Evening chaps, Watford fan here

[Shrimper2thecore]

I am hoping we can keep him for the season, we go up, and then Watford let us keep him on loan to test him in league 1 next season.

 

[Csboy]

Here we go ...... a different point of view ....... obviously pleased that Britt is scoring goals and then some more goals ........... but I can't say that I am happy that it is a loan player getting us points rather than our own contracted players.

What is the point of the loan system? Watford get a player developed "for free" and may make millions from it whilst we (S.U.F.C.) get a temporary lift from the situation, the club is left without an asset come the end of the loan period. Without the loan system in place, might it not be the case that Britt and other talented youngsters would be in lower league clubs on contracts and then being sold on .............. you know, like it was for many years before the loan system. I've lost count of the number of loan players who have scored against us so perhaps it just evens itself up over time.

So, good for Southend United in the short term (? until Christmas) ...... but what about the longer term, I ask?

Totally agree with you. I don't like the loan system either yes it benefits us in the short term but long term we have nothing to show for developing a player. I would be very interested to know how many loan players Crewe have taken over the last few years. They are a great example of how to develop their own players. Sadly Southend for many years have just looked at the short term solution which is one of the reasons the club is in such a financial mess.

 

[Rayleigh Weir]

Totally agree with you. I don't like the loan system either yes it benefits us in the short term but long term we have nothing to show for developing a player. I would be very interested to know how many loan players Crewe have taken over the last few years. They are a great example of how to develop their own players. Sadly Southend for many years have just looked at the short term solution which is one of the reasons the club is in such a financial mess.

I'd say that Ricky Duncan and our highly regarded youth system might disagree with you there...

 

[londonblue]

I'd say that Ricky Duncan and our highly regarded youth system might disagree with you there...

Indeed. Whatever else has gone on, one thing RM got absolutely right was investing in the youth system.

 

[MK Shrimper]

But how many from the youth team make the 1st team?

 

[londonblue]

But how many from the youth team make the 1st team?

That's a different debate. The issue was that we are short termist. We're not. We have a good youth set up (for a League 2 side), which does bring players through.

 

[MK Shrimper]

That's a different debate. The issue was that we are short termist. We're not. We have a good youth set up (for a League 2 side), which does bring players through.

I think it's a very fair question. Surely a good youth system would mean that our 1st team would be stuffed with players that once played in our youth system. It's not and never has been.

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

I think it's a very fair question. Moussa is about the only one I can think of and he hardly set the world alight.

Er, Kane Ferdinand?

 

[chapperzUK]

Totally agree with you. I don't like the loan system either yes it benefits us in the short term but long term we have nothing to show for developing a player. I would be very interested to know how many loan players Crewe have taken over the last few years. They are a great example of how to develop their own players. Sadly Southend for many years have just looked at the short term solution which is one of the reasons the club is in such a financial mess.

Crewe have 3 players on loan, one from Colchester. Crewe have been producing talent for decades and have established themselves, therefore making it easier to persuade up-and-coming talent to come to them.

I think the loan system is great, but only when used correctly. As in for short-term cover for an injury (i.e. Belford), if a quality player is available (i.e. Dervite a few seasons ago) or for a "try before you buy" (like we did with Grant).

Switching to the other side, we have also sent players out on loan to gain experience and to help the budget (remember sending Revell out on loan). Do while we are moaning about developing players and getting "no return", but we are doing the same thing.

 

[MK Shrimper]

Er, Kane Ferdinand?

Ok, agreed forgot Kane, but that's 2....Woodyard who's going to be played in spits and spots until he's released?

 

[chapperzUK]

Ok, agreed forgot Kane, but that's 2....Woodyard who's going to be played in spits and spots until he's released?

We've got a couple from this year's group that have made the bench. We've been running the CoE for 7 years now (since 2005) and sold some to Premierleague & Championship clubs. Can't expect to be bringing through several players from the youth system to the first team. Some of the top academies only manage to bring through 1 or 2 to the first team squad, let alone the bench.

 

[Cockle43]

I would hope that we can keep Britt for the season, I agree however with what a few have said about the loan system, I don't like it either but it is becoming a bit of a way of life in the lower leagues, I'm afraid.

Keeping the subject to Watford, they currently have, IIRC, 11 loanees themselves from Italy and there was a very interesting article in the Telegraph over the weekend about how their new Italian owners saw it as a necessary step towards their longer term plans, an approach which had been very successful with their other club Udinese, who had been in a Watford position but are now pushing for a Champions League place. Their philosphy would point to three or four of those loans becoming permanent but also they like to develop their own players and like to put them on long term contracts, even up to five years in some cases; so couldn't see Britt becoming available too soon....

 

[chapperzUK]

I would hope that we can keep Britt for the season, I agree however with what a few have said about the loan system, I don't like it either but it is becoming a bit of a way of life in the lower leagues, I'm afraid.

