Wembley - Just a day out?

[shrimperjon]

Thats a completely different scenario.

Swansea finishing 9th in the premiership is a massive achievement, us finishing 9th is a failure.

Id be interested to know how Brum fans feel winning the league cup and now languishing in the CCC.

They are now turning into an established Prem side able to spend milions of pounds on players so finishing 9th probably is about right. we are struggling to make ends meet and rely on loan players. I would say finishing 9th is an achievement this season the way things are going!!!!

 

[southend4ever]

In my opinion this is essential short term vision versus long term vision.

I am long term and that is why I want promotion so much more and will always care much more for promotion than JPT. We are talking JPT here not the FA Cup Final!! The poll is now in place so let's see how it goes.

I'd rather the generations beyond us have a club to support and a successful one at that. Winning the JPT doesn't really hold much weight in helping to improve us as a club.

Promotion!

 

[Jam_Man]

Look... I agree that as a fan you make the most of these days.

But look at the attendances that we and other clubs have had for this competition. That isn't coincedence. That shows you the value of this competition. As discussed on other threads - as soon as some prestige comes about then the fans come back but it wouldn't appear to me that all fans were smoking off the concept of winning the JPT at the start of the competition.

We can't control where we are - no. But my point is not to detract from the gloss of a Wembley final but more to debate how a Wembley Day out is more important than our league finish. I, 100%, believe that we should grasp the opportunity that has come our way and saviour the day but I like many others at the start of a season would always prioritise the league over the JPT because it is over many more games and it will go further to securing our future and playing a better standard of football.

Bradford 3rd round of the league cup. Attendance 4,178.

They didnt seem to value that cup much in the early rounds. Wonder if they value it a bit more closer to the final ?

 

[EastStandBlue]

Then what is the point of supporting a football club? I genuinely don't get it. Why waste all this time and money following the club up and down the country if not for chasing the one day that isn't **** out of 6,000 that are?

Putting aside the financial factor which none of us can control, does anyone on here really give a single solitary **** what division we're in? Sure, you've got the floating fans but whether we're playing Rochdale, Aston Villa, Sheffield United or Alfreton Town surely we'll all be at every match that we can be?

It just strikes me as weird that any football fan - especially a fan of a small club - wouldn't want to grast this rare opportunity with both hands. There's always another league game.

That just about sums it up for me.

Let's be honest with eachother here, supporting Southend United is not much better than a swift kick to the testes. When we're not trembling with fear because that last letter hitting the doormat might be a tax bill, we're bemoaning the fact that Drewe Broughton still exists. We're forced to travel to each and every northern outpost this country has every other week of the year to be charged £20 to watch desperately poor officials mediate between two desperately poor teams in a dilapidated stadium that could cave in at any moment, whilst contracting third degree frostbite and any one of a number of diseases that have been eradicated south of Watford. If you're here for the glory, then you're either lost or severely ****ing mistaken.

A trip to Wembley, however, validates all of that. It makes those jaunts worthwhile. I'd be delighted to see Drewe don the blue if he was walking out of the tunnel at Wembley whilst doing so. In the last decade I've seen us topple Manchester United, win the league and, without the hugely unlikely help of a Sheikh with deep pockets, play at the highest level possible for ourselves. The only thing left that we could possibly do is win at Wembley, and that's the chance being presented by this.

If you're dismissing that as a mere day out, then I strongly suspected you're here for the wrong reasons.

 

[Grayson]

In my opinion this is essential short term vision versus long term vision.

I am long term and that is why I want promotion so much more and will always care much more for promotion than JPT. We are talking JPT here not the FA Cup Final!! The poll is now in place so let's see how it goes.

I'd rather the generations beyond us have a club to support and a successful one at that. Winning the JPT doesn't really hold much weight in helping to improve us as a club.

Promotion!

If you believe being in L1 helps the long-term future of the club any more than L2, you must lack any appreciation of how a lower league club works.

The only good thing about L1 is you're more than 1 bad season away from dropping out of the Football League, which is where the serious danger lies.

