GNVQs and BTECs and other qualifications that aren't GCSEs/A-levels/Degrees

[Yorkshire Blue]

How do these work from a grading perspective?

Are they easier to pass than to fail?

How do you tell a good student from these qualifications?

Would be particularly interested to hear from people who have employed candidates who have these qualifications.

 

[chadded]

Forget qualifications, I've realised the only thing you need to get to the top is a good blow job technique.

 

[Pubey]

How do these work from a grading perspective?

Are they easier to pass than to fail?

How do you tell a good student from these qualifications?

Would be particularly interested to hear from people who have employed candidates who have these qualifications.

Do you want to know if they're a good student or a good potential employee?

 

[ibwiajwa]

Level 2 BTECs (in other words, the 'GCSE equivalent' BTECs) are a bit of a joke t.b.h.. I taught the Performing Arts one about 4 years ago and a monkey could have passed it. One boy who took the course would have been low down in what used to be called 'remedial' classes when I was a kid. He made up a music composition that sounded like a couple of St Bernards having a fight on a piano keyboard and still passed. When the moderator from the exam board was watching a video of his drama, she literally stopped the video in a freezeframe and said 'He's in role THERE' and ticked the 'able to perform in role' box. The result was that he gained a qualification worth two GCSEs at grade A-C.....

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

Forget qualifications, I've realised the only thing you need to get to the top is a good blow job technique.

Thanks, I did wonder how you got your current job.

Do you want to know if they're a good student or a good potential employee?

Ultimately whether they will be a good potential employee. I'm looking for someone who has demonstrated the capacity to learn.

 

[South Bank Hank]

Ultimately whether they will be a good potential employee. I'm looking for someone who has demonstrated the capacity to learn.

Tell them they haven't got the job and send them on their way. If they re-apply, then it's clear they haven't learned from the experience. It's flawless.

 

[OldBlueLady]

I thought the NVQs were supposed to be comparative to GCSEs and A-levels, slightly less than, so a level 1 is below a GCSE C grade pass, a level 2 between a GCSE and A-level and a level 3 just above an A-level......I could be wrong! My level 3 was supposed to have taken 18 months but I did it in 9, although I did work bloody non stop on it. That goes back to what was instilled in me at school though, which seems rather different these days. It certainly wasn't easy, but that depended on how much "direction" you wanted to take from your assessor, who could basically write the whole thing for you if you let them.

 

[Holy Joe]

Back in the day when I did BTEC ONC and HNC each individual unit (module?) was graded - so if it is still the same I would suggest asking what the units were and what the grades were in each unit. I did pretty well in m BTEC's and when I went to Uni was equal, if not in advance, of many A-level students. I guess it also depends on what subject the BTEC is in - mine were Civil Engineering so a reasonably academic subject - some of them maybe more practical in nature.

This may help assess the subject matter

http://www.edexcel.com/quals/hn/Pages/default.aspx

 

[osymandus]

Thanks, I did wonder how you got your current job.



Ultimately whether they will be a good potential employee. I'm looking for someone who has demonstrated the capacity to learn.

A good student is one who learns , the employee is one who follows . Which do you want ?

 

[Rudi Luftwaffe]

A good student is one who learns , the employee is one who follows . Which do you want ?

With all due respect I want the one that doesn't come out with **** like this........and holds starred/congratulatorly first in a mathematical discipline from Oxbridge.

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

I thought the NVQs were supposed to be comparative to GCSEs and A-levels, slightly less than, so a level 1 is below a GCSE C grade pass, a level 2 between a GCSE and A-level and a level 3 just above an A-level......I could be wrong! My level 3 was supposed to have taken 18 months but I did it in 9, although I did work bloody non stop on it. That goes back to what was instilled in me at school though, which seems rather different these days. It certainly wasn't easy, but that depended on how much "direction" you wanted to take from your assessor, who could basically write the whole thing for you if you let them.

This is the type of thing I'm concerned about.

Back in the day when I did BTEC ONC and HNC each individual unit (module?) was graded - so if it is still the same I would suggest asking what the units were and what the grades were in each unit. I did pretty well in m BTEC's and when I went to Uni was equal, if not in advance, of many A-level students. I guess it also depends on what subject the BTEC is in - mine were Civil Engineering so a reasonably academic subject - some of them maybe more practical in nature.

