Is the criticism of Brown harsh?

[A Century United]

You can't really blame Brown, he's barely been here long enough to know where they keep the teabags. The man to blame was sat two tables away from me in the Wembley Suite. The man who staked our reputation in a ludicrous gamble just two weeks before the cup final.

I was tempted to wander over and ask Ron if he thought it had all been worth it, but that would have been rude and *someone* round here has to have some manners. Besides, I was clattered.

It wasn't the fact he didn't know the players, it's the fact he chose so many players out of their natural positions when he hasn't even had time to evaluate them properly playing where they normally do, and started a cup tie with 8 defensive players on the field. As has been said above, he fought hard to take control of this Cup Final, he can't now avoid responsibility for the result.

Ron took a massive gamble, and it has blown up in his face. I don't know (I'd rather not, really, I am squeamish) the pressure he is under to take such a desperate decision but it was a stupid one, both from the timing, and the type of manager he has now brought in.

 

[amsemp]

Not sure it was too defensive, we conceded after 5 mins! It was disorganised though. Bilel isn't a CM, Straker isn't a winger and our strikers were too isolated.

But when you go 1-0 down after 5 minutes and you have a lineup consisting of 6 defenders and a holding midfielder against a really good side, it's always going to be a pretty impossible task to get back into the game?

 

[mrsblue]

Is it? We'd already conceded one goal from a corner and 3-0 would have been good night Vienna. I genuinely can't remember the last time we scored a breakaway goal from a corner. People's preoccupation with how many people you leave up at corners strikes me as a bit weird. The main thing is to defend it.

I just watched mohsni's 'quick free kick' after 3mins. Had to turn the highlights off after that. We get an attacking freekick during our first foray into their half and he tries that. Crewe go and get a corner from it and perfectly execute their training ground plan for their first corner. Yes Brown hasn't been here long, but Jeez, that really got me angry.

On that corner Crewe had 6 v 10 and any clearance from us would come straight back,They had 3 back marking 1 player so surely if we had left 3 up the park Alex would have kept 5 back thus allowing any clearance to be fought for.

We were chasing the game and looked losers from the 1st whistle so cannot understand such basic tactics.

 

[united we stand]

Before everyone gets carried away may I suggest you watch the highlights if you haven't already. On reflection the main difference between the two teams on the day was basically from two naïve errors by Mohsni.

and 95% of supporters did NOT want Moshni to start as CM, so Brown clearly got it wrong in playing him there - to me (and others) it was such as bad decision to be laughable , add that to Straker as left midfield . ---if you are going to play him, play him left back , or not at all.

Brown totally blew it for me, Obviously I want him to succeed, but yesterday he screwed up what for us was our big day, and at the moment I feel quite bitter about that. Even if we ahd got the 'luck' with the penalties and the offside goal , it still should not detract from the fact that his team selection was wrong

http://www.shrimperzone.com/vb/showthread.php?76670-Where-would-you-play-Bilel-on-the-big-day

 

[Earls Hall Blue]

Criticism of Brown is not harsh, he got it badly wrong yesterday.

Straker should have played LB, Reeves should have played LM, Lund should have played CM, Mohsni shouldn't have got anywhere near the 16. Also Britt's been hit n miss for a while now & Corr maybe deserved to start alongside Tomlin.

If Straker had had a poor game then we had options in Prosser to LB with Phillips on, or Barker to come on depending on what subs with a different starting XI. Leonard on the bench would have given us midfield options too. Tam would have had breathing space with Lund beside him, rather than spend most of his game worrying what Mohsni was going or not going to do next, totally wasted his abilities. You cant set up so defensively against Crewe & expect to win, you have to have some creativity.

I cant believe Brown has not taken advice off of Coughlan over the players but if he has he's not listening because I doubt very much Coughlan would suggest Mohsni to play CM. It's going to be an interesting summer as Brown looks to bring in his own players, but if he offers Mohsni another deal I for one will be royally pi55ed off.

The league ended for me with those three home games, Wembley was my ray of hope after the league disappointment & Brown naused it up.

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

Exactly. I didn't see the boards going into meltdown when Luggy played Mark Phillips as a DM that night.

That'll be because firstly that move was forced by injury and secondly Luggy realised that it wasn't working and changed things before we were 2-0 down. He also learnt his lesson and never repeated that experiment.

Brown had ample opportunity in that insipid display against Fleetwood to see that Mohsni should not be playing central midfield alongside Mkandawire yet he made the same mistake again.

