months without any mass testing and cases/admissions lower than much of the south.

I agree with your point that the impact of COVID is in addition with so much else that's happening. Widening inequality, increasing physical and mental health issues, poor education standards etc. All the talk at the moment is of the K-recovery, where inequality will widen even further due to COVID. I think COVID has accelerated many things that were brewing in this country and globally. It's clear that many jobs that have been lost won't come back.
 
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A 'friend of a friend'-type contact who works for Essex Police says they've been briefed that it's Tier 3 for Essex/London from next week and likely persisting, if not another national lockdown, in January.
Aside from shutting the schools isn't it a bit late to bring in Tier 3 given that we're doing a nationwide lifting of restrictions from the 23rd? We've seen from previous lockdowns that people crowd into the pubs the day before restrictions force them to shut, causing a spike. With the 4 week lockdown the gain from those 4 weeks of lockdown offset the damage of that spike but will there be enough benefit from 7 days of Tier 3 to offset the pub rush damage from the day before it comes in?
 
Aside from shutting the schools isn't it a bit late to bring in Tier 3 given that we're doing a nationwide lifting of restrictions from the 23rd? We've seen from previous lockdowns that people crowd into the pubs the day before restrictions force them to shut, causing a spike. With the 4 week lockdown the gain from those 4 weeks of lockdown offset the damage of that spike but will there be enough benefit from 7 days of Tier 3 to offset the pub rush damage from the day before it comes in?

It seems to me that it's likey to happen whether you approve or not.Look at Germany for example.

I get that there are anomolies however.You don't have to look any further than France, where all bars,restaurants and cinemas are currently closed and Spain where they're all open (though there is a 10pm curfew here).

Xmas is going to be a tricky time for all families and we're all going to have to make some difficult decisions.
 
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Aside from shutting the schools isn't it a bit late to bring in Tier 3 given that we're doing a nationwide lifting of restrictions from the 23rd? We've seen from previous lockdowns that people crowd into the pubs the day before restrictions force them to shut, causing a spike. With the 4 week lockdown the gain from those 4 weeks of lockdown offset the damage of that spike but will there be enough benefit from 7 days of Tier 3 to offset the pub rush damage from the day before it comes in?

I honestly think if they hadn't already announced the Christmas easing of restrictions they now wouldn't do it. Can definitely see Tier 3 incoming though.
 
BBC News stating again that cases in Essex, Kent and London rising exponentially. This is seriously worrying as we are soon to be in a relaxation of the rules for 5 days. I really won’t be surprised if we see 1k daily deaths come January.

People need to be sensible, but are clearly not. Know of people who are breaking rules and meeting with others in houses.

Bojo needs to rescind the 5 days easing, to maybe only Christmas and Boxing Day, but you know the Tories are too weak and are putting popularity and ‘votes’ ahead of lives.
 
Basildon rates now 3rd highest in the U.K. at over 600 per 100k. When/how did that happen??

One reason will be the mass testing in Basildon - so you're going to find the 20 to 30% of cases that show no symptoms and would't normally have bothered with a test
 
Data is a couple of weeks old - but is the latest on Essex council website. Suggests to me school kids are not the only reason

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transmission occurs through schools but it's understood to be mainly through teachers. So teachers are the main vector of transmission and it's in schools where they come into contact with other teachers or with pupils/parents where transmission is occurring. I know multiple teachers who've had it.

Working in manufacturing, food processing, and the service industry continues to be a big transmission vector as well.
 
transmission occurs through schools but it's understood to be mainly through teachers. So teachers are the main vector of transmission and it's in schools where they come into contact with other teachers or with pupils/parents where transmission is occurring. I know multiple teachers who've had it.
Could that be down to kids rarely getting seriously ill from Covid though? If kids have Covid but don't feel ill then they aren't going to get tested (unless they are in a high-Covid area where the government has enforced mandatory school testing), so a school isn't going to realise Covid is going around until one of the teachers catches it and feels ill enough to get a test. If that happened then even if the kids were the original source of the outbreak in a school a teacher would be the first case to actually be picked up on and they'd be listed as the origin.
 
Announcement incoming shortly. Doesn't sound like all of Essex but most of the South. Appears to be from midnight tomorrow so enjoy the Hall whilst you can!
 
Announcement incoming shortly. Doesn't sound like all of Essex but most of the South. Appears to be from midnight tomorrow so enjoy the Hall whilst you can!

The only thing that really changes from Tier 2 to Tier 3 is the closing of hospitality completely (it's closed all but in name anyway) and you can't go and watch a sports event.

Everything else stays open or the rule of six outdoors. You can still go to work and travel on public transport with the great unwashed and share an office with random people and also shop or go to the gym with others.

It's not really any different except stopping anything pleasurable. I suppose it's either that or the country goes bankrupt and kids miss out on their education and we ruin a whole generation so probably a fair balance.

If i have to go without being allowed to see my friends and family for these reasons for a few more months then so be it even though I am opposed to this.
 
Southend announced as in Tier 3. Happy Christmas all. In Mr Handc.o.c.k's staement to the House he stated that they have discovered a new strain of the virus which appears to have developed very quickly in the South East causing the increase in numbers in the area. It comes into effect from 00:01 on Wednesday morning.
 
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