This may help assess the subject matter

http://www.edexcel.com/quals/hn/Pages/default.aspx

Thanks

A good student is one who learns , the employee is one who follows . Which do you want ?

Anyone who comes up with that type of **** in their CV/interview will get instantly rejected.

 

[haveaguiness]

I did a BTEC National Diploma in Graphic Design before heading off to University to do Graphic Communication. As I understand it a BTEC ND is equivalent to 3 A-levels. Most of the people I went to college with however were doing 4 A-levels, but these generally consisted of one A-level that was so easy to pass you would not even need to attend the classes.

I, on the other hand only did Graphic Design for the entire 2 years I was there, so essentially specialising in that subject, yet still attending for the same amount of time as the other college students. And believe me it was hard work!!!

In terms of looking for people though, I find you can generally tell from a CV and an interview whether someone is going to be a good employee, I used to work part time for Lloyds TSB whilst I was at College too and used to get to actually do some of the interviews (despite only being 16/17) and even I could tell then which of them would be taken on and do well.

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

I did a BTEC National Diploma in Graphic Design before heading off to University to do Graphic Communication. As I understand it a BTEC ND is equivalent to 3 A-levels. Most of the people I went to college with however were doing 4 A-levels, but these generally consisted of one A-level that was so easy to pass you would not even need to attend the classes.

I, on the other hand only did Graphic Design for the entire 2 years I was there, so essentially specialising in that subject, yet still attending for the same amount of time as the other college students. And believe me it was hard work!!!

In terms of looking for people though, I find you can generally tell from a CV and an interview whether someone is going to be a good employee, I used to work part time for Lloyds TSB whilst I was at College too and used to get to actually do some of the interviews (despite only being 16/17) and even I could tell then which of them would be taken on and do well.

Thanks. Do you think at University that your BTEC put you ahead of those who'd studied A-levels?

Whilst I agree you can generally tell from a CV and an interview, I need to establish who to interview. The CVs seem to all be from recruitment companies, so are bland beyond belief. Fortunately, the majority seem to be riddled with spelling mistakes despite the job criteria specifying the need for attention to detail, so it shouldn't be hard to cull. Bad luck if you're signed up with an illiterate recruitment consultant.

 

[Pubey]

I did a BTEC National Diploma in Graphic Design before heading off to University to do Graphic Communication. As I understand it a BTEC ND is equivalent to 3 A-levels. Most of the people I went to college with however were doing 4 A-levels, but these generally consisted of one A-level that was so easy to pass you would not even need to attend the classes.

I, on the other hand only did Graphic Design for the entire 2 years I was there, so essentially specialising in that subject, yet still attending for the same amount of time as the other college students. And believe me it was hard work!!!

In terms of looking for people though, I find you can generally tell from a CV and an interview whether someone is going to be a good employee, I used to work part time for Lloyds TSB whilst I was at College too and used to get to actually do some of the interviews (despite only being 16/17) and even I could tell then which of them would be taken on and do well.

I don't know too much about BTECs/GNVQs but you post confirms the little I did know. They're practical and the higher levels are pretty advanced qualifications that require a lot of effort.

YB - if you want someone who is a good learner then a broader selection of qualifications is probably more useful that a narrower and more specific qualification. So using the graphic design BTEC ND example, then if you're looking for a graphic designer then it seems a logical choice, but for an all rounder then a mixture of numerate, analytical and creative subjects might be a better bet (although a graphic design qualification probably covers all of these to an extent!!). Recruitment is a real challenge where I work, I was interviewing a few weeks ago and whilst we are academic and more concerned with publications and research grants, you can often tell from some qualifications that they have a bit of a normal side to them rather than a-levels/degrees full of maths, physics and further maths, the applicant with a random art or music a level thrown in might have a bit of character which is often important.