Keeping the subject to Watford, they currently have, IIRC, 11 loanees themselves from Italy and there was a very interesting article in the Telegraph over the weekend about how their new Italian owners saw it as a necessary step towards their longer term plans, an approach which had been very successful with their other club Udinese, who had been in a Watford position but are now pushing for a Champions League place. Their philosphy would point to three or four of those loans becoming permanent but also they like to develop their own players and like to put them on long term contracts, even up to five years in some cases; so couldn't see Britt becoming available too soon....

Heard they have done that already to some of their own young players. Britt's contract runs until next summer with an option for another year. Hopefully he says here, fires us to promotion and then we can get him back for another season in League One. Key word there being hopefully. I can see why they would want to send him out on loan at League One, but he is settled here and doing well.

Also, remember after Sawyer's first loan spell, Chelsea got him back and sent him out to Coventry on a very unsuccessful trial?

 

[Rattus Norvegicus]

I think the loan system is great, but only when used correctly. As in for short-term cover for an injury (i.e. Belford), if a quality player is available (i.e. Dervite a few seasons ago) or for a "try before you buy" (like we did with Grant).

Switching to the other side, we have also sent players out on loan to gain experience and to help the budget (remember sending Revell out on loan). Do while we are moaning about developing players and getting "no return", but we are doing the same thing.

Oh yes. Agreed - whilst the loan system is here, we (S.U.F.C.) cannot just take the moral high ground and not explore what benefits there are .......... but that doesn't stop me from "campaigning" for a change in the system, that for me, brings more benefits to the clubs with larger budgets at the expense of the clubs with smaller budgets - even if we were back in Division 2 and loaning out players for development, I would be against the current loan system on the basis that it creates an evener greater imbalance just at a time when so many clubs are struggling financially.

There we are ......... all said and done! :winking:

 

[Shrimpers are Magic]

Ok, agreed forgot Kane, but that's 2....Woodyard who's going to be played in spits and spots until he's released?

Made a fair bit on a couple of players last season didn't we? One lad went to Everton I think and the other to Palace.
The youth system is a very positive thing for the club.

 

[united we stand]

Totally agree with you. I don't like the loan system either yes it benefits us in the short term but long term we have nothing to show for developing a player. I would be very interested to know how many loan players Crewe have taken over the last few years. They are a great example of how to develop their own players. Sadly Southend for many years have just looked at the short term solution which is one of the reasons the club is in such a financial mess.

Yes , what Crewe do is excellent , but Unfortuantely we dont have the £500.000 a year that it costs Crewe to run their accademy

 

[Shrimper2thecore]

Yes , what Crewe do is excellent , but Unfortuantely we dont have the £500.000 a year that it costs Crewe to run their accademy

In the war chest we do.

I wonder where that is...

 

[EastStandBlue]

I think it's a very fair question. Surely a good youth system would mean that our 1st team would be stuffed with players that once played in our youth system. It's not and never has been.

Well, yes and no.

The purpose of a successful youth system is not only to develop youngsters for our own senior team, but for other senior teams too. In recent years we've made money from a fair few players who've gone on to bigger and better things. Abalimba, Ngoo, Orenuga and Della Verde have all commanded fees, and only Della Verde and Ngoo still have the chance to actually do something at that level. Abalimba bombed out of Derby and Orenuga spent his apprenticeship with Everton not really doing much.

Still, if it's products for own disposal that you're after, then you stand every chance of being satisfied in the coming years. There really are some great little players coming through now, like Paxman, Chambers (the goalkeeper), Payne, Njie and maybe Mullings.


Back onto the subject of Assombalonga, my Watford-supporting friend is fairly convinced that the Pozzos want him at a League One club after January at an absolute minimum to see how he does.

 

[McNasty]

Well, yes and no.

The purpose of a successful youth system is not only to develop youngsters for our own senior team, but for other senior teams too. In recent years we've made money from a fair few players who've gone on to bigger and better things. Abalimba, Ngoo, Orenuga and Della Verde have all commanded fees, and only Della Verde and Ngoo still have the chance to actually do something at that level. Abalimba bombed out of Derby and Orenuga spent his apprenticeship with Everton not really doing much.

Still, if it's products for own disposal that you're after, then you stand every chance of being satisfied in the coming years. There really are some great little players coming through now, like Paxman, Chambers (the goalkeeper), Payne, Njie and maybe Mullings.


Back onto the subject of Assombalonga, my Watford-supporting friend is fairly convinced that the Pozzos want him at a League One club after January at an absolute minimum to see how he does.

Let's hope that we win all our games till he returns to give us a good chance later in the season.

 

[Rattus Norvegicus]

Back onto the subject of Assombalonga, my Watford-supporting friend is fairly convinced that the Pozzos want him at a League One club after January at an absolute minimum to see how he does.

Indeed. And that leaves Southend where?

Hopefully in the top part of the league!

Perhaps once Hall and Bilel are off the books and some of the injuries are sorted we will still be in a position to fight for promotion ......... we still have Fred, Bomber, Tomlin and Benyon. Good days.