He also had a near full squad available but chose 7 defenders and one midfielder. He then chose to finish the game with 4 centre forwards and two wingers. Is it any surprise that the team looked unbalanced?

 

[BILLERICAY BLUE]

That'll be because firstly that move was forced by injury and secondly Luggy realised that it wasn't working and changed things before we were 2-0 down. He also learnt his lesson and never repeated that experiment.

Brown had ample opportunity in that insipid display against Fleetwood to see that Mohsni should not be playing central midfield alongside Mkandawire yet he made the same mistake again.

He also had a near full squad available but chose 7 defenders and one midfielder. He then chose to finish the game with 4 centre forwards and two wingers. Is it any surprise that the team looked unbalanced?

He could have played any of Woodyard, Leonard or Spicer in midfield that night, so that doesn't wash. The only reason it was still 1-0 when he made the change was that Smith was in inspired form. We could not have complained if we'd been 5-0 down at HT

 

[amsemp]

Criticism of Brown is not harsh, he got it badly wrong yesterday.

Straker should have played LB, Reeves should have played LM, Lund should have played CM, Mohsni shouldn't have got anywhere near the 16. Also Britt's been hit n miss for a while now & Corr maybe deserved to start alongside Tomlin.

If Straker had had a poor game then we had options in Prosser to LB with Phillips on, or Barker to come on depending on what subs with a different starting XI. Leonard on the bench would have given us midfield options too. Tam would have had breathing space with Lund beside him, rather than spend most of his game worrying what Mohsni was going or not going to do next, totally wasted his abilities. You cant set up so defensively against Crewe & expect to win, you have to have some creativity.

I cant believe Brown has not taken advice off of Coughlan over the players but if he has he's not listening because I doubt very much Coughlan would suggest Mohsni to play CM. It's going to be an interesting summer as Brown looks to bring in his own players, but if he offers Mohsni another deal I for one will be royally pi55ed off.

The league ended for me with those three home games, Wembley was my ray of hope after the league disappointment & Brown naused it up.

100% agree with everything you have just said!

 

[mrsblue]

He could have played any of Woodyard, Leonard or Spicer in midfield that night, so that doesn't wash. The only reason it was still 1-0 when he made the change was that Smith was in inspired form. We could not have complained if we'd been 5-0 down at HT

Agreed it was men against boys,Smithy kept the scoring down whilst Crewe IMO could have scored more if required.

 

[Lenny1]

I hate to say it but the manager is a disgrace to his profession. He has also cheated all those wonderful supporters, (the faithful 5,000 I mean), by fielding a team not worthy of contesting a cup final. To deliberately select a player who has not kicked a ball in six weeks and is patently not match-fit, and to compound that by playing Straker in a wide left position just so that he can be moved back to replace Barker when he inevitably had to came off, is pre-meditated cheating. It is doubtful whether Reeves was 100% fit, if he was why did he not start? It is also doubtful that Phillips was match fit because if so he could have started at CB with Prosser (who had an excellent game, I thought), moving to LB. If a manager who presumably holds either an UEFA A Coaching Licence or better still a UEFA Pro-manager Coaching Licence does not recognise that Moshni is not good enough to play league football he should give up. Not only Mohnsni's ability as a player is called into question, but his temperament and discipline alone is enough to steer well clear of letting him loose in a Ryman League game let alone a prestigious Football League cup final. Worst of all, Brown really did'nt care - it was not his team - not his responsibilty, hence Coughlan leading the team out, so what did it matter to him? Well it mattered to us and it mattered to the likes of Phillips, Lund and Leonard all who had done enough to get the team to Wembley but had to watch the likes of players who should never have been selected under-perform on the club's biggest day for years. Well at least Southend United have now got some balance. A spiv to run the club and a spiv to run the team. Can't wait for next season to start if we still have a club. May even be lucky enough to get a proper chairman and a proper manager.

 

[Clinton Baptiste]

I doubt Lund will want to stay at the club now. Shame as he has shown a lot of promise and could perhaps have formed a decent partnership with Laird and Timlin next season. Well done Tango Man well done.

 

[Firestorm]

He is still unbeaten against League two opposition....