Higher attendances = higher wage bill. RM allegedly puts in £100k per month. That won't change because we go up.

 

[Jam_Man]

They are now turning into an established Prem side able to spend milions of pounds on players so finishing 9th probably is about right. we are struggling to make ends meet and rely on loan players. I would say finishing 9th is an achievement this season the way things are going!!!!

No it isnt.

Saying Swansea will be happy finishing 9th in the league is not comparable to us finishing 9th.

We expect to finish in the play offs, they will be happy to survive in the league. 9th for them is an over achievement, 9th in League 2 for us an under achievement.

If we finish 9th and win the JPT come back here in May and see what state this board is in. It wont be a happy place.

 

[Norwichshrimper]

It will, it always does.

And yes some of those anti-Ron stay aways will conveniently forget their protest if we were in a league above. using Ron as a reason for not going is a very convenient excuse not to go and not be labelled disloyal. It may annoy you, but its just one of those things, every club sees a drop in attendance when they go down and an increase when they go up.

But let's not foget the last 2 occasions we went up, we had successful seasons in the higher league, explaining the increase in attendances. I think personally we'd get higher gates as a promotion chasing Div 4 team than a relegation fighting Div 3 team generally.

 

[Jam_Man]

But let's not foget the last 2 occasions we went up, we had successful seasons in the higher league, explaining the increase in attendances. I think personally we'd get higher gates as a promotion chasing Div 4 team than a relegation fighting Div 3 team generally.

We certainly did and I wouldnt expect gate of 7,000- 8,000 just because we were in the league above, but there would be an increase from this year.

Our gates when we got relegated from League One were higher than the last two years remember.

 

[southend4ever]

If you believe being in L1 helps the long-term future of the club any more than L2, you must lack any appreciation of how a lower league club works.

The only good thing about L1 is you're more than 1 bad season away from dropping out of the Football League, which is where the serious danger lies.

Higher attendances = higher wage bill. RM allegedly puts in £100k per month. That won't change because we go up.

Ahh, but you see I am not accepting us as a lower league club forever. It's nice to think that we will work our way up the leagues. L1 brings us a step closer to securing our future than L2 does. You can't jump 2 or 3 leagues overnight, can you?

I don't lack appreciation.

 

[Smiffy]

Give me regular league games against Orient, Col Ewe, Coventry, Sheff Utd, Wolves, Ipswich, Bolton, Birmingham, Charlton etc (all possibles of course) and a bit more of a general buzz on a weekly basis. Over a one off, one day glamour trip to Wembley.

 

[southend4ever]

Bradford 3rd round of the league cup. Attendance 4,178.

They didnt seem to value that cup much in the early rounds. Wonder if they value it a bit more closer to the final ?

Ye, happy with that example. That's true, the league cup isn't really valued either. But, what the league cup does bring is potential glamour ties against Premier League clubs or Clubs that still have a huge following such as Leeds.

 

[Ayrshire Blue]

Give me regular league games against Orient, Col Ewe, Coventry, Sheff Utd etc (all possibles of course) and a bit more of a general buzz on a weekly basis. Over a one off, one day glamour trip to Wembley.

This for me too.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see my side play at Wembley. But the most important thing is league football and I'm not sure I can bare a 4th season in League 2!!!

 

[dingleydangley]

In my opinion this is essential short term vision versus long term vision.

I am long term and that is why I want promotion so much more and will always care much more for promotion than JPT. We are talking JPT here not the FA Cup Final!! The poll is now in place so let's see how it goes.

I'd rather the generations beyond us have a club to support and a successful one at that. Winning the JPT doesn't really hold much weight in helping to improve us as a club.

Promotion!

That's all well and good, but what about the here and now? The first game that I attended, in 1975, was in the third division. Most of the intervening years have seen the club in the bottom divisions. There are no guarantees that we'll ever be anything other than a lower league club, so these glory days punctuate what is a fairly mundane and predictable existence (the club's, not mine or yours). It's a bit dramatic to suggest that playing our strongest team on Wednesday is going to be judgement day for our future. Actually, I'm not too bothered about future generations watching Southend, either. Surely, they'll be too busy flying rocket bikes and playing Martian-ball on the new colonies.