 

[YoungWestcliffShrimper]

This is my first post on here but thought I would post as I am currently doing a level 3 Btec. Btecs are coursework based and you get graded either Pass, Merit, Distinction which is equivalent to c,b,a respectively. But basically if they only have a pass it means they have not put any extra work into the course and has only done the bare minimum. A merit is meant to show that you understand the subject area in some detail and a distinction meaning you understand it in a lot of detail and this person would have done a lot of extra work to get the grade. In answer to your questions then; they are easier to pass than a-levels, and the good student’s are the ones with merit and distinctions

 

[Pubey]

This is my first post on here but thought I would post as I am currently doing a level 3 Btec. Btecs are coursework based and you get graded either Pass, Merit, Distinction which is equivalent to c,b,a respectively. But basically if they only have a pass it means they have not put any extra work into the course and has only done the bare minimum. A merit is meant to show that you understand the subject area in some detail and a distinction meaning you understand it in a lot of detail and this person would have done a lot of extra work to get the grade. In answer to your questions then; they are easier to pass than a-levels, and the good student’s are the ones with merit and distinctions

Good first post, welcome!

 

[pringlejon]

Thanks. Do you think at University that your BTEC put you ahead of those who'd studied A-levels?

Whilst I agree you can generally tell from a CV and an interview, I need to establish who to interview. The CVs seem to all be from recruitment companies, so are bland beyond belief. Fortunately, the majority seem to be riddled with spelling mistakes despite the job criteria specifying the need for attention to detail, so it shouldn't be hard to cull. Bad luck if you're signed up with an illiterate recruitment consultant.

Just out of interest, what job are you looking to fill...?

 

[osymandus]

With all due respect I want the one that doesn't come out with **** like this........and holds starred/congratulatorly first in a mathematical discipline from Oxbridge.

Explains why the world is in such a mess then, well a first in mathematics is wonderful but their normally rubbish at fixing car's , co-ordinating social events or interacting with none autistic people ;) .
YB . Your rejection would enrich their lives .

 

[ibwiajwa]

This is my first post on here but thought I would post as I am currently doing a level 3 Btec. Btecs are coursework based and you get graded either Pass, Merit, Distinction which is equivalent to c,b,a respectively. But basically if they only have a pass it means they have not put any extra work into the course and has only done the bare minimum. A merit is meant to show that you understand the subject area in some detail and a distinction meaning you understand it in a lot of detail and this person would have done a lot of extra work to get the grade. In answer to your questions then; they are easier to pass than a-levels, and the good student’s are the ones with merit and distinctions

Good post - spot on about the pass grade. The Wolf report, that was recently commissioned by the government, rates BTEC Nationals (level 3) but criticises the level 2 qualification. Wolf also criticises the levels system across the board, saying that the equivalency calculations are pretty arbitrary. She also takes a pop at schools (rightly IMO) for 'playing the game' in regard to the performance thresholds, entering students for 'easier' qualifications to improve their standing rather than helping students. It is worth knowing that many of the 'better' universities do not accept BTEC Nationals despite what students are told in schools about equivalency.

 

[OldBlueLady]

Matt, what I meant was that by diligent application and total commitment I took mine in 9 months, not because it was easy. There were plenty of people on the course who took nearer the alloted time. Ours was made up of 9 units, you were "taught" the main five in succession, working co-operatively as a tutorial group once a week and independently producing coursework and then the other four units were down to yourself. Each unit was signed off separately by your assessor and then periodically by the head of faculty or a more senior assessor. In my case a lot of it cross referenced, there WAS a tremendous amount of work involved and it was very thorough. An external assessor also came in once to ensure that standards are being met, he or she doesn't look at everyone's portfolio of work, but a representative few for each of the assessors on that course, mine was one of them.



Incidentally, just looked this up for you and Wiki says this:

• NVQ 1 = foundation GNVQ, three to four GCSEs at grades D-E, Business & Technology Education Council (BTEC) first certificate.
• NVQ 2 = five GCSEs at grades A*-C, BTEC first diploma.
• NVQ 3 = two or more A levels, BTEC Ordinary National Diploma (OND), City & Guilds Advanced Craft.
• NVQ 4 = BTEC Higher National Certificate (HNC) or Higher National Diploma (HND), or City & Guilds Full Technological Certificate / Diploma
• NVQ 5 =NQF 7-8

And this page might help also:

http://www.serc.ac.uk/courses/Pages/QualificationsGuide.aspx

Oh and by the way, a lot of kids these days are doing "OCR" exams, these are GCSE C grade equivalent!!!

She also takes a pop at schools (rightly IMO) for 'playing the game' in regard to the performance thresholds, entering students for 'easier' qualifications to improve their standing rather than helping students.

Indeed, this has been known for some time and is why league tables are not really reflective of a school's results.