 

[C'mon you Shrimpers]

I don't buy all this 'he picked the wrong team' rhetoric. Whether he could have picked a better team for the job is a fair question but the team he did pick could easily have won that game. Nailed on pen not given, handball on the line stopping a goal, and Britt was inches offside with his 'goal'. Individual players made errors, often players everyone would have had in their team regardless (Clohessy, hurst, mak). I don't know if brown is the right man for the job or not, yet, but please let's give the guy a chance & not be on his back from day one.

We lost to a decent L1 team & with some big decisions going our way the result could have been very different.

Rob, you won't get far on this board with well written and argued sense. The big disappointment for me on a fantastic day out was the appalling catering at the national stadium. Nothing short of a national scandal.

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

He could have played any of Woodyard, Leonard or Spicer in midfield that night, so that doesn't wash. The only reason it was still 1-0 when he made the change was that Smith was in inspired form. We could not have complained if we'd been 5-0 down at HT

Woodyard had played his way out of the team the previous weekend when he'd been completely overrun again, whilst Laird had limped off early on. He picked Phillips for his defensive qualities to balance having to move the more attacking and less disciplined Timlin inside.

I agree Leonard would have been the better option, but he hadn't played that role before. Phillips was the more experienced player and the more defensively minded so Luggy presumably thought that he'd be the one to better adjust to playing a different role plus had the height for set pieces. It was a gamble that didn't work and Sturrock changed it at half-time and didn't repeat the mistake.

 

[C C Csiders]

Does anybody seriosly think that had Sturrock still been the manager yesterday he wouldn't also have selected Barker? FWIW I actually thought Barker had one of his better games yesterday.

 

[dannypav]

I , like many on here ( and at the match ) were frustrated at the team selection.
Not sure how much was Coughlin input or how much was Brown , but would hope that as he is now our Manager , then Brown would have selected the side.
I think he made a number of poor decisions yesterday.
Firstly , I think the Barker selection was based partly on sentiment as our Captain coming to the end of his career , and to me he clearly wasn't match fit.
I can only assume that Straker at LM was to help cover for Barker and to not leave him too exposed , so although I was not jumping for joy at this , I can understand his thinking to a certain extent.
What surprised me though was that Phillips had a poor ( or rusty ) game against Fleetwood and was then benched , but Brown thought that Barker could do a better job ?
The Mohsni selection was to me the one that affected us the most.
I am a Mohsni fan , but struggle to see where he fits in other than CB.
Certainly after the Fleetwood game , it was clear to everyone that he cannot play CM and think he even alluded to that himself in his pre-match comments.
I can only guess that Browns view is that there are not 11 better players than Mohsni at our club ( which I think is true ) , so he was desperate to put him in somewhere.
Sadly , a good player doesn't always make for a good team ( and that's nothing to to with his apparent lack of popularity etc ).

In conclusion , yes Brown has to take some criticism for yesterday , but my view is that yesterday meant very little to Brown in the longer scheme of things.
Lose as we did and he will get some criticism but many others saying "well it's too soon etc to get on his back".
Win , and it was always going to be 'Sturrocks team' for many , so not much in the positive column for Brown.

Brown will be judged on next season , not this one match , and when sentiment and emotion has gone , that is probably how it should be.
Or of course he may become Saint Brown of Southend if he wins his next 5 games !

 

[Onion_Bag_Dave]

We played wing backs yesterday. Those group of players haven't played that system!

 

[Smiffy]

We played wing backs yesterday. Those group of players haven't played that system!

That is the problem. The players have not got a ****ing clue on what Brown is trying to do. Not even sure he has to be honest. And to expect the players to go from one system to another overnight is not going to happen.

Direct football may not be pretty. But when it is played properly and all the players know what they are doing, it works incredibly well in this league. As Paul's side showed by the two long unbeaten streaks.

It's a complete **** up from Ron, another failed gamble. I am sure he was brought in to try and get us in the play-off's and win the trophy yesterday. One down and the chances of nicking 7th are remote to say the least.

Let's see how he does completely rebuilding a squad from scratch in the summer. With **** all money, countless embargo's and unsettled players...not to mention a desperate chairman. My judgement on him will remain until next season. But early indications don't look great...

If we don't start off well next season. He will feel the heat from the fans very quickly. Patience and morale is wearing very thin amongst the dwindling fan base. Good luck Phil. You will need it...

 

[Yorkshire Blue]

We played wing backs yesterday. Those group of players haven't played that system!

Oh, did we have a system yesterday?

Why didn't anyone tell the players?

 

[EastGreenNutter]

I will judge Brown on next season simple as.