I'll have a lie down..........

 

[southend4ever]

This for me too.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see my side play at Wembley. But the most important thing is league football and I'm not sure I can bare a 4th season in League 2!!!

Exactly!! I fear we may be divided on this.

 

[Jam_Man]

Ye, happy with that example. That's true, the league cup isn't really valued either. But, what the league cup does bring is potential glamour ties against Premier League clubs or Clubs that still have a huge following such as Leeds.

Cups arent valued at all early on, its only when you get towards the finals anyone really pays any attention.

As you say for lower leagues the only real appeal in the big cups is getting a big draw against a big team (Bradfords miracle achievement aside), but all the earlier rounds are very poorly attended. The JPT is also poorly attended but now it is "semi-final" time we will get one of our biggest crowds of the year following a sub 4,000 attendance in the league, so it shows at this stage it means something.

 

[DTS]

If we got to the final of the JPT would like to win but I wont loose any sleep if we dont as I think we have done bloody well to get to where we did given the sides we have had to face.

Play offs are another kettle of fish. If we lost that I think I might end up crying.

 

[southend4ever]

That's all well and good, but what about the here and now? The first game that I attended, in 1975, was in the third division. Most of the intervening years have seen the club in the bottom divisions. There are no guarantees that we'll ever be anything other than a lower league club, so these glory days punctuate what is a fairly mundane and predictable existence (the club's, not mine or yours). It's a bit dramatic to suggest that playing our strongest team on Wednesday is going to be judgement day for our future. Actually, I'm not too bothered about future generations watching Southend, either. Surely, they'll be too busy flying rocket bikes and playing Martian-ball on the new colonies.

I'll have a lie down..........

Haha!

Decent point indeed.

But again, this has gone down the route of JPT Wembley Final or Promotion and I choose promotion to help us on our way in the right direction.

Being greedy, I'd have both.

As it stands we do actually have a chance for both and maybe even 2 appearances at Wembley so why this is getting quite so heated I don't know.

I'm hot :finger:

 

[Grayson]

Ahh, but you see I am not accepting us as a lower league club forever. It's nice to think that we will work our way up the leagues. L1 brings us a step closer to securing our future than L2 does. You can't jump 2 or 3 leagues overnight, can you?

I don't lack appreciation.

But in 107 years we have always been a lower league club. The chances are therefore that we will be for many years to come. Only 44 clubs can be in the top 2 divisions and there are probably 50-60 with stronger claims to stay in them than us.

That's the reality of supporting Southend United. We aren't big or very good. We go in the bad times and exist for the rare, great moments. If people argued promotion is better because the day we get promoted is an equally great day amongst the ****, I'd be more inclined to agree.

 

[southend4ever]

Cups arent valued at all early on, its only when you get towards the finals anyone really pays any attention.

As you say for lower leagues the only real appeal in the big cups is getting a big draw against a big team (Bradfords miracle achievement aside), but all the earlier rounds are very poorly attended. The JPT is also poorly attended but now it is "semi-final" time we will get one of our biggest crowds of the year following a sub 4,000 attendance in the league, so it shows at this stage it means something.

Which all in all to me shows that people would rather do well in the league and see us play better teams week in week out.

That said, I'd happily see Southend in the FA Cup Final and take another year at League 2. Because no doubt to get to the FA Cup final we would have been involved in giant killings, more local kids may end up supporting the team, we would be raking in a lot more money to help secure our short term future which could perhaps help bring in some better players to give promotion a really good go the following season.

Hindsight would be a wonderful superpower to possess.

 

[Cricko]

We have lanquished most of our lives in the bottom divisions and we generally potter about in those areas going from season to season without much success. To get to finals of whatever trophy brings a sense of reason to following this club that on the most part frustrates us as much as possible. I have no idea where we will be in a season or two's time so I am all for grabbing a day